Yanmar 3GM30F light blue smoke when cruising

Feb 16, 2021
404
Hunter Legend 35.5 Bellingham
I’ve had a bit of blue smoke on startup of the engine, and then a very light amount of smoke when warm and cruising at 2700rpm. The smoke backs into the cockpit and the smell is noticeable.

Engine otherwise runs very smoothly, with no noticeable issues.

Engine hours are 2440. Injectors all test normal, valve lash was adjusted 150 hours ago, oil and filter were changed 20 hours ago

My question - is some amount of smoke just normal for these engines? Or is there likely something more serious that needs checking into? I’ve heard various opinions on this, and constantly see a large percentage of other boats putting out more smoke than mine. I don’t want to waste time chasing ghosts, but I’d like for the smoke to be addressed if it reasonably can be.
 
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Jul 23, 2009
881
Beneteau 31 Oceanis Grand Lake, Oklahoma
It almost has to be rings or valve guides, neither is easy or cheap to replace.
 
May 17, 2004
5,583
Beneteau Oceanis 37 Havre de Grace
Blue smoke would probably be oil, so less likely a valve, injector, or exhaust elbow issue. Does “no noticeable issues” include any oil consumption?
 
Feb 16, 2021
404
Hunter Legend 35.5 Bellingham
When is the last time your ran the engine at 3600 RPM and for how long.
I try to run it at 3400 for about 10 seconds then back to idle before shutting the engine off each time, though I only actually do it probably 40% of the time. There is more blue smoke when running it high.
 
Feb 16, 2021
404
Hunter Legend 35.5 Bellingham
Blue smoke would probably be oil, so less likely a valve, injector, or exhaust elbow issue. Does “no noticeable issues” include any oil consumption?
I’ve noticed some drop in oil level over time, but not a significant amount. It has never dropped enough to necessitate adding oil before it becomes time for another oil change.
 
May 29, 2018
572
Canel 25 foot Shiogama, japan
I don’t want to waste time chasing ghosts,

Good attitude.
Just to put you in the picture.
Blue smoke means your engine is burning oil.
Not the end of the world and as long as you regularly check the oil level, she starts easily and you can ignore the smell of burning kerosene (napalm) in the morning, all will be fine.

The oil is burnt when it can enter the combustion chamber. This is from above through worn valve guides (Google that one) or from below via worn piston rings (another google).
If she is starting easily it is probably not rings. Worn rings will lower compression (another google trip) and make for hard starting.

gary
 
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Jan 4, 2006
7,218
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
I try to run it at 3400 for about 10 seconds then back to idle before shutting the engine off each time,
No guarantees here, but try running it at 3600 RPM for 10-15 minutes next time you're out to see if there's any difference in smoke. Watch the temp.

At 2440 hrs. your engine is barely broken in so I might be scratching my head wondering why, but not losing any sleep over it.
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,218
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
Have you mentioned the weight oil you're using here ? If oil is too light, a small amount will sneak past your rings and partially burn in the cylinder producing smoke.
 
Jun 8, 2004
2,936
Catalina 320 Dana Point
My 3GM30 used to smoke a little on cold start and while running, just noticeable, not as bad as you describe. My now retired mechanic was adamant about using cetane booster, after a couple tanks there was no noticeable smoke.
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,218
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
Delo 400 15w-40
No obvious errors regardless of where you look. I do the same as you and no smoke from a 2GM20F.

Are you the first owner of the boat. The reason I ask is perhaps a previous owner ran the engine too lightly from start and glazed the cylinder bore. I have seen cases where "supposedly" this was a cause of smoking. That theory and $1.00 will get you a coffee in most restaurants.

For the considerable cost of correcting this problem compared to the inconvenience of the smoke, I'd probably forget it. If you have a dodger with an opening panel in the front, run with this open to eliminate smoke in the cockpit. I often get smoke at the start of my 3600 RPM run every month or so and air out the cockpit by opening the panel.

Has anyone anyone mentioned air filter ? I know, grasping at straws .............. causes black smoke not blue but when you get desperate :doh: . Exhaust gas recirculation (EGR) valve and hose clear ? Anything coming from the hose leading to the EGR under heavy load (leaking rings) ?

Sorry but that's all I got :( .
 
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RoyS

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Jun 3, 2012
1,742
Hunter 33 Steamboat Wharf, Hull, MA
This simple test may help you focus on your problem. Remove the intake manifold end of the crankcase breather hose (assuming there is one) and submerge it in a glass of water while the engine is idling. If your rings are sound you should only observe a slow stream of bubbles but no splashing. This test crudely measures piston ring blow-by.
 
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Nov 22, 2011
1,250
Ericson 26-2 San Pedro, CA
I'm cutting and pasting a lengthy post I put on the Ericson list back in 2019. It concerns my Yanmar 1GM and an issue with oil consumption, as well as some smoking. You may find it applicable here.

Executive summary: The post is long, so if you don't want to read it all then here is the executive summary: Run the heck out of your engine for about 10 hours or so in case your issue is caused by stuck rings or whatever. By "run the heck out of," I mean 3400 RPM, which is probably a lot harder than you may have been running it. And no, you won't blow up your engine, because 3400 is the continuous rating for the GM-series of engines.

***** WARNING: LONG POST FOLLOWS *****

Oil consumption and running a diesel hard enough

In 2017 I replaced my well-running Yanmar 1GM with another 1GM that I got for a steal on eBay. This one had been run only in fresh water (a great thing for a raw water cooled engine), had zero surface rust, and was just too good of a bargain to pass up. So I bought it, tested it in my garage, and then swapped engines in June of 2017. The original engine is in my garage and I plan to rebuild it in my leisure, or just keep it as is for a spare.

Anyway, the "new" engine started right up, had good compression (which I verified with a compression tester), ran very well, but did smoke a small amount. Because of family commitments, I had very little occasion to run it in 2018. But after putting only about 20 of my own hours on the engine, I began to observe that it was consuming some oil. The Yanmar manual says that some oil consumption is normal, being greatest when the engine is brand new and also toward the end of its useful life. However, the numbers I was seeing were more than I was comfortable with. Specifically, I was observing around 0.4 to 0.5 oz./hour. This may not seem like much, but that little engine only holds 1.4 qts. total in its baby oil sump to begin with! Plus, my original engine consumed little if any oil--certainly nothing like this. I was not happy.

Knowing that the compression is good, I was thinking it might be the valve seals, or possibly the oil ring. It was not leaking oil, so the oil had to be going out the exhaust. So even though it was not smoking much, I figured the amount it was smoking had to be enough to account for this amount of consumption.

I was considering swapping back to the original engine and then tearing down this one for a rebuild. But I first decided to give a call to Scott at S&W Diesel in Wilmington to see what he thought. He wondered if perhaps the engine had been run too lightly or not under enough of a load for prolonged periods. He said that he often talks to customers who baby their engines (thinking that's a great thing to do) and then encounter increased oil consumption from things like stuck rings, etc. He mentioned that it's especially bad with generators because it's often difficult to load those up. He said that he will tell such customers to run the crap out of their engine for several hours and see if the problem doesn't fix itself. He mentioned one fellow who did this, motoring from San Diego to L.A. Harbor (I think it was), and by the time he put 10 hours of hard running on it the problem vanished. He suggested I give that a try.

I already knew that a diesel ought not to be babied, and I have never done that with any of the ones I've owned. But with this engine I don't really know how the previous owner may have run it in the past. I do know that he used to race his boat and it could be that he just fired it up to get to the starting line and then to get back into the slip. I'm just speculating here, of course. I do not really know the total number of hours on this engine as the previous owner did not have an hour meter on it, nor do I know his usage pattern. It looks to have had light use, and if so, that's not necessarily a great thing.

So, I decided to follow Scott's advice and run the heck out of it. I put a little over 10 such hours on it, running it at about 3300 rpm. This is above its normal cruising rpm but within the continuous rpm rating of the engine, and is about the max I can get with my particular prop in any case. (I am slightly overpropped.) This was a really good, hard run. When I did this, the oil consumption shot up to over 2 oz. per hour! Yikes! But after this I also noticed that the smoke I had been seeing pretty much disappeared when I ran it at a more reasonable cruising rpm (e.g., around 2800). Something clearly had changed.

Since putting those hard-running hours on the engine, I've been running it at 2850-2925 rpm since mid-February. This is a good, stout cruising rpm for this engine and puts it under a decent load. (I confirmed actual engine rpm with an optical tach; my Yanmar tach reads about 200 rpm too low in this range.) I would carefully check the dipstick after every run.

Well, guess what? On April 13, after 27.2 hours, I could finally discern a very slight decrease in oil level on the disptick! So I carefully added a small amount of oil until I brought it right up to the full line again. It took all of 2 oz.! Doing the math, this is only 0.07 oz./hour! And the engine no longer smokes. I can sometimes get a small amount of steam, depending on the outside air temperature/dew point. Sometimes I don't even get the steam. But as for the smoke, it is gone.

Scott's suggestion paid off. I'm guessing there may have been some carbon causing a stuck ring or something. The engine runs great--though to be honest, I would have thought all was well before had I not observed the oil consumption.

My plan is to run it at WOT for an hour or two here and there, to keep everything blown out. I've also added a nice solar panel setup so I can keep up with my electrical loads without having to idle the engine. (As I mentioned, I didn't tend to do that too often before anyway, but now I'm being very punctilious about avoiding that completely.)

I hope this info may be helpful to someone else.
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,218
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
By "run the heck out of," I mean 3400 RPM
Good idea. A stuck ring(s) was another idea which didn't quite make it to the surface when I was racking my brains for a cause of the smoke , but yes, when there's nothing else obvious, it's well worth a try. And it's the right cost with the right amount of effort.

10 hrs. at 3400 is within the operating parameters of a 3GM30F.
 
Nov 22, 2011
1,250
Ericson 26-2 San Pedro, CA
Good idea. A stuck ring(s) was another idea which didn't quite make it to the surface when I was racking my brains for a cause of the smoke , but yes, when there's nothing else obvious, it's well worth a try. And it's the right cost with the right amount of effort.

10 hrs. at 3400 is within the operating parameters of a 3GM30F.
Well, in my case Scott’s idea certainly turned out to be a good one because it solved the problem! But even if it doesn’t in this case, there’s no downside to trying.

I should also mention that the fix appeared to be permanent; the oil consumption problem never returned. I would, though, open it up every 5 or 10 hours or so for maybe half an hour, just to keep it “tuned up.”
 
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Jul 5, 2011
739
Oday 28 Madison, CT
Did he say if the mill is running within the specified temperature range? If he has not looked, he needs to. I also was told to use straight 30 weight oil in our marine engines, not a multi weight. How much does it matter? Might, might not.
 
Feb 16, 2021
404
Hunter Legend 35.5 Bellingham
My 3GM30 used to smoke a little on cold start and while running, just noticeable, not as bad as you describe. My now retired mechanic was adamant about using cetane booster, after a couple tanks there was no noticeable smoke.
Yup, I’ve been adding Diesel Kleen with every fill up.
 
Nov 22, 2011
1,250
Ericson 26-2 San Pedro, CA
Is there any reason NOT to run an engine at its rated rpm for any significant amount of time? My Yanmar manual states to run at the rated rpm to clear the cylinders of buildup before shutting off (though it doesn’t say for how long).
I have a Yanmar manual that suggests running up the RPM *in neutral* about 5 times from idle to clear the carbon out of the cylinder(s). I'm pretty sure what Ralph had in mind (and he can correct me if I'm wrong) was running it at 3600 rpm under load (in gear). That is the max RPM and you can certainly do that. The engine has a 3400 rpm continuous rating. As mentioned earlier in this thread, it's a good idea to give it a good, hard run occasionally. If your cooling system is up to snuff, it should not run higher than its rated operating temperature.
 
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Feb 16, 2021
404
Hunter Legend 35.5 Bellingham
Funny there are different Yanmar recommendations regarding running up the engine to the rated rpm. I have a friend who also has a 3GM30F, and his 3GM manual states nothing about running the engine up, only to pull the stop when stopping the engine.
So… what is the best practice here? 30 minutes every 10 hours? Sounds reasonable, but shouldn’t Yanmar have published some official recommendations somewhere?
I plan to run the engine under load at 3400 for 10 hours as @Ralph Johnstone recommends (though it will likely be done in 2 or 3 hour chunks or so) and will report back. Hopefully my temp alarm is working in case it gets too hot. (I’ll bring my IR temp gun just in case (btw, what is the ideal running temp, and from what easily accessed location should that temp be taken?)).