Swing Keel Photos

[rgranger]

Now that it is winter (for most of us) thoughts turn to our maintenance lists and mine includes dropping the keel, replacing the pivot pin and checking the bushing.

Many of us have done this before but I thought it might be nice to look at how other people have done it. Do you have photos to post of how you dropped your keel, how you moved it around and how you managed to maneuver it back into place?

 

[Mikem]

I would love to see those photos as well. I need to install a new weldment and spacers on a 1980 catalina 25.

 

[CalebD]

I'm pretty sure you will find that someone else in that Balboa Yahoo group has already done this and posted some pictures.
The Photos section of that group has many photo albums uploaded by the members.
You can also search the Messages section for posts about the swing keel.

A lot is going to depend on the weight of the 'swing keel'. If the weight is close to the # given as the Ballast on this spec: http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=484
then the board could weight 1200#s. If that is the case then break out the jack from your vehicle. In fact, if you had 2 jacks ...

@Mikem - I'm pretty sure that there is a Catalina group right here at SBO that should have the info you seek on the C25 swing keel. You may have to dig a bit to find it but I'm pretty sure it is there. Stu Jackson could help you find it quicker than I can.

 

[Mikem]

CalebD,

I have the same question on the Cat 25 forum. Thanks for the info though, appreciate it.

 

[LooseDiamond]

I did my Cat 22 last year and have pics. What would be the easiest way to do it, upload in a post or put all in photo album with link?

 

[rgranger]

I'm pretty sure you will find that someone else in that Balboa Yahoo group has already done this and posted some pictures.
....

You are very good at reading between lines

I have dropped the keel on both of the V21 sailboats I used to own and on my V22. I've also taken the swing keel off of my Rhodes 22 but it doesn't weigh that much.. and I was able to use two car jacks to lower the heavy Mac keels onto the boat's trailer. I hung the boats from a beam I had constructed so I was able to use the trailer as a dolly.

But the balboa's keel is 1200lb and I don't think I want to be casual with that beast. It I drop it on the ground I'll probably never be able to get it up again. And you know I don't want any part of my body under that. So I need ideas on how to support the boat, as well as how to lower the keel into a jig, how best to construct the jig/dolly etc. I did find a good website where a guy refurbished his Catalina 25 keel but the story started with the keel in a jig already dropped. But I know there are some cleaver people here who have done this before so I'll keep digging.

Also on my to-do list is to fix a broken spreader. :dance:

 

[Bosman]

Does the design of the trailer allow to lower the keel with the boat on the trailer (ie parallel down)? I have looked at the diagram from sailboatdata and it would appear that it does not need to be lowered very much in order to withdraw it from the boat. Can you post a photo of your boat on the trailer? 1200lbs is quite heavy and while you would be able to stabilise it with help of another person or two, a wooden jig and at least two hydraulic jacks would be required to lift it back up. When I was inspecting the keel on my boat I was using a crane to lift the boat up and then lower the keel. Although mine does not weigh as mush as yours (about 240-260lbs) it was difficult to handle with two people.

 

[rgranger]

...Can you post a photo of your boat on the trailer?... .

Here is the best pic I have at the moment. I don't think I could lower it enough to inspect the bushing while still on the trailer.

And I think you are correct, handling 1200# safely will be a challenge. Some sort of jig will be needed.

 

[Merlin Clark]

You are very good at reading between lines

I have dropped the keel on both of the V21 sailboats I used to own and on my V22. I've also taken the swing keel off of my Rhodes 22 but it doesn't weigh that much.. and I was able to use two car jacks to lower the heavy Mac keels onto the boat's trailer. I hung the boats from a beam I had constructed so I was able to use the trailer as a dolly.

But the balboa's keel is 1200lb and I don't think I want to be casual with that beast. It I drop it on the ground I'll probably never be able to get it up again. And you know I don't want any part of my body under that. So I need ideas on how to support the boat, as well as how to lower the keel into a jig, how best to construct the jig/dolly etc. I did find a good website where a guy refurbished his Catalina 25 keel but the story started with the keel in a jig already dropped. But I know there are some cleaver people here who have done this before so I'll keep digging.

Also on my to-do list is to fix a broken spreader. :dance:

I've never pulled a trailer out from under a boat that heavy so can't help there.
On dropping the keel, what about renting one of these http://www.harborfreight.com/2000-lb-low-profile-transmission-jack-4075.html

 

[LloydB]

Use a crib aft and a sling forward supported by a beam at the bow. Lift the boat high enough above the trailer to pull it out from under with keel balanced and secured on the keel tray of the trailer. Drop the keel to the trailer with the keel wench so the trailer is supporting back half of the weight of the keel. Secure the lowered keel with cargo straps and/or chocks to prevent it from falling sideways on the trailer. Use a jack to take weight off the pivot bolt with a safety block under the keel near the jack so it can't drop, until you're ready to lower it. You may need to drop the front end of the keel in stages using blocks so the jack can be taken out from under the keel when you move the trailer. Secure the front of the keel from sideways falling as you did the back. Do not put any thing in the pivot point you do not want to AMPUTATE. Before removing the pivot bolt make keel position and angle location marks on the keel and boat as it doesn't line up as easy going back in as it did coming out.
(a swing set may work for a beam at the bow)

 

[Bosman]

Another option (what I did) is to drive around your city and visit heavy duty metal fabrication shops. Some of them will have overhead cranes. Second shop I visited did not have any problems lifting my boat up off the trailer and gave me an hour to remove the keel, then two weeks later another hour to put it back. I did not even try to lift the boat myself as she weighs good 7300 lbs. Transaction was sealed with a small cash fee

 

[rgranger]

Thanks Bosman

I've actually been considering asking my auto mechanic. He has a small shop and with the down economy.... he seems less than full capacity.

So you had an hour to remove the keel. I assume you had the crane put the boat back on the trailer so ....What did you do with the keel once you removed it? Did you have a dolly made up to support it? I'm trying to picture the entire process ...

 

[MrUnix]

If you are just replacing the pivot bolt, you shouldn't really need to do much more than just lower the keel onto a support and then use a floor jack to support the front enough to do the repair. No need to really drop the thing unless you have some other work you want to do to it. In that case, Lloyd has pretty much described the sequence. A piece of plywood under the keel will allow it to be slid easily from under the boat, and floor jacks are a requirement. Getting the thing back in is the hardest part Not the same kind of boat, but the picture below was taken just before yanking the keel out of a V17 for restoration.

Cheers,
Brad

 

[Bosman]

Well, before I even started I have acquired information from the builder on how exactly the keel is attached and the best procedure for the removal. I also got technical drawings of the parts. Then, when the day came, I arrived with two friends to help me out. It took about an hour for the shop staff to position the lift straps properly to keep the boat balanced. At that time I have removed all the nuts for the bolts holding the keel in place and broke them free (ie turned them with a rachet to make sure they will come out easily). It took about 15 minutes to remove the keel, once it was not attached to anything the boat was simply lifted up and the keel stayed on the trailer. Three of us then moved it onto a pick-up truck and the boat placed back on the trailer.

What I did to the swing keel:
- full sand blasting (paid $50 at the local blasting shop)
- treat entire surface with phosporic acid (removes any left over rust and protects from flash rust)
- apply Interlux 2000E barrier to seal the metal
- fill surface imperfections with epoxy sealer and sand down
- re-treat exposed metal (as a result of sanding) with phosporic acid again
- two more coats of Interlux 2000E
- two coats of epoxy paint for super smooth finish
- replaced sheaves and control line
- I did not perform any welding on the keel as there are lead pellets inside secured with epoxy resin. High temperature of welding could cause fire, lead vapour and another hazardous gases. Besides welding was not required.

I did not use anti-fouling paint as my keel sits in its trunk at marina, where it is dark and algae growth does not occur. Some anti-fouling paints will accelerate corrosion, so if you plan to apply anti-fouling paint to your keel do check that carefully.

During the re-attachment the keel was placed in the raised position on the trailer and supported by two pieces of metal. The boat was then lowered onto it carefully and after some fight to get the attachment holes aligned, securing bolts were re-inserted. This took about 30 minutes... Overall it was much less headache than I anticipated.

Hope this helps,
Cheers!

 

[THECUSCUS]

Here is my take on the aft cribbing. Should be able to support the weight of your boat.
I made a keel buggy to move the keel around and to keep it from falling over. You'll probably need to use larger casters & boards, as your keel is alot heavier than my 600 lb one. But the concept is the same. I used an engine cherry picker to move it around. If you are working on a concrete pad or paved driveway, you will be able to roll things around pretty easy, I have a stone driveway and it was challenging, but doable. Your idea of using your mechanics lift is a good one. You might be able to back the trailer in between the lift, then lift the boat up, pull the trailer out of the way, then lower boat to a nice working level and lower the keel onto your "buggy". If you go this route, take some pics, I'd like to see how it worked.

 

[rgranger]

Hey Bosman... that does help.

The steps you described are exactly what I'm planning to do, maybe even add a fiberglass step and a grounding shoe on the leading edge of the keel.

Can you tell me what your keel weighs? Mine is 1200# and I'm not sure that me and two other guys could lift that into the bed of my truck. I'm trying to imagine a 400# deadlift per person. I'd need some beefy friends.

I do have a "come-along" maybe I need to get a few more and get creative.

Thanks for the post and the pics. I'm leaning more and more to asking my auto mechanic if I can rent his lift for an afternoon.

In addition to fairing and sealing... I also want to inspect the bushing and make any necessary repairs/replacements there.

r

 

[rgranger]

...
I made a keel buggy ... I used an engine cherry picker ... If you go this route, take some pics, I'd like to see how it worked.

Cuscus

thanks for the detailed pics. I've stored them in my "ideas" folder. I like the design of your "buggy" and will most likely need something like that.

r

 

[Bosman]

Mine keel is significantly lighter at approximately 260-270 lbs. The main ballast (2420 lbs or so) is at the bottom of the hull, so in this regard design of my boat does differ from yours. Solina is designed to be self-righting with the keel in raised position and even in the unlikely situation when the keel is lost. You need more people to help you move your keel around.

 

[rgranger]

Mine keel is significantly lighter at approximately 260-270 lbs. The main ballast (2420 lbs or so) is at the bottom of the hull, so in this regard design of my boat does differ from yours. Solina is designed to be self-righting with the keel in raised position and even in the unlikely situation when the keel is lost. You need more people to help you move your keel around.

Yeah... maybe a few guys from the high school football team. I could bribe them with a few steaks on the barbi...

I've done this before with a Mac V21 and a Mac V22 but 1200# scares me a bit. The V22 is 600# and I think the V21 was 400#. The V21 I was able to handle by myself using a few crow bars and a come along. The V22 I only lowered a little but left the top in the trunk. All I wanted to do was visually inspect the bushing that time so all I needed was a couple of car jacks.

 

[davisr]

For many pictures of the removal of a centerboard or swing keel from a boat, see the article, "Centerboard Extraction and Analysis," on www.ericson25.com

There is also a four-part article, "Centerboard Construction," with many pictures, on the construction of a new centerboard.