I know. Been towed to my slip twice, but my engine woes didn't come close to what you're facing.
A story of the engine that could.... Then didn't…NOW DOES
- Thread starter jssailem
- Start date
- Oct 22, 2014
- 22,047
Saturday morning we showed up at the boat.
This "GET THE HEAD OFF" day.
Les jumped aboard ready to help free the Perkins from the boat.
Kept saying... Stand back John. I got this....
This "GET THE HEAD OFF" day.
Les jumped aboard ready to help free the Perkins from the boat.
Kept saying... Stand back John. I got this....
- Oct 22, 2014
- 22,047
There are a lot of nuts, screws and bolts holding this engine in place. Like a helicopter, a bunch of bolts and nuts floating in formation.
It can be done solo, unscrewing each one. I am convinced that It would have taken 3 times longer and likely many of the fasteners would have been lost to the depths of the bilge.
We started about 10:30 and were ready to seperate the head from the block about 45 minutes later.
We rigged a lever to lift the head vertically, the designer of the block and head never considered the head would be removed from a boat. With a strap around the boom - slung down the combanion way, we slipped a length of steel tubing through the sling and in above the engine head. There was about 18" of space above the head. We ran a rope diagonally from the aft end of the exhaust manifold to a lifting bracket forward on the head by the alternator.
With the pipe extended into the cabin, Les applied force while I seperated the head from the block and inserted wooden wedges. Les said a few choice words about the 4" studs in the engine block as we worked the head up and off the block. Once free we swung the head through the space opened in the bulkhead, into the cabin. As Les grabbed the head, I positioned a piece of plywood to set the head down.
This was a success.
Here is a look at the transmission end - the damper plate.
Looking into the block provided circumstantial evidence that there may have been water that entered cylinder 4 from the muffler.
Monday we have the mechanic who promises to rebuild the engine showing up to get the block off the boat.
It can be done solo, unscrewing each one. I am convinced that It would have taken 3 times longer and likely many of the fasteners would have been lost to the depths of the bilge.
We started about 10:30 and were ready to seperate the head from the block about 45 minutes later.
We rigged a lever to lift the head vertically, the designer of the block and head never considered the head would be removed from a boat. With a strap around the boom - slung down the combanion way, we slipped a length of steel tubing through the sling and in above the engine head. There was about 18" of space above the head. We ran a rope diagonally from the aft end of the exhaust manifold to a lifting bracket forward on the head by the alternator.
With the pipe extended into the cabin, Les applied force while I seperated the head from the block and inserted wooden wedges. Les said a few choice words about the 4" studs in the engine block as we worked the head up and off the block. Once free we swung the head through the space opened in the bulkhead, into the cabin. As Les grabbed the head, I positioned a piece of plywood to set the head down.
This was a success.
Here is a look at the transmission end - the damper plate.
Looking into the block provided circumstantial evidence that there may have been water that entered cylinder 4 from the muffler.
Monday we have the mechanic who promises to rebuild the engine showing up to get the block off the boat.
Attachments
- Oct 22, 2014
- 22,047
Some more images from the project.
Cabin works space. The second picture you can see where we opened a hole in the bulkhead.
These shots show the engine being disassembled to get at just the head.
The exhaust shows some salt accumulated in the opening. The valves all look normal, to me.
Here is an image looking down on the block just after we removed the head.
Cabin works space. The second picture you can see where we opened a hole in the bulkhead.
These shots show the engine being disassembled to get at just the head.
The exhaust shows some salt accumulated in the opening. The valves all look normal, to me.
Here is an image looking down on the block just after we removed the head.
So now that the head is off, is there any visual evidence of the cause of the lock-up? I presume that the crank still won't move; is that correct?
Playing detective a bit...
Note the one full piston and guessing the boat is listing by my Red Arrow direction.
Closer view..
Is that the Brake Fluid you promised me to add?
Funny that one piston did NOT drain.
Jim...
Note the one full piston and guessing the boat is listing by my Red Arrow direction.
Closer view..
Is that the Brake Fluid you promised me to add?
Funny that one piston did NOT drain.
Jim...
- Oct 22, 2014
- 22,047
Looking at the image, pistons are numbered from top to bottom of image 1,2,3,4 front to back of engine.
2, and 4 had the Marvel Mystery oil and brake fluid still In them. 1 & 3 drained. I used a oil pad to soak up the excess in 4. Then I could observe the rust on the side of the cylinder.
2, and 4 had the Marvel Mystery oil and brake fluid still In them. 1 & 3 drained. I used a oil pad to soak up the excess in 4. Then I could observe the rust on the side of the cylinder.
I would guess the rings on #1 and #3 are compressed are seized and no longer expand and contract to give a tight seal. Or the other way around the rings on #2 and #4 are seized in the expanded position. Not sure.
John I will buy you an adult beverage someday when we meet if you snap a picture of the valves, valve seat and the other side of the cylinder head.
Possible broken ring? Could cause the seizing too. Although if the engine turned over even a few times after the rings broke I'd expect to see scoring on the cylinder wall, which are not shown on the pictures. Also, kind of odd that it would occur simultaneously on two cylinders at the exact same time so probably not broken rings. Looked like a lot of carbon on the pistons which can lead to broken rings.
www.soonparts.com
Did you notice any blow-by into the crankcase over the last few hours running?
Once you get the block out and the rebuild starts you should know for sure what caused the seized engine. Hope everything goes as planned on the rebuild and you are out on the water sooner, rather than later.
Nine reasons why the engine piston ring is broken! | SOONPARTS.COM
Technical Support from WWW.SOONPARTS.COM,Please email Joey@soonparts.com Piston ring breakage is one of the common forms of damage to piston rings. Generally, the first and second-pass piston rings are easily broken, and the...
www.soonparts.com
Did you notice any blow-by into the crankcase over the last few hours running?
Once you get the block out and the rebuild starts you should know for sure what caused the seized engine. Hope everything goes as planned on the rebuild and you are out on the water sooner, rather than later.
Last edited:
- Oct 22, 2014
- 22,047
Will try to add additional photos later today.
Just want to assure those quisitive thinkers, that the engine seized during a controlled cranking. The engine was not running.
I cranked the engine using a starter button in the engine compartment to complete the bleeding of the high pressure pump. The injector fuel lines were loose and I was watching them as I pushed the starter to observe evidence of air bubbles and fuel.
A rotation occured, then everything stopped. Seized. The engine did not combust.
Mark, I was referred to the mechanic by the staff at Harbor Marine, the chandler here at the Everett Marina. They said he has 20 years of experience working on boats in the Puget Sound and North Sound area. I understand he services several of the Tugs in the area. His shop is located in Everett. If you are not regularlly having diesel service from a mechanic it is nye impossible to know who to call. If your are in constant contact with a mechanic then you have problems. Taking the engine apart as we have confirms my thoughts that while not extremely complex, you are better off identifying this problem, I face, in a shop where you can organize your parts and the tools needed are all readily available.
There is the persistent issue of the black hole bilge on the boat. A tool, bolt, nut, push rod etc.. if not carefully handled can slip out of your hand is gone. Not like the forgiving concrete floor of a shop. There is also no way to escape the black soot and oil of an old diesel engine. I think my prints on an FBI finger print card would be readable several feet away.
Having to scratch your nose or wipe sweat from your brow and remembering NOT to move your hand is a learned experience.
Just want to assure those quisitive thinkers, that the engine seized during a controlled cranking. The engine was not running.
I cranked the engine using a starter button in the engine compartment to complete the bleeding of the high pressure pump. The injector fuel lines were loose and I was watching them as I pushed the starter to observe evidence of air bubbles and fuel.
A rotation occured, then everything stopped. Seized. The engine did not combust.
Mark, I was referred to the mechanic by the staff at Harbor Marine, the chandler here at the Everett Marina. They said he has 20 years of experience working on boats in the Puget Sound and North Sound area. I understand he services several of the Tugs in the area. His shop is located in Everett. If you are not regularlly having diesel service from a mechanic it is nye impossible to know who to call. If your are in constant contact with a mechanic then you have problems. Taking the engine apart as we have confirms my thoughts that while not extremely complex, you are better off identifying this problem, I face, in a shop where you can organize your parts and the tools needed are all readily available.
There is the persistent issue of the black hole bilge on the boat. A tool, bolt, nut, push rod etc.. if not carefully handled can slip out of your hand is gone. Not like the forgiving concrete floor of a shop. There is also no way to escape the black soot and oil of an old diesel engine. I think my prints on an FBI finger print card would be readable several feet away.
Having to scratch your nose or wipe sweat from your brow and remembering NOT to move your hand is a learned experience.
'black hole bilge'. stuff a towel or two in it. and it can't eat your bits and pieces.
They were hopping to get the Engine out today, per John by phone.
_____
I told John to use a Rare Earth Magnet to go "fishing" for metal parts in there.
Jim...