understand and pretty much agree Phil. Though I would think much of the materials, construction methods, and rigging procedures would be close to the same? I did mention that I don't know anything really about the 26M previously in this thread...prob should have mentioned it again.
macgregor 26
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To bad more people who often post very opinionated views of MacGregor boats don't realize the differences in the Classics (26S & 26D) vs. the powersailers ( X & M) as you have pointed out. If they did the quality of dialog would be much better while discussing the differences between them and especially the differences between the two Mac types vs. boats of other manufactures.
We have a 26S and love it and bought it over the D and the X for various reasons. It fits us very well, but I can certainly see where the X & M would fit a lot of people over the S or D or other manufactures boats.
We are retired and live a long ways from water. When we go out it is for multiple day trips usually multiple week trips. A lot of people are not retired and live by large bodies of water and I can see where the X and M would really appeal to them. They could put in on Saturday morning. Motor for an hour or two and escape the congestion around a harbor and head to a more secluded area. Sail for the day, stay in the boat over night (lots of room for 4 people), sail some more on Sunday and late in the afternoon motor back to the crowds and take out and be at work Monday morning.
There must be a lot of people in this situation as from what I understand they still can't make M's fast enough for the supply. If you have an X or M would you still get a satisfying sailing experience? I say for most people that have no intention of racing the answer would be yes. With our S that is suppose to be a better "pure" sailboat than an X or M we are usually on a lake by ourselves and haven't a clue if we are faster or slower than someone else. We just know that the motor isn't running, our sails are full and we are moving along and enjoying it.
If you are someone who won't be happy until you get the last 1/2 knot out of your boat and that you can point into the wind 10 degrees further then get something else and pay the slip fees or buy a big enough vehicle to haul your 4000-8000 lb. boat and forget an X or M. If you just want to get out on the water and relax with the wind taking you along do you really care if you are going 5 knots or 6 1/2 knots? Would you buy one car or another because one would go 2 mph faster if your goal was to just get from point A to B?
As I mentioned at the first of this rant we have an S and love it, but I wouldn't recommend one to anyone sailing with more than 2 people unless it was just for the day or the weekend or anyone other than the 2 were pretty small.
One last thing. If I was looking and reading comments from people who have never sailed in a particular boat or maybe even if they have I would throw out the comments that are extreme in one direction or the other. I've known people that have been really polarized about a product or service, usually in a very negative manner. Then you observe that they seem to find fault with everything. Go out to eat with them and they never tip because they always find something wrong with the food or waiter, they get a motel room and usually try and get their money back the next day since there was something screwed up with the room and worst of all they either take someone to court or they are threatening to do so.
Now saying that I've never sailed in an X or M, only looked at them, so disregard all my recommendations for or against them
.c ya,
Sum
Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID
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For the most part my comments were not meant as a counterpoint to biorapper. The original poster asked for opinions and experience with the MacGregor so I gave him mine.
So my comments only pertain to my experiences with that boat and Phil's point is well made.
However WRT one of biorapper's comments I thought I had previously noted that my wife and I were not new to trailerable sailboats. We'd had a West Wight Potter 19 for many years. We know how to setup a boat so it can be quickly rigged for sailing from the stowed for towing state and vice versa. We had all kinds of things setup to make this speedier and with respect to the 26M had reviewed several check lists posted by people to bring ourselves up to speed wrt differences between the Potter 19 and the 26M.
We also met some other people who had 26Ms. One day we even set ours up in the parking lot at Winter Island right next to someone who'd owned theirs for several years. We got ours done in about 1/2 the time he said it usually takes him.
So I don't have any reason to think our times were poor. Our times however are likely only applicable to the 2008 26M model we owned. There are differences between that model and other 26Ms as well as other MacGregor models that certainly could have an impact on setup times.
Jay H
BTW to those chiming in about the 26S, the original poster did ask specifically about the 26X or M and that's what I was addressing.
WRT to not being able to make Ms fast enough, I had heard that they drastically cut back on production of them. Don't know if that's true or not but it was a dealer who I was talking to in spring of this year about brokering mine who told me this.
ttfn
WRT to not being able to make Ms fast enough, I had heard that they drastically cut back on production of them. Don't know if that's true or not but it was a dealer who I was talking to in spring of this year about brokering mine who told me this.
ttfn
Dr Beer
I felt for you right through the long, drawn out ordeal, Dr Beer.
However, there are a lot more satisfied MacGregor customers than not. And your dealer, who is no longer an Authorized dealer, was definitely one of a kind. I cant help feeling that if you purchased it through a better dealer, you would still have your boat and be very satisfied with it.
I felt for you right through the long, drawn out ordeal, Dr Beer.
However, there are a lot more satisfied MacGregor customers than not. And your dealer, who is no longer an Authorized dealer, was definitely one of a kind. I cant help feeling that if you purchased it through a better dealer, you would still have your boat and be very satisfied with it.
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Your userid shows you as a guest user and doesn't have any info about your actual identity. I assume this is by design. Since I don't know who you are I'm not sure how you would even know who I might have purchased the boat from.
In settling the lawsuit with the dealer that sold me my boat I signed an agreement not to publicly mention their name. I did, however, reserve the right to discuss the boat's problems privately with prospective buyers. Perhaps you were one of those people and if so you are under no obligation to keep what we discussed confidential. I, however, can neither confirm nor deny your statement in this forum regarding who the dealer was.
I did just check the website of the dealer I purchased from. It still shows them listing themselves as an authorized dealer. Based on how they treated me I would hope you are correct and they are no longer authorized but if that's the case then they are incorrectly claiming they are.
I don't disagree that the circumstances under which the boat was delivered and the dealer's behavior significantly contributed to the negative impressions I had of the 26M.
Leaving aside the differences between the dealer who sold me my Edge (Russell's Marine in Maine) and the great support Hunter's customer service group has provided, after buying the Hunter 27E Edge I do stand by many of my opinions regarding the differences between the two.
The Edge is only 6 inches longer and 6 inches wider, but I find both the cockpit and cabin much roomier and easier to get around in. I've had 6 people on board the Edge and everyone was able to get up and move around both the cockpit and cabin with relative ease. If you had 6 people on the 26M they'd have to climb over one another to get into and out of the cabin, and do the airplane aisle shimmy inside the cabin to move about.
To me the manufacture of the Edge seems more solid and the finish on it much better than that on the 26M. There is no place on the boat, even in the unfinished holds behind the aft berth, where there are fiberglass shards sticking out upon which one might cut themselves as I did. The hull material is thicker and the fittings used are better quality.
I've been very pleased with how the Edge handles. I find that because of the extra weight it is easier to maneuver at low speeds on windy days into and out of the dock and comes about better on days with light wind. Also, even though it weighs more, I've gotten it going faster under sail than I ever had the 26M. I think the difference between the keel & daggerboard has a lot to do with that.
This isn't to say the Edge is a faster boat, that's an overly broad statement. Just that in my personal experience I've been able to get more out of it.
Although the two boats are in the same market segment in my mind they are not necessarily direct competitors. Even after doing an apples to apples comparison between the two boats configured almost identically (I made up a spread sheet) the Hunter Edge costs several thousand more.
In addition the extra weight changes certain considerations.
I found that compared to my West Wight Potter 19 the 26M was a lot more cumbersome to set up and take down. So after the 1st season I gave up on trailering the 26M for every use. However if you intend to do a lot of trailering then the lighter and slightly shorter 26M is probably a better choice than the longer and heavier Edge. I don't anticipate trailering my 27E more than once a year in addition to taking it to/from its summer mooring.
I'd also think that there is likely a difference between the two for operations under no ballast full power configurations. I have a 50HP and have gotten the Hunter up to 15mph with it without ballast. With (literally) the exact same engine I had the 26M up to around 20mph and might have been able to go a little faster. I personally wasn't comfortable with how it handled at those speeds as it felt to me like it was hard to keep centered on a course.
All things considered though I think that for me personally the Hunter is a better boat. I'm the type of consumer that knows that sometimes it's worth it to me to pay a little more for certain features on a boat, car, etc. I feel fairly certain that had it been available at the time I was first looking at a larger boat I'd have chosen the Hunter over the 26M.
There is so much variation in boats and what people want and need in them. I have found the Hunter Edge suits me better and would encourage people considering a Power Sailor to check it out along with the 26M and decide for themselves what works for them. If any people reading this in the Boston metro area are interested in checking one out I'd be happy to take them out on my Edge when sailing season comes back around.
Also, I do know that one person who lives locally and looked at my 26M but ended up buying one from someone else. He moors his boat in Salem. Maybe he'd be interested in a head to head sometime next summer
.Gotta run, it's still ski season where I live and the slopes are calling...
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Geez, DUDE, you are responding to a 3 month old post... check the header. You're a little late to the party.
FWIW, I was commenting on the 26x or m, not the d or s, models. The earlier d and s models were pretty decent trailerables. The x and m are completely different and not good sailboats.
I know it's late to reply, might not even be relevant now. Just a FWIW. I don't have a huge allegiance to the Mac although I do own and sail a 93 Mac 26s. I got interested in sailing in 2007 having been a power boater for 30+ years and never having sailed a day in my life. I researched for a year and found a 26s in summer 2008. Being a stubborn self taught fool all my life I am proceeding to teach my self to sail with lots to learn still. I've made many newbie mistakes and learned much by experience. This site has taught me many things also. My only comment would be is "get a boat and sail" it's freakin awesome!!! The 26's classic has been good to me. I also enjoy working on her in the off season, making my personal mod's. I'm sure there are many good boats out there. That's all I got to say about that.
We have a 88 Mac 26D. I had a O'Day 23 before and wanted one with more sleeping room and still fun to sail. The under cockpit bed is a real winner for us. I suggest you go to the Mac Owners form and read, after I did I found one and sailed it. It was only $5k with the trailer and all great sails, GPS, real head, real clean. Make a short list of boats, find them locally to you (many sailors are friendly) & go sailing, see if you like them, different types of boats feel differently. Don't get blinded by stuff on the boat, think about what you would want to live with for a while. Sail boats are easy to buy and hard to sell. Good luck and take your time. -- Jon
I own the 1993 Hunter 23.5,water ballasted,swing keel (14inchs keel up 5'6"down),and a very easy trailered boat. I tow with my explorer p/u 6cy over hills of NWArkansas no problems.
I have a friend who just sold his Mac 26.His old boat was nice but didnt have the room of mine even though it was a little longer. The H23.5 was hard to beat on down wind
reach.
Cost under 10k in excellant condition everywhere....check out this sweet fractional sloop
Your first mate well love the comforts of home in comparison to others of this size.
I have a friend who just sold his Mac 26.His old boat was nice but didnt have the room of mine even though it was a little longer. The H23.5 was hard to beat on down wind
reach.
Cost under 10k in excellant condition everywhere....check out this sweet fractional sloop
Your first mate well love the comforts of home in comparison to others of this size.
I don't know much about the 23.5 hunter...but find it difficult to accept that it has more room inside than a 26..is it because it is beamier?
As far as being hard to beat, I do know that I have passed many hunter 26's, on all points of sail, and have never been passed by one. Thus, I do beg to differ with your 23.5 being "hard to beat". Though I do lust after how nice the 26 hunter inside is! If your innards are similiar tis something to consider.
As far as being hard to beat, I do know that I have passed many hunter 26's, on all points of sail, and have never been passed by one. Thus, I do beg to differ with your 23.5 being "hard to beat". Though I do lust after how nice the 26 hunter inside is! If your innards are similiar tis something to consider.
The inside is large for a boat that size and appears roomier than the S and D, but doesn't have the separate head (at least I don't see one) and the sink area isn't as large. Still it is a very nice looking boat and reminds me of the X and M.
I think these boats are great for someone who wants to buy a boat and use it as is. One thing with the S and D if you are someone who likes to modify the insides to your particular needs I think they might be a better starting point. The Hunter and X and M are boats I would feel strange/bad about cutting up and redoing like I've done with our S.
Car guys run into the same thing. Finding a fully restored Model A one guy has no problem cutting it all up and making a hot rod out of it, me I would leave it original, but wouldn't be interested in owning it and driving around at 45 mph. I'd buy a rusted out Model A with no drive-train and make it into a hot rod. I have no problem cutting and drilling holes in our S, but would with the Hunter/X/M.
To each his own. For us if I had it to do all over again it would be another S. We love the combination or weight for trailering and size for livability. Most people like them for the huge aft berth, while for us it is mostly a storage area :cry:.
c ya,
Sum
Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID
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Sum- the head in the H 23.5 is under the starboard side ofthe Vberth-just on the other side of the half-height bulkhead from the table at top right in your first picture. The 23.5 is beamier, but most of the illusion of greater size is because of the openess (no partitions or screened-off head). If you check the drawings, there is no storage area (lazarette) in the stern, either. Looks like a real nice boat, but only for two people for any length of time. -Paul
I kind of figured the head was out there in the open (there is a curtain) and know that the enclosed head on the larger Macs is a selling point for some. Obviously ...............
....as anyone can see not a problem for us, but I can see where some people don't want to deal with a head out in the open.
We like the V-berth being pretty much separated from the rest of the cabin though. More walls mean more places for shelving and storage.
....and yes the lazarette, where would I put all of the stuff that we have in there. It is like a bottomless pit and will really hold a lot of stuff you wouldn't want in the cabin.
As I said before we don't regret getting the Mac one bit and we have looked at a lot of boats since buying it,
Sum
Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID
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"wana be" sailboats with BIG outboards.
Just because multiple manufacturers build boats that claim to be the "new edge" in tomorrows sailboat doesn't make them the answer to the question most don't ask. It is simply a classic case of "pluralistic ignorance".
Just because multiple manufacturers build boats that claim to be the "new edge" in tomorrows sailboat doesn't make them the answer to the question most don't ask. It is simply a classic case of "pluralistic ignorance".
What boat manufacture (car or anything else) is going to give you the impression that what they offer isn't the "new edge"?
There is a segment of boaters out there that are very happy with these '" wanna be" sailboats with BIG outboards' as you call them.
Is that hurting you or a problem? Are they criticizing your choice of a 'real sailboat'? Isn't there room on the water for all of us?
c ya and happy sailing,
Sum
Our Trips to Lake Powell, UT - Kootenay Lake, Canada - Priest Lake, ID
Our Mac Pages
Mac Links
Well, in the summer time my wife and I do a fair amount of several day cruising trips and have found that the elements are rarely in our favour. If it is not the tides or currents against us it is the wind blowing the wrong way or not blowing at all. So like most other sailboats out there we tend to motor a lot or motor sail. While the real sailboats are putting along at 5-6 knots with their engines going we are putting along at 10 knots with our so called big outboard going and that is only at 3000-4000 rpm, not WOT.
I wouldn't label a 50hp engine as big when there are 225hp outboards out there. In the outboard world a 50hp engine is small to medium at best and the under15hp engines are little egg beaters, BIG starts at 100HP.
I think the biggest thing the 26M and X do is open up so many more launching areas for people. I wish I could launch my boats in the minimum depths they can, and not have to back my trailer so far into a ramp. I think it is awesome how many places they can launch.
That said, I really like my boat, and I am happy that others love their boats too. Getting out on the water is what it's all about and if you are doing it and enjoying it, more power to you!
That said, I really like my boat, and I am happy that others love their boats too. Getting out on the water is what it's all about and if you are doing it and enjoying it, more power to you!
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