Best sailing autopilot?

[Phil]

I think the days of the conventional wind vane only, are nearly over, but for a few boats running very low on power and doing lots of miles. I know more and more boats especially those with wheels in the center of the cockpits, whom have removed the wheel and it sits near by, but out of the way, many others who never use the wheel. In my own case i probably manually steer on average 10 to 20%. I used to enjoy actually steering, holding a course anticipating the next puff, creeping upwind to get around that point. Now days I more enjoy setting the autopilot, and making small sail trim adjustments and adding or subtracting 1 or 2 degrees to the autopilot, often resulting in another 0.5 to 1knot and sundowners starting earlier. As soon as the anchor is up auto Pilot is on, if fact sometimes even before hand and a wind vain wont help with Set, wind variations, or if you want to creep upwind. Tacking in lay lines, or just ducking downstairs for a pee I wouldn't be without, nor would I have vain.

Sorry, but I completely disagree with "he days of the conventional wind vane only, are nearly over...". Plenty of sailors I talk to in the SF Bay area and Hawaii love their wind vanes and like my boat they are not low on power. They just value the simplicity and reliability of the conventional wind vane. They also love how using one makes you a better sailor in many ways. Our Monitor did > 95% of the helm duty during a crossing from San Francisco to Oahu and it did an incredible job.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1009195636404382

 

[Screen Saver]

No apology needed. To each there own and yep often the more traditional solution certainly has benefits of simplicity which as you rightly suggest is important. Yours seems on all counts to be doing a great job, although a little more complex to engage by the look of it. I would not want to be setting that up just to have pee for example, or to make a coffee.

It would be interesting to know of those whom have windvane or electronic auto pilots how many would prefer to change to conventional wind vane or remain (excluding concerns about cluttering up the stern) or remain with Auto Polits (excluding power consumption concerns)

Perhaps I am dreaming but I would like to think a wager over a beer as the sun sets would see me with many free beers
PS Nice sailing video, looked good.

 

[Benny Mike]

Take a look at the Hydrovane. Hydrovane truly is an independent self steering system, using its own rudder in order to steer. The Hydrovane can also be put in a mode where you attach an emergency tiller handle and acts as an emergency rudder.

I was not a proponent of this type of self steering until I bought a boat with one. Hydrovane is a very popular unit amongst cruisers.

 

[Phil]

No apology needed. To each there own and yep often the more traditional solution certainly has benefits of simplicity which as you rightly suggest is important. Yours seems on all counts to be doing a great job, although a little more complex to engage by the look of it. I would not want to be setting that up just to have pee for example, or to make a coffee.

It would be interesting to know of those whom have windvane or electronic auto pilots how many would prefer to change to conventional wind vane or remain (excluding concerns about cluttering up the stern) or remain with Auto Polits (excluding power consumption concerns)

Perhaps I am dreaming but I would like to think a wager over a beer as the sun sets would see me with many free beers
PS Nice sailing video, looked good.

I've used several wind vanes over the years (Monitor on my boat and others on friends' boats). They are all surprisingly easy to setup and engage. Point the boat where you want to go relative to the wind, trim the sails accordingly, point the leading edge of the air vane into the apparent wind, engage the control lines is all it takes with the Monitor. 30 seconds at most for the wind vane part.

One great thing about the Monitor on the stern - it doubles as an emergency boarding ladder that you don't have to struggle to deploy in rough conditions.

 

[Phil]

Take a look at the Hydrovane. Hydrovane truly is an independent self steering system, using its own rudder in order to steer. The Hydrovane can also be put in a mode where you attach an emergency tiller handle and acts as an emergency rudder.

I was not a proponent of this type of self steering until I bought a boat with one. Hydrovane is a very popular unit amongst cruisers.

The Hydrovane is incredible. I've used them on a few friends' boats. I went with the Monitor on my boat for a few reasons: 1. Doubles as an emergency boarding ladder. 2. Servo pendulum approach uses the boat's rudder for steering rather than the wind vane's rudder as a trim steering unit - steering loads still go into the boat's rudder rather than into the mounting interface of the wind vane / boat. 3. I already had a lot of experience with the Monitor, knew how to use it well, and felt slightly more comfortable with it. Yeah..the Hydrovane does have some advantages. It was a tough choice.

 

[jssailem]

You can buy an emergency rudder that fits on the Monitor wind vane from Monitor. It will get you back into port should your rudder fail or be destroyed by an Orca attack.

MSN

www.msn.com

 

[thinwater]

That's easy... its the one you own.

No, it is the one you want.

 

[Screen Saver]

So apart from power consumption what is it you see as a benifit above the electronic AP... Yes I heard the bit about the emergency rudder.

How do they work down wind, or in a sea state on the back quarter where the boat is yawing

 

[Tally Ho]

So apart from power consumption what is it you see as a benifit above the electronic AP... Yes I heard the bit about the emergency rudder.

How do they work down wind, or in a sea state on the back quarter where the boat is yawing

For me, the electric AP is quick and simple to engage.

Would I like to have a wind vane, yes, but for short sails, flipping the clutch lever and hitting “Auto”n my Raymarine AP is just too convenient.

Setting up a wind vane takes some time and practice and certainly takes a lot longer than my Raymarine electronic AP.


Greg

 

[Maine Sail]

The best DC AP is the one that is installed and then set up correctly. An AP also works best when the sails are well trimmed and the helm is nicely balanced before you engage it. I have installed them all and they’re all very similar 90% of it is in the installation calibration & set up and of course knowing how to sail your boat..

 

[JBP-PA]

So apart from power consumption what is it you see as a benifit above the electronic AP... Yes I heard the bit about the emergency rudder.

How do they work down wind, or in a sea state on the back quarter where the boat is yawing

-They are quiet. The wheeeee-whirrrrr of an auto pilot drives me nuts.
-They are maintainable and repairable with common tools. Most people cannot repair electronics.
- It is easier to predict failure beforehand because you can see it. Electronics tends to spew their magic blue smoke without warning.

That said, I agree with your point, as discouraging as it is. Electric power is no longer an issue on most boats what with solar and all. Electronics are becoming more reliable and very cheap, I can carry several spare autopilots on my boat for the cost of one good wind vane. Many people have lost the skill to do mechanical repairs, especially "inventive" repairs at sea. Autopilot can steer in many conditions a wind vane can't. I suspect if you could count the number of AP vs vanes over the last 20 years, you'd see a definite trend

 

[Phil]

-They are quiet. The wheeeee-whirrrrr of an auto pilot drives me nuts.
-They are maintainable and repairable with common tools. Most people cannot repair electronics.
- It is easier to predict failure beforehand because you can see it. Electronics tends to spew their magic blue smoke without warning.

That said, I agree with your point, as discouraging as it is. Electric power is no longer an issue on most boats what with solar and all. Electronics are becoming more reliable and very cheap, I can carry several spare autopilots on my boat for the cost of one good wind vane. Many people have lost the skill to do mechanical repairs, especially "inventive" repairs at sea. Autopilot can steer in many conditions a wind vane can't. I suspect if you could count the number of AP vs vanes over the last 20 years, you'd see a definite trend

I've used a Monitor in many wind conditions, sea states, and points of sail. The only condition where it doesn't work well is very light winds...less than 5 knots. Down wind isn't a problem. Following seas with a competing side swell isn't a problem. The key is to trim your sails properly for the conditions and point of sail. You have to do the same with an auto pilot.

 

[JBP-PA]

I've used a Monitor in many wind conditions, sea states, and points of sail. The only condition where it doesn't work well is very light winds...less than 5 knots. Down wind isn't a problem. Following seas with a competing side swell isn't a problem. The key is to trim your sails properly for the conditions and point of sail. You have to do the same with an auto pilot.

Or motoring.

 

[jviss]

The wheeeee-whirrrrr of an auto pilot drives me nuts.

That's funny. Mine is a below decks setup, and it's silent. Maybe you're referring to wheel pilots? Even that, mine was pretty quiet when I had one.

 

[Screen Saver]

Yes mine you cannot hear either. Touch wood it has never yet failed either. I would need to change the way I do things without AP, especially when I'm solo. I am often adjusting my course a few degress for all sorts of reasons to get around a point marker better wind angle and or wind changes due to the land, ships, etc. I have also used it in some extreme conditions, auto tacking, holding the vessel in extreme current, holding the boat into the wind while I furl the main etc. I think the simplicity of the vain and the fact that its mechanical hence can be repaired is probably the only plus side for me and I would be much more nervus being goosewinged on a vain.

 

[dLj]

For me, the electric AP is quick and simple to engage.

Would I like to have a wind vane, yes, but for short sails, flipping the clutch lever and hitting “Auto”n my Raymarine AP is just too convenient.

Setting up a wind vane takes some time and practice and certainly takes a lot longer than my Raymarine electronic AP.


Greg

I've used a couple different wind vanes. The Hydrovane is as simple to engage as an autopilot. The servo-pendulum types, not the case.

But with the Hydrovane, you just adjust your vane, flip the lever and you are done - . Balancing sails and all the rest are the same with all AP's, wind or otherwise.

dj

 

[colemj]

-They are quiet. The wheeeee-whirrrrr of an auto pilot drives me nuts.

That said, I agree with your point, as discouraging as it is. Electric power is no longer an issue on most boats what with solar and all. Electronics are becoming more reliable and very cheap, I can carry several spare autopilots on my boat for the cost of one good wind vane. Many people have lost the skill to do mechanical repairs, especially "inventive" repairs at sea. Autopilot can steer in many conditions a wind vane can't. I suspect if you could count the number of AP vs vanes over the last 20 years, you'd see a definite trend

We sleep directly over our AP drive and can't hear it at all.

In addition to your listed reasons, I think one big reasons windvanes are out of favor is because they interfere with the stern of the boat. Most newer boats that people buy have very useful and convenient sugar scoops that become less useful and inconvenient with steering gear mounted on them. When presented with this, along with the reasons you list, it is a no-brainer to skip a windvane.

Mark

 

[colemj]

As for reliability, Mainesail has it correct with installation being 90%. I'd say 99%. Our 1998 B&G AP worked without incident for 13yrs before a lightning strike took it out. Its replacement is still going strong 12yrs later. Our current boat had a 14yo and a 25yo Autohelm AP's that worked fine until I took them out for upgrade purposes. AFAIK, they are still working fine on the boats I gave them to.

Almost all of the boats I've seen with AP issues had drive unit installation problems. Either that was the direct problem, or it led to other issues with the electrical or electronic parts. This is the most important part of an installation, and cannot be underestimated how rugged this needs to be.

Outside this, failures with new AP's seem to either happen quickly, or fine for good. Failures with old AP's tend to be displays and buttons and water ingress over many years.

Mark

 

[baycloud]

I know that you're probably not going to go this way...and for most maybe they shouldn't - but i have to put in a good word for pypilot. $100 or so for the computer, then you'd need the ram and pump. so maybe $1600 total?

Used it for a downwind coastal delivery 700 miles and it drove us on rails, about as perfect as you can get. It has a compass and all the gyros to sense rock and tilt built in. Far less refined UI, but likely far more tunable than any other autopilot. Can connect to wind etc.

It's open source. Not for everyone. I kept my old crappy autohelm 4000 as a backup but it steered like a drunk fish in comparison.

 

[baycloud]

That's funny. Mine is a below decks setup, and it's silent. Maybe you're referring to wheel pilots? Even that, mine was pretty quiet when I had one.

my hydraulic pump drives me nuts doing passages. what type of pump do you have?