Raymarine Wheel drive autopilot on Hunter boat- to upgrade?

[capt.amory]

Ah Raymarine Wheel Autopilot, where do I even begin....crying

I need the advice of other sailors especially Hunter owners.
In 2019 I installed a new Raymarine Wheel Auto pilot with ACU100 core pack computer, EV1 Sensor core compass, p70 control head. rated for 16000Lbs. displacement. my boat is 12,500lbs Net weight.

I had given up on the Wheel Autopilot. too many problems, mainly it never holds course in 15knots winds. interesting enough it works sailing/motoring up wind but never downwind. bottom line is not reliable for offshore sailing to cayman.

So I decided to install a Raymarine Mechanical Linear drive Type 1 buying is not the problem. installation the linear drive arm to the rudder post seems to be my problem. I can have access to the rudder post but the rudder post is enclosed in a fiberglass cast. See picture

Am wondering what do other Hunter boat owners do, can I cut through this fiberGlass casting & install the linear arm to the rudder post? what do you guys think?

 

[higgs]

Your Hunter does not have a quadrant? My linear drive is attached to the quadrant.

 

[Calif. Ted]

As Higgs points out, you want to attach to the Quadrant which I'd assume to be above the pictures, it's where the steering wires attach to the post. Not familiar with your boat, but on some there is a panel on the cockpit sole that must be removed for access.
And do not cut that, I think it may be necessary and it's not where you need to go anyway. Your looking for one of these.

 

[smokey73]

I believe the linear drives are designed to be attached to the Radial Drive or Quadrant, not the rudder shaft itself. I'm not sure how you would attach it to the shaft itself anyway.

 

[Rjm st.petersburg]

I have a 41DS, the rudder reference is under a floor panel in the cockpit. The drive is behind a ceiling panel in the aft cabin attached to the quadrant.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

Whatever you do, don’t cut the post housing. Your boat has to have a quadrant to which it should be attached.

 

[Terry Cox]

Different model boat here, but ours came with a linear drive autopilot motor that is connected to a dedicated tiller arm that is attached to the rudder post. You can connect the AP motor to your existing steering quadrant, however, most serious marine experts would recommend it be connected to a dedicated arm. Doing so has a number of advantages, among them the ability to steer the boat if your quadrant steering system fails.

As others have mentioned, before cutting into the FRP rudder post housing, seek advice from a marine surveyor on the merits.

 

[higgs]

Quadrants I have seen look more like this.

 

[DArcy]

It looks like the quadrant is under the panel behind the wheel. Open it up and see if there is room to add the arm you bought. If not, just get a fitting to attach the linear drive to the existing quadrant. I would not want to cut into the rudder post tube.

 

[Ken13559]

NO don't cut the rudder tube! You'll let in water and sink! On my h326, just below where i stand, behind the wheel is the rudder quadrant where I mount the rudder position sensor. Maybe the space there is big enough for the Drive Arm.

Ken Y

 

[kappykaplan]

I believe the linear drives are designed to be attached to the Radial Drive or Quadrant,

My type 1 linear drive is attached to a tiller attached to the rudder post, not the quadrant. Photo below.

 

[jssailem]

Depending on your boat build date your rudder shaft could be fiberglass or stainless steel.
Your picture shows the rudder tube not the rudder shaft. The tube serves to keep water outside the hull. You do not want to cut it.

The linear drive is more robust. It moves the rudder by pushing and pulling the rudder. Not all quadrants are designed (material used) to handle the continuous motion. The material can breakdown. You need to ask the quadrant maker if the quadrant can take the abuse. Most quadrant makers say no. Still boat owners attach their linear drive to the quadrant.

The tiller arm is attached to the rudder shaft. The method is to clamp the rudder shaft and additionally to put a pin through the rudder shaft. This will allow the linear drive to rotate the rudder through about a 120-130 degree arc. You want to be precise with the install. Know your rudder shaft material to get the best results

 

[smokey73]

My type 1 linear drive is attached to a tiller attached to the rudder post, not the quadrant. Photo below.
View attachment 204685

@kappykaplan I stand corrected. I see you have both a radial drive and a tiller arm which is apparently how Edson who I think makes your radial drive intend intended (radial drive is the gray thing with the wires on it that the wheel turns via cables). That is the setup that edson recommends (see the post below). I could not possibly install that on my Hunter 40.5 because I don't have any exposed rudder shaft below or above my radial drive to attach such a tiller arm. AH-HA moment That is probably why Hunter designed my 40.5 from the factory to accept a Rotary Drive that installs direcly inside the pedestal that turns the wheel shaft turning the radial drive using the wires. I wonder if all mid-sized Hunters with no clearance to attach a tiller arm are designed to accept a rotary drive from the get go?

See attached post below from 2009

Autopilot drive mounting question

The orthodoxy of below-decks autopilots is that the linear drive be connected to a separate tiller arm that is attached to the rudder post, and not to the existing radial drive. For those of you not familiar with this setup, I am referring to boat that have vertical rudder posts that are...

forums.sailboatowners.com

 

[kappykaplan]

I see you have both a radial drive and a tiller arm which is apparently how Edson who I think makes your radial drive intend intended (radial drive is the gray thing with the wires on it that the wheel turns via cables).

@smokey73 ,yes, I have an Edson steering system. When the install was done in 2013, I paid $350-$400 for the tiller.

 

[Johann]

Remove the sole under the helm seat to reveal the quadrant. There isn’t enough room to add another tiller arm. You should replace the quadrant with one designed to support an autopilot linear drive with an attachment point at the rear (Jefa?). Install the drive in either port or starboard lazzerette and drill a hole to connect the arm through to the quadrant.

Jefa Quadrants

 

[jviss]

Your Hunter does not have a quadrant? My linear drive is attached to the quadrant.

Generally not a good idea, see a million posts on this topic on this forum.

 

[jviss]

I believe the linear drives are designed to be attached to the Radial Drive or Quadrant, not the rudder shaft itself. I'm not sure how you would attach it to the shaft itself anyway.

That is completely incorrect, opposite of what's recommended by Edson and most marine professionals. Linear drives should be connected to separate tiller arms that are clamped to the rudder post. Edson specifically recommends against connecting linear drives to radial drives or quadrants. Call them and ask, their customer support is superb.

 

[smokey73]

That is completely incorrect, opposite of what's recommended by Edson and most marine professionals. Linear drives should be connected to separate tiller arms that are clamped to the rudder post. Edson specifically recommends against connecting linear drives to radial drives or quadrants. Call them and ask, their customer support is superb.

@jviss you are absolutely correct. After I did some research, including your post from 2009 I realized that attachment to the quadrant was not a good idea and that is why my Hunter 40.5 was designed to accept a rotary drive (there is not enough room to install a tiller arm above or below my radial drive). See my post #13 above.

I don't mind you making a point of it though in case somebody was not reading the entire thread and zoned in on my incorrect information. My main point was though that the linear drive/ram is not designed to be ATTACHED directly TO the shaft - I don't know how you would even do that. It needs the tiller arm or a quadrant or tiller arm SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED to take the loads from a linear drive.

 

[jviss]

It can be a challenge to install a linear drive on many sailboats. God bless those builders who provided mounts for these in production boats!

 

[smokey73]

It can be a challenge to install a linear drive on many sailboats. God bless those builders who provided mounts for these in production boats!

Mine won't allow the easy mount of a linear drive but they did provide for easy installaion of a rotary drive in the pedestal. I"d prefer the linear since it potenitally provides a means of steering without the wheel but you take what you can get. With the rotary drive you still rely on the wheel and wires so if those fail you are SOL with using the autopilot as a backup.