Stop Centerboard from 'Bouncing' in Waves on Hunter 216

Feb 26, 2016
7
Hunter 216 Oxford, MD
Hi all,

I'm relatively new to sailing, and have inherited a 216 from about 2008. I've noticed that when I lower the centerboard, there is no way to 'secure' or 'lock' it into the down position. That's fine, since the centerboard weighs about 500lbs, but when I'm sailing through waves, I hear and feel the centerboard bouncing around down there, knocking against the hull. Sometimes, the centerboard lifts so high that the cable pops off the wheel, which makes it very difficult to raise the centerboard at the end of the day, when I pull into the shallow waters of our dock!

Any advice? Am I overlooking any obvious way to lock the centerboard in the 'down' position while sailing?
 
Mar 20, 2004
1,729
Hunter 356 and 216 Portland, ME
WOW! we sail ours on the ocean and I've never had that problem... make sure that the pivot's not loose or worn. The only way to secure it down that I can think of would be to attach a tackle - like to the cable clevis - and pull it forward and secure it. It'll have to be a really strong point because there won't be much leverage at the top of the board.
 
May 24, 2004
7,129
CC 30 South Florida
It is unlikely that a ballasted swing keel weighing 500 lbs. just lifts with boat movement. What you are probably experiencing is "keel slap" or side to side movement around a worn keel pivot bolt. I agree your swing keel should have a slot to allow a bolt to pass through the keel trunk and serve to lock it when in the down position. That might prevent the keel from jack knifing and destroying the trunk in case of a knock down. Excessive "keel slap" is also dangerous and needs to be corrected so a keel removal and survey might be in order. Due to the weight inquire with other h216 owners about the proper procedure to follow.
 
May 24, 2004
7,129
CC 30 South Florida
Look for a discussion in the Smaller Boats forum under "216 keel jack". Crazy Dave and others comment on the hydraulic system and recommendations. Seems to me that hydraulic system just works to raise, lower and perhaps to lock the keel when it is down. Like I said before because of its weight it should not be lifting up by itself unless the boat gets grounded. I still suspect the bouncing around you are experiencing is side to side motion from a worn pivot point. It seems like your boat keel raising system has been modified and that may have caused undue strain on the keel pivot bolt and keel trunk supports. Would suggest you inspect the keel. Perhaps Crazy Dave can chime in with suggestions for proper repairs.
 
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Mar 20, 2004
1,729
Hunter 356 and 216 Portland, ME
I agree with Benny about the worn pivot. As I said in my first response, check the pivot first - side to side is much more likely, but a worn pivot could cause a little up and down. The hydraulics on the 216 pull on a cable that raises and lowers the board; it only restrains the board in the up position. The whole assembly is a stainless steel frame that is attached to the hull along the top sides - there really isn't a trunk in the conventional sense, only a slot the assembly drops into.
 

Doug J

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May 2, 2005
1,192
Hunter 26 Oceanside, CA
Here's the diagram. To inspect the pivot, would you need to remove the entire assembly?

Capture.PNG
 
Feb 26, 2016
7
Hunter 216 Oxford, MD
Hi everyone,

Thanks so much for the replies. I owe a few of you direct responses, but let me start by clearing up any confusion. First, I do NOT mean that the centerboard is bouncing 'up and down'. In fact, 'bouncing' was probably the wrong term for me to use. What I mean is simply that whenever the bow rises (going over a wave), the centerboard naturally 'swings' up a bit—as if I had used the pump to raise it a few degrees. This causes some temporary slack in the cable. But then the bow goes back down, the centerboard 'swings' back down to vertical, which sometimes happens so quickly that it 'yanks' the cable off of the wheel, or even results in the centerboard bumping into the frame.

This might sound strange, but I think that if you imagine going over a wave in slow motion, keeping in mind that the centerboard is swinging freely (not locked into place), it should make good sense. I'd actually be very surprised if no one else has ever experienced this, since it seems like the natural thing to happen when you have a keel swinging freely on a boat whose bow is rising and falling.

More direct replies soon. Thanks again!
 
Feb 26, 2016
7
Hunter 216 Oxford, MD
Here's the diagram. To inspect the pivot, would you need to remove the entire assembly?
Thanks Doug. Yes, I've learned the hard way (when one time the cable snapped!) that I would have to remove the entire assembly. But still, I'm thinking that might not be necessary, since this is a 'swinging' issue, and I suspect that everyone must have faced it at some time?
 
Feb 26, 2016
7
Hunter 216 Oxford, MD
I agree with Benny about the worn pivot. As I said in my first response, check the pivot first - side to side is much more likely, but a worn pivot could cause a little up and down. The hydraulics on the 216 pull on a cable that raises and lowers the board; it only restrains the board in the up position. The whole assembly is a stainless steel frame that is attached to the hull along the top sides - there really isn't a trunk in the conventional sense, only a slot the assembly drops into.
Thanks chuckwayne. I'll look into whether this could be side-to-side motion, but there is definitely a 'swinging' motion. When the bow raises to go over a wave, the centerboard stays 'vertical' with respect to the earth, but with the bow going up the centerboard is no longer perpendicular to the hull. That creates temporary slack in the cable, and sometimes the cable rolls off the wheel and falls out of place. Surely others have experienced this?
 
Feb 26, 2016
7
Hunter 216 Oxford, MD
Look for a discussion in the Smaller Boats forum under "216 keel jack". Crazy Dave and others comment on the hydraulic system and recommendations. Seems to me that hydraulic system just works to raise, lower and perhaps to lock the keel when it is down. Like I said before because of its weight it should not be lifting up by itself unless the boat gets grounded. I still suspect the bouncing around you are experiencing is side to side motion from a worn pivot point. It seems like your boat keel raising system has been modified and that may have caused undue strain on the keel pivot bolt and keel trunk supports. Would suggest you inspect the keel. Perhaps Crazy Dave can chime in with suggestions for proper repairs.
Thanks Benny! I'll look there. [...] Just did, but unfortunately that thread just had information on how to fix the pump itself. My problem is that the keel 'swings' when the bow raises and lowers, and this sometimes results in the cable getting some slack and then popping off the wheel.
 
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Feb 26, 2016
7
Hunter 216 Oxford, MD
WOW! we sail ours on the ocean and I've never had that problem... make sure that the pivot's not loose or worn. The only way to secure it down that I can think of would be to attach a tackle - like to the cable clevis - and pull it forward and secure it. It'll have to be a really strong point because there won't be much leverage at the top of the board.
Hi Chuckwayne. Thanks again for your reply. Surely, when sailing on the ocean, your bow will sometimes rise and fall so much that the keel seems to 'swing' in and out of place a little bit? Meaning, when the bow is high, the keel swings 'up' into the boat a bit, and then the bow falls, the keel falls back down into place. This seems like a completely natural result of gravity pulling on the keel, and I'm surprised that I'm the only one experiencing it?
 
Oct 7, 2008
5
Hunter 216 Moline, IL
I have experience this on my Hunter 216 as I sail on the upper Mississippi River in the Quad Cities area. Experience it when a very fast speed boat or tug boat creates a large wave. If the keel is completely down (hydraulic lift screw is counter clockwise and open - can't pump the hydraulic lift), the keel will swing as the boat heads into the wave and down the other side. It can even result in in the cable to the keel slipping off of the pulley (even after the modification of a plate above the pulley - at least on my Hunter 216!). Solution - when needing the keel down release the keel and let it drop fully but then close the hydraulic lift valve (turn fully clockwise) and slightly raise the keel. If I bring in about 2-4 inches of cable (you can watch it by raising the cover or peering through the crack in the cover), you will have enough weight of the keel to keep the cable on the pulley and not hear the keel slapping as you go over the ways.
 
Jul 8, 2016
1
Hunter 216 Lusby, md
Reviving this old thread to comment on this issue.

I have had exactly the same issue on my 216 as well. I strongly suspect wear in the pivot is a root cause of this issue. My 216 is on a lift, so I can get my kayak under it while it is up on the lift. With the keel hanging in the down position I can rattle the board side to side as well as fore/aft. The latter would seem somewhat natural due to the design, but the lateral play just seems wrong. So, I'm going to have a yard pull it next month to see what is going on. I will try to remember to report back.

I have used the "slightly raise the keel" trick myself, and it does help with the fore-aft swinging, but I am hesitant to make it standard practice since it would seem to transfer wear and tear to the swaged wire and especially the hydraulic piston, which is not a cheap item. It don't see an obvious way to put a stop in to keep the keel from swinging. Anyway, I use the boat in shoal water and I would rather the keel swung up if I test the depth with it accidentally, than transfer all those forces to some part of the boat not designed to take it.

I have to imagine that a properly functioning system would have enough friction built in to keep the keel from drastically swinging to and fro. The hobby horse effect of the keel acting like a pendulum in a chop is bad for performance, and seems like something the designer would not have intended.
 
Jun 8, 2004
10,024
-na -NA Anywhere USA
Good morning folks. I have always deferred to Chuckwayne but there are some thoughts. Sailing into the waves with any swing keel can cause pounding and this type of occurrence can happen. I have suggested trying to sail at angles like surfers do to any waves for a smoother ride and less issues of any swing keel raising up and down. I am not sure if this is a good response or not. As for tightening the uphaul line to help keep from slapping up and down, yes you can tighten to a point but do not lift the keel up either as stress is being put on the hydraulics. One thing is to check for lateral or sideways movement and wonder if the bolt running thru the keel is loose. I defer on others here as to other possibilities as it has been so long but sailing with any swing keel, surf> Wish I could be more imformantive but the responses here are good. I would check the bolt holding the keel in place though