Got Questions? Ask Them Here.

[BobT]

I've had the same question. And last winter I left the batteries on board and the charging system in place. (A 65w panel with a Morningstar Duo controller feeding a pair of Walmart grp 27's for the mains and a single grp 27 for reserve. ) the charger feeds the batteries directly so the boat's DC system is off.
Water loss was minimal over the winter and the batteries were fully charged at all times. The controller seems to be doing the proper job of monitoring and maintaining the batteries.
This also meant that I had lights and a working stove for occasional visits and project puttering over the winter. Just hit the disconnect switch and we are back in action. This also avoided the contortions and inevitable busted knuckles of removing the batteries.
I'll do it again this year.
Can we get any engineering arguments not too?

 

[Maine Sail]

The biggest issue with solar in the winter is panels that becone occluded with snow/ice. Once this happens the parasitic loads go to work and due to the low temps battery voltage drops rapidly. If it drops enough when the panel is occluded the controller will not reboot into a low voltage. In Seattle or MD this is less of an issue than in the frozen North.

Put another way I have yet to see any properly charged then disconnected batteries ruined but have seen plenty that were left on-charge and unattended, destroyed....

 

[Triton 53]

Ask away!

We are going to re-do my stuffing box and cutlass bearing this winter
and I found your great post on the stuffing box! Did you do one on replacing
the cutlass? If so, where can I find it?

BTW thanks for all your helpful posts here and on other sites.

Thanks
Pete

 

[Renegade135]

The biggest issue with solar in the winter is panels that becone occluded with snow/ice. Once this happens the parasitic loads go to work and due to the low temps battery voltage drops rapidly. If it drops enough when the panel is occluded the controller will not reboot into a low voltage. In Seattle or MD this is less of an issue than in the frozen North.

Put another way I have yet to see any properly charged then disconnected batteries ruined but have seen plenty that were left on-charge and unattended, destroyed....

I was checking on the boat yesterday, a dark, gloomy day in Seattle. Battery charge was showing 13.6 volts. Water level unchanged since a month ago. Average winter temperature of batteries for a boat in saltwater, with batteries close to hull, is probably 45-50 degrees. The air gets colder, but the water is pretty steady at 50. I suppose I could add a switch, but I will continue to monitor water burn-off. My monitoring equipment is primitive, showning only voltage, but so far so good. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Rodd]

Engine Hour Meter-

My hour meter built into my tach gave up the ghost. Any recommendations as to brand or type of separate hour meter to install? They all seem to be quartz based. Is a cheapie from ebay as good as any?

Rodd

 

[Maine Sail]

Engine Hour Meter-

My hour meter built into my tach gave up the ghost. Any recommendations as to brand or type of separate hour meter to install? They all seem to be quartz based. Is a cheapie from ebay as good as any?

Rodd

Yep, they are all pretty much the same but do be careful with fleabay. Lots of Chinese garbage out there. Stick with Stewart Warner, Teleflex, Faria etc.... Best to wire it into the oil pressure / alarm system so if you accidentally leave the key on you are not getting incorrect readings. If your ignition alarms when the engine is off, but key is on, then just wire it to key-on...

 

[weekendrken]

Follow up Q?s on "true" Deep Cycle batteries

That's because I know of no manufacturer building true wet Deep Cycle 4D's. Many claim they are but most are not. WM claims their 4D's are dual purpose not deep cycle. The average 4D is 8.5" wide so even a group 24 won't fit across the box. Yo

RC,

Deka/East Penn 4D and 8D AGMs -- from your experience are they "true" deep cycle?

Are you saying that, mfgr literature may describe models as "deep cycle" but that, due to plate thickness, they are not (truth in advertising)?

Thanks,
Ken

 

[Maine Sail]

RC,

Deka/East Penn 4D and 8D AGMs -- from your experience are they "true" deep cycle?

Are you saying that, mfgr literature may describe models as "deep cycle" but that, due to plate thickness, they are not (truth in advertising)?

Thanks,
Ken

I will let Deka's own data speak for itself....

NOTE: Only ratings within a brand /manufacturer are useful. Cross brand cycle life data is useless because there is no industry standard for testing. Actually there is, but no one seems to want to use it. Most all of them are fantasy level data when applied to real world marine use. Only in-house manufacturer testing across their own batteries can be compared for guidelines.

Why? Because all battery manufacturers assume & recommend that you recharge to 100% SOC after each deep discharge. They expect this to be done immediately. The sad reality is with sailboats this does not always happen. We wind up using batteries that were never intended for partial state of charge operation in a PSOC environment which results in considerably less cycles than what the manufacturers "lab" data suggests could potentially happen.


Deka / East Penn Battery Data By Type:

-GEL Cycles to 50% = *1000 Cycles
-6V Flooded Golf Cart Batteries Cycled to 50% = *700-1000 Cycles
-12V Deep Cycle Flooded Cycled to 50% = *350 Cycles
-AGM Cycled to 50% = *300 Cycles (includes 4D & 8D)

*NOTE: These are not what you will see in the "real world" except for the possibility of GEL.....

That is not my data but Deka's own data across their own batteries.... As can clearly be seen;

*They rate their 12V DC wets at 50 more cycles than AGM.
*They rate their 6V DC wets at 400 - 700 more cycles than AGM
*They rate their GEL batteries at 700 more cycles than AGM...

Lifeline does make a "deep cycle" 4D or 8D but Deka does not, unless you consider 300 cycles "deep cycle". Beyond that AGM's are quite picky about proper use and charging. Done right, and for the right reasons, they are good batteries. Done wrong and for the wrong reasons they are a massive hole in your wallet.

For the life of me I do not understand why anyone would pay 2¢ for an 8D or 4D unless you were trying to start a massive diesel in a sport fishing yacht.. Even the big OTR truck manufacturers have moved to parallel group 31's and some battery makers, such as US Battery, have even stopped making them all together......

Scenes like this on OTR trucks are becoming the norm and 4D and 8D's once the norm here are a dying breed. This a bank of three Group 31 Odyssey TPPL AGM batteries.

In summary the term deep cycle has been bastardized in the industry and is basically a bunch of bovine dung when used to describe typical 4D, 8D, Group 24, 27 & 31 12V batteries.

 

[Pat]

Hi Maine Sail, thank you for taking questions....do you recommend actually putting
antifreeze in the thru hull or just leaving them open during the winter so there is no fluid to
freeze? Our property manager suggest just leaving them open....I have typically poured some antifreeze in them and left them closed if noting is hooked up. thanks for the reply.
Pat

 

[gettinthere]

My push button start switch seems to be getting balky. If I'm careful to push centered it starts; but an off center push gets nothing.
Time to replace the push button.
Anything I should consider?
Are these rubber covered switches all the same or do I need some expensive marine grade switch?

I dont think I need to change to a keyed switch. I have a shutoff on the panel below and the padlock on the door serves enough of a lockout to ky thinking.

What am I missing?

Thnx

 

[weinie]

Maine,
I will be leaving the dock and mooring for the first time next season with a new to me 35 foot boat. I have read several of your posts and articles on the subject on various sites regarding mooring pendants along with other articles on the subject.
My thinking is that two 3/4 inch pendants of 20 feet each should do the trick. Am I correct with this assumption?
Also, it seems that there are many polyester covered nylon pendants from New England, Yale, Hamilton, etc? Are there any advantages to any particular brand?

 

[Maine Sail]

Hi Maine Sail, thank you for taking questions....do you recommend actually putting
antifreeze in the thru hull or just leaving them open during the winter so there is no fluid to
freeze? Our property manager suggest just leaving them open....I have typically poured some antifreeze in them and left them closed if noting is hooked up. thanks for the reply.
Pat

In water storage or out of the water on the hard?

 

[Maine Sail]

My push button start switch seems to be getting balky. If I'm careful to push centered it starts; but an off center push gets nothing.
Time to replace the push button.
Anything I should consider?
Are these rubber covered switches all the same or do I need some expensive marine grade switch?

I dont think I need to change to a keyed switch. I have a shutoff on the panel below and the padlock on the door serves enough of a lockout to ky thinking.

What am I missing?

Thnx

Cole Hersee M-626 is all you need...

 

[Maine Sail]

Maine,
I will be leaving the dock and mooring for the first time next season with a new to me 35 foot boat. I have read several of your posts and articles on the subject on various sites regarding mooring pendants along with other articles on the subject.
My thinking is that two 3/4 inch pendants of 20 feet each should do the trick. Am I correct with this assumption?
Also, it seems that there are many polyester covered nylon pendants from New England, Yale, Hamilton, etc? Are there any advantages to any particular brand?

I prefer dual unequal length pendants so one 20' and one 16-18'.... They must be well laced together to about 10' from the ball with floats. For storms I use Chafe-Pro sleeving and an additional 1" Dynema storm pendant.

Yale Polydyne pendants are the best factory made pendants going. The Yale brothers are members of our club and conduct a lot of field testing in our mooring field. Yale Polydyne pendants are by far the most tested, most proven and best made mooring pendants you will find. They are copied but never duplicated....

 

[weinie]

I prefer dual unequal length pendants so one 20' and one 16-18'.... They must be well laced together to about 10' from the ball with floats. For storms I use Chafe-Pro sleeving and an additional 1" Dynema storm pendant.

Yale Polydyne pendants are the best factory made pendants going. The Yale brothers are members of our club and conduct a lot of field testing in our mooring field. Yale Polydyne pendants are by far the most tested, most proven and best made mooring pendants you will find. They are copied but never duplicated....

I'm not familiar with lacing. Can you tell me more about how it's done?

In your opinion, do you feel 3/4" is sufficient? I am 45 minutes from the boat, so aside from large storms with predicted paths, I might not be able to get to the boat in time to add heavier lines.

Also, does one need to secure the loops around the cleats somehow? The skipper whose boat I race on usually ties the line of the pickup stick around the cleat.

 

[gettinthere]

Cole Hersee M-626 is all you need...

Mucho gracias senior

 

[weekendrken]

Mucho gracias senior

Due to the "pull-in" amperage of the solenoid, you need one that has a hefty current rating like the Cole-Hersee. If you want a shorter one, another option
RadioShack catalog #: 55050586
http://www.radioshack.com/nte-54-576-pushbutton-off-on*-momentary-spst-switch/55050586.html

This is the direct replacement for the push button switch on Westerbeke panels - also a short switch.
http://www.marinepartssource.com/newdetails.asp?pnumber=MMDW411783

 

[weinie]

I'm not familiar with lacing. Can you tell me more about how it's done?

In your opinion, do you feel 3/4" is sufficient? I am 45 minutes from the boat, so aside from large storms with predicted paths, I might not be able to get to the boat in time to add heavier lines.

Also, does one need to secure the loops around the cleats somehow? The skipper whose boat I race on usually ties the line of the pickup stick around the cleat.

bump

 

[Maine Sail]

I'm not familiar with lacing. Can you tell me more about how it's done?

In your opinion, do you feel 3/4" is sufficient? I am 45 minutes from the boat, so aside from large storms with predicted paths, I might not be able to get to the boat in time to add heavier lines.

Also, does one need to secure the loops around the cleats somehow? The skipper whose boat I race on usually ties the line of the pickup stick around the cleat.

Can you post this in the general Musings forum.. I think it deserves more than to be stuck in this thread...

 

[TENACITY CS36T]

Hello RC, On a Westerbeke 30, is there a maintenance procedure for cleaning the air silencer? And have you ever run sea foam either as a tank additive to diesel or a hot load thru the fuel filter, any recommendations on this. Seems to be a lot of conflicting views on this.