Update on using a Kayak for a tender
- Thread starter Zzzzzz
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Perhaps inflatable and sit-on kayaks are the first step towards getting a power boat. Can't say, but there is something about maintaining skills....
We have been using some easyrider kayaks: http://www.easyriderkayaks.com/
Since they are made to hook together like a catamaran they are very stable and they have plenty of optional equipment you can add like sails.
Since they are made to hook together like a catamaran they are very stable and they have plenty of optional equipment you can add like sails.
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Thanks! I like the look of them.... I need the ability to haul two folks, or a grunch of camping gear...semi dry and warm at least...
I think one of these could be an interesting tender>>>http://wavewalk.com/W_Fishing_Kayak_Product_Information.html
^^ I'm confused:
a. Can't paddle properly; braces are in the way of many strokes.
b. Poor maneuverability as compared to a single.
c. Singles have been paddled vast distances; I don't get this concern over stability.
d. A nightmare in strong conditions
e. Dangerous on the surf; if it broaches someone is going to get hurt. No ability to side-slip, since you can't roll the hulls. No effective brace stroke.
f. Those braces are going to work terribly in quartering waves.
Other than boarding, I see only down side. And most of the world sees it that way. Which is why bicylces don't use training wheels. The beauty of kayaking is to have a responsive 1-person boat.
a. Can't paddle properly; braces are in the way of many strokes.
b. Poor maneuverability as compared to a single.
c. Singles have been paddled vast distances; I don't get this concern over stability.
d. A nightmare in strong conditions
e. Dangerous on the surf; if it broaches someone is going to get hurt. No ability to side-slip, since you can't roll the hulls. No effective brace stroke.
f. Those braces are going to work terribly in quartering waves.
Other than boarding, I see only down side. And most of the world sees it that way. Which is why bicylces don't use training wheels. The beauty of kayaking is to have a responsive 1-person boat.
First; Great initial post, thanks! As a ski instructor with many years of experience, you hit on a number points that I hadn't considered, and provided several goals for when I'm ready to remove the training wheels...
But, at this point, I'm both in need of training wheels and in the market for a solution and I'm looking at kayaks. The biggest downside that I see with this solution is the cost! I, personally, am much more likely to follow your initial advice, but I can't promise that I wouldn't add braces to the Impulse or the Aspire to build my own Kay-cat…
Especially here in the south Puget Sound (does Des Moines qualify? I know that mountain!), your points d, e and f just don't happen during summer cruising season. And, once you're tied together as a catamar-ak, you're not a 1 person boat; Maneuverability should be better than other paddle and ore propelled boats, Likewise for stability, with less drag.
And, if I ever got to the point in this area where D - F were a concern, I think I'd be more concerned that my several thousand dollars worth of kayaks were properly secured to my boat than whether or not I could side-slip them…
Thanks, again, for your insights!
Can someone explain to me why you dont just use a normal dinghy? It seems like pretty much all the issues you are trying to get around are part of what makes a Kayak work well AS a kayak, and are all things that aren't issues for normal dinghies. Is there some reason for trying to make a kayak do what something else does better?
...StinkBug;Can someone explain to me why you dont just use a normal dinghy? "
For me, its a case of I already have a kayak, and the mooring location I have, there is no place to leave your dinghy (private beaches, and not member of local club)...but then again...I am still researching the subject, and may be forced to go with a dinghy...trials begin in July....
Dean
For me, its a case of I already have a kayak, and the mooring location I have, there is no place to leave your dinghy (private beaches, and not member of local club)...but then again...I am still researching the subject, and may be forced to go with a dinghy...trials begin in July....
Dean
I use both. Kayaks paddles much better, is easier to carry, and is more fun; an inflatable tender is a dependable pick-up truck and i use mine a lot. On a boat too small for davits, I would chose a kayak.
We've been bashing kayaks for their short comings. Let's list the problems with a dingy:
* Small boats generally tow them, which is bad.
* When it is time to bring them on deck, it's painful. Yeah, there are ways, but a child can drag a kayak up alone.
* Rigid dingies can be rowed, but not like a kayak, not at all.
* Dingies are a pain to carry up the beach.
* Dingies are hard to car-top.
* Dingies are clods in the marsh when compared to a kayak.
* Dingies are boring. Like power boats.
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As for security, a class is a good way to learn paddling. It is actually quite simple to learn a few brace strokes, which make capsize VERY unlikely. I have been paddling for many years, and have ONLY capsized in river whitewater.
Yes, it's an aquired taste, but like riding a bicycle, well worth learning. And nothing is so relaxing as kicking back in a kayak on the flatwater of a marsh, the only sound the hiss of the wind in the grass. The cockpit of a sailboat at anchor is a distant second.
thinwater: to follow up on what you said about utilizing both kayaks and dingys for their best purposes, I actually carry 2 inflated kayaks and drag an inflatable dingy/motor when I am on the water to play and fish. A person just can't have too many toys!
Chief
Chief
Hi guys, this is my first post. I have been sailing all my life on and off, and I joined this forum because it looks like I may be inheriting a small daysailer, but I stumbled upon this thread first. I am an avid fisherman and do quite a bit of fishing from my kayak. I think a kayak would be an interesting tender, but I think it carries some risk with it.
Firstly, getting dunked is no big deal if you practice your self rescue drills. No one should be kayaking in the ocean if they can't slide back on or in their kayak like an otter (or walrus in the case if some of us bigger folks). I make my kids to rescue drills at the beginning of each season when the water is still cold so they are expert at self rescue.
Standing up in a kayak is nothing in flat water once you get the hang of it. It's a completely different problem in waves or even 12" chop. However I am even more concerned about someone standing up in a kayak and then grabbing hold of a sailboat. That sounds like a concussion waiting to happen. Kayaks don't stay underneath you when you grab hold of something, they want to slide away from underneath you.
Oh and the headstand? Yeah that's cool. There is even a paddle board yoga practice going on these days. Really cool I think, but still don't think a kayak is a good idea for a tender unless your sailboat has a ladder, you get in the water from the yak, and then climb the ladder from the water. I honestly think that's the safest choice if using a yak for a tender.
Firstly, getting dunked is no big deal if you practice your self rescue drills. No one should be kayaking in the ocean if they can't slide back on or in their kayak like an otter (or walrus in the case if some of us bigger folks). I make my kids to rescue drills at the beginning of each season when the water is still cold so they are expert at self rescue.
Standing up in a kayak is nothing in flat water once you get the hang of it. It's a completely different problem in waves or even 12" chop. However I am even more concerned about someone standing up in a kayak and then grabbing hold of a sailboat. That sounds like a concussion waiting to happen. Kayaks don't stay underneath you when you grab hold of something, they want to slide away from underneath you.
Oh and the headstand? Yeah that's cool. There is even a paddle board yoga practice going on these days. Really cool I think, but still don't think a kayak is a good idea for a tender unless your sailboat has a ladder, you get in the water from the yak, and then climb the ladder from the water. I honestly think that's the safest choice if using a yak for a tender.
Since I was the original poster, the reason for not using a dinghy is two fold:
1. I don't have the money for a single purpose $800 dinghy plus the electric trolling motor I need, just to get 200 yards down the channel to my small sailboat. I could spend the money, just too frugal for a single use item like this.
2. I want a kayak and so does the first mate(read wife of 41 years) which can be used in multiple places with multiple circumstance and so wouldn't be just a one use expense.
3. Using the kayak means that we have to scramble aboard a sailboat with a pretty high freeboard, and at age 65 we are simply not quite as balancing as we were when we were 41, so we need to make sure that the platform is stable and easy to do. When I was younger, I simply had no concept of how, despite exercise and great diet, my strength and balance would deteriorate.
At Some Point...
...all the sporting good stores will literally "blow-out" thier summer merchandise. Usually it is much earlier than expected. Last year I picked up a kayak from Dick's for $ 75.00...really.
Keep an eye out. The deals surface and disappear quickly.
...all the sporting good stores will literally "blow-out" thier summer merchandise. Usually it is much earlier than expected. Last year I picked up a kayak from Dick's for $ 75.00...really.
Keep an eye out. The deals surface and disappear quickly.
Maybe in Aberdeen.
Here in Bar Harbor, Maine, first of all we don't have big department stores, unless we drive 4 hours south to Portland(We don't have any stores like that---heck we have to drive into Ellsworth 20 minutes away even to get a McDonald's). We have Craigslist, and some local small stores, and Facebook swap groups. Second, we have been looking for 3 years, just like you suggest. We narrowly missed buy a very very used boat for $350, from one of the local summer groups that take people out--but they only do that once every three to four years.
We finally broke down and bought a new one with a $100 rebate from West Marine. WM is generally not as cheap as Hamilton Marine, and locals don't generally buy from them unless they have no other choice or its a sale. But until July 5 they are having a sale, with a big rebate, and today they were having a 30% off on rope. So I took advantage and bought some low stretch dinghy 4mm line for the CDI roller furling in a color that would make it obvious what it was: BLACK.
If you already have a kayak I totally get it. A lot of this discussion seems to kind of center around buying various different kinds of kayaks, which seems kinda expensive and silly if it doesn't meet some needs for you that a normal dinghy would not. Kayaks are fun, and I have one and love using it, but for tender use I have an inflatable dinghy that works far better. It's stable, easy to row (though not like a kayak) and since it's an inflatable floor it's light enough to carry and put on the roof of my car by myself. It also deflates and rolls up for storage onboard my not so big sailboat.
It sounds to me like a kayak is not the ideal tender for the OP at his age and physical ability, and modifying one to make it work for him might compromise the attributes that make it good as a kayak. Just seems like fighting an uphill battle IMHO.
It sounds to me like a kayak is not the ideal tender for the OP at his age and physical ability, and modifying one to make it work for him might compromise the attributes that make it good as a kayak. Just seems like fighting an uphill battle IMHO.
Ok, so here's a way we can all try kayaks as tenders on the cheap: http://yostwerks.com/WoodSOFFrameMenu.html
The example model on the website is the Sea Bee, which has been changed as far as the design, from single chine to multiple chine.
Here are some pictures of the new design Sea Bee I'm currently building. It's all ready for waterproof coating on the nylon skin. As soon as that's done, you can be darn sure I'll be trying to climb in and out of the sailboat with it I expect it will be easier than the other picture I posted. This new one is a lot wider than the 19" one from previous posts
Building these things costs less than $300…
The example model on the website is the Sea Bee, which has been changed as far as the design, from single chine to multiple chine.
Here are some pictures of the new design Sea Bee I'm currently building. It's all ready for waterproof coating on the nylon skin. As soon as that's done, you can be darn sure I'll be trying to climb in and out of the sailboat with it
I expect it will be easier than the other picture I posted. This new one is a lot wider than the 19" one from previous posts Building these things costs less than $300…
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Oh, yeah, one more thing… Greenlanders build tiny little kayaks for their kids. And they tie soda bottles to a cross beam mounted behind the cockpit for outriggers. Get 'em kayaking early!
Here's an expensive version: http://store.triaksports.com/products/triak-p1 I bet it would be kinda difficult to get it up next to the boat to get out. Or store on deck.
Here's an expensive version: http://store.triaksports.com/products/triak-p1 I bet it would be kinda difficult to get it up next to the boat to get out. Or store on deck.