Raymarine Wheel drive autopilot on Hunter boat- to upgrade?

[jviss]

Yea, I noticed that in an earlier post. Understand that you take what you can get! It's not so bad, but of course, you should keep an eye on your steering gear, lube it, and so on.

I was very fortunate that my previous owner had a proper tiller arm and linear drive installed, and that there was room to do it! Too bad all builders don't provide for this.

 

[DArcy]

I have a rotary drive that would allow the AP to drive the boat with no wheel, cables or chain. The drive unit is removed in this picture, it's a chain drive, same kind of chain as you see on a wheel. Not something you could fit under a cockpit panel in Hunter 336 though.

 

[smokey73]

I have a rotary drive that would allow the AP to drive the boat with no wheel, cables or chain. The drive unit is removed in this picture, it's a chain drive, same kind of chain as you see on a wheel. Not something you could fit under a cockpit panel in Hunter 336 though.

Wow, thats a cool rotary drive but something that I'm pretty sure is unique. Not easily adapted to other boats and probably pretty expensive compared to a linear drive. Cool none-the-less.

 

[higgs]

Generally not a good idea, see a million posts on this topic on this forum.

That is how the boat came to me 17 years ago and I have gone through hell and high water with the setup.

 

[jviss]

That is how the boat came to me 17 years ago and I have gone through hell and high water with the setup.

That's good, but it doesn't make it a good idea, in any event. There must be a reason that the maker of the most common quadrant out there recommends against this.

What make is your steering system?

 

[smokey73]

I think it is really important to consider the material used in manufacture of the quadrant. The radial drives made by Edson that many of us have on our boats (at least from the 1990s) on appear to be made of cast aluminum and are essentially pretty thin "plates." In fact, when mine was off my boat to replace the rudder I was afraid of dropping it after I saw how thin it is and how it sounded like you struck a dinner plate when you set it down on concrete. I am sure it is engineered for the forces applied in the design application. It is very beefy where you clamp it to the shaft and a little thicker where the steering cables run in the grooves around the circumference. I'd be worried about "point loading" a high stress inducing component like a linear drive. As an Ngneer we typically design in a "factor of safety." You can probably lift a 2000 pound load with a nylon sling rated at 1000 lbs (based on the safety factors in sling design) but should you? As @jviss said just because it works doesn't mean its within the design loads for the component.

 

[capt.amory]

Your Hunter does not have a quadrant? My linear drive is attached to the quadrant.

I thought of that already, I was told to buy an Edson tiller arm to connect Autopilot mechanical to the quadrant. I wrote Edson (they made the quadrant for me) here is their answer
questions for you:
Do you have the AP mechanical arm attached directly to the quadrant? is it Bronze of Aluminum?

Your Hunter does not have a quadrant? My linear drive is attached to the quadrant.

 

[capt.amory]

As Higgs points out, you want to attach to the Quadrant which I'd assume to be above the pictures, it's where the steering wires attach to the post. Not familiar with your boat, but on some there is a panel on the cockpit sole that must be removed for access.
And do not cut that, I think it may be necessary and it's not where you need to go anyway. Your looking for one of these.
View attachment 204677

that's rite, I have an Edson Radial quadrant drive, it is in the location you described.
to attach the AP Linear arm to the quadrant, I was told to buy an Edson tiller arm to connect Autopilot mechanical to the quadrant. I wrote Edson (they made the quadrant for me) here is their answer

 

[capt.amory]

I believe the linear drives are designed to be attached to the Radial Drive or Quadrant, not the rudder shaft itself. I'm not sure how you would attach it to the shaft itself anyway.

I thought as well of attaching the AP mechanical arm directly to the Quadrant but I was advised against that by Edson, the makers of the Aluminum quadrant. see picture. The suggestions are to attach the AP arm to the rudder post by means of using a tiller arm

 

[capt.amory]

I have a 41DS, the rudder reference is under a floor panel in the cockpit. The drive is behind a ceiling panel in the aft cabin attached to the quadrant.

So you have your drive arm attached directly to the Quadrant? what make is the Quadrant? Have you tried sailing it in offshore passages, big seas & 20+ winds? am curious how do you use it?

 

[capt.amory]

Whatever you do, don’t cut the post housing. Your boat has to have a quadrant to which it should be attached.

thanks mate, I won't cut the housing yet. see my other answers pertaining to connecting drive arm to Quadrant directly?

Do you have or had you had a Hunter sailboat with the same Quadrant type? what did you use for AP?

 

[capt.amory]

W

My type 1 linear drive is attached to a tiller attached to the rudder post, not the quadrant. Photo below.
View attachment 204685

WOW...sweet setup man, that's like a juicy dream for me. so am trying to have the same setup as you, with the Bronze Edson tiller arm (you have), the problem is I can't access the bare rudder post. see my previous

 

[kappykaplan]

the problem is I can't access the bare rudder post

Sorry, @capt.amory

 

[capt.amory]

It looks like the quadrant is under the panel behind the wheel. Open it up and see if there is room to add the arm you bought. If not, just get a fitting to attach the linear drive to the existing quadrant. I would not want to cut into the rudder post tube.

I have the same boat 336 do you have an auto pilot system? and what do you have?

 

[capt.amory]

Remove the sole under the helm seat to reveal the quadrant. There isn’t enough room to add another tiller arm. You should replace the quadrant with one designed to support an autopilot linear drive with an attachment point at the rear (Jefa?). Install the drive in either port or starboard lazzerette and drill a hole to connect the arm through to the quadrant.

Jefa Quadrants

that is a great suggestion I only know about Edson Quadrant Edson calls them Radial drive unit The one they make they suggested I dont connect AP arm directly to the Quadrant.

Do you have a Jefa Quadrant? and what do you think of it

 

[capt.amory]

I think it is really important to consider the material used in manufacture of the quadrant. The radial drives made by Edson that many of us have on our boats (at least from the 1990s) on appear to be made of cast aluminum and are essentially pretty thin "plates." In fact, when mine was off my boat to replace the rudder I was afraid of dropping it after I saw how thin it is and how it sounded like you struck a dinner plate when you set it down on concrete. I am sure it is engineered for the forces applied in the design application. It is very beefy where you clamp it to the shaft and a little thicker where the steering cables run in the grooves around the circumference. I'd be worried about "point loading" a high stress inducing component like a linear drive. As an Ngneer we typically design in a "factor of safety." You can probably lift a 2000 pound load with a nylon sling rated at 1000 lbs (based on the safety factors in sling design) but should you? As @jviss said just because it works doesn't mean its within the design loads for the component.

That makes sense what you wrote about the Edson Quadrant, I asked Edson & they dont suggest to connect AP arm directly to their Quadrant which they make in cast Aluminum & Bronze.
What do you think of Jefa Quadrants

 

[Tally Ho]

That makes sense what you wrote about the Edson Quadrant, I asked Edson & they dont suggest to connect AP arm directly to their Quadrant which they make in cast Aluminum & Bronze.
What do you think of Jefa Quadrants

It looks like a replacement quadrant, made with the auto pilot connection point would be the way to go.

You don’t have room for a separate tiller arm, and Edson doesn’t recommend attaching directly to their quadrant…

Greg

 

[higgs]

That's good, but it doesn't make it a good idea, in any event. There must be a reason that the maker of the most common quadrant out there recommends against this.

What make is your steering system?

It is a Taiwanese built boat. I have no idea who make the steering system.

 

[Johann]

that is a great suggestion I only know about Edson Quadrant Edson calls them Radial drive unit The one they make they suggested I dont connect AP arm directly to the Quadrant.

Do you have a Jefa Quadrant? and what do you think of it

No, this is what I did before I found the Jefa quadrants. This is T6061 I had made. I think it distributes the load and worked well for the years I had the 336. But I’d get the Jefa if I did it again.

 

[Johann]

Also, I used the Octopus RS drive, which has less than 2/3 the peak force of the Raymarine type 1 linear drive, and I think more “give”.

Type RS Sailboat Drives

octopusdrives.com