Flexible solar panel comparison

[Delezynski]

Galynd,


I ordered and received (today) two of the Renogy 100 W panels. A couple of thoughts...

One arrived damaged; :cry:
The box was torn and the clear plastic over the cells had a couple of foggy white streaks across it. This might have been caused by the break of the box. The plastic also had a number of ripples across it in a couple of areas. I do not think the ripples were we caused by damage. It was poor manufacturing.

When tested side by side for open voltage, it was about 0.2 volt lower than the other panel. When the replacement arrives I will take them to the boat and do an Amp generation test and provide feedback on that, I expect some time next week.
I spent a bit more $ on them, as I ordered from Amazon and am sending it back for a NO COST replacement.

In general;
1. the panels are NOT very robust and will need to be "babied" to insure they are not damaged. Of all the panels I have seen, they are the weakest, structurally speaking.
2. The edges of the panels are sharp, like a cut 1/8 inch thick plastic sheet.
3. The wires for connecting them up do not look well secured to the panel.
4. The grommets for securing them are small!

On the good side;
1. they are small for 100 Watts
2. they are light weight

I think they would best be used by mounting them to a secure hard top or the like that will never see any contact.

Hope this helps some one out there.

Greg

 

[capta]

Galynd,


I ordered and received (today) two of the Renogy 100 W panels. A couple of thoughts...

One arrived damaged; :cry:
The box was torn and the clear plastic over the cells had a couple of foggy white streaks across it. This might have been caused by the break of the box. The plastic also had a number of ripples across it in a couple of areas. I do not think the ripples were we caused by damage. It was poor manufacturing.

When tested side by side for open voltage, it was about 0.2 volt lower than the other panel. When the replacement arrives I will take them to the boat and do an Amp generation test and provide feedback on that, I expect some time next week.
I spent a bit more $ on them, as I ordered from Amazon and am sending it back for a NO COST replacement.

In general;
1. the panels are NOT very robust and will need to be "babied" to insure they are not damaged. Of all the panels I have seen, they are the weakest, structurally speaking.
2. The edges of the panels are sharp, like a cut 1/4 inch thick plastic sheet.
3. The wires for connecting them up do not look well secured to the panel.
4. The grommets for securing them are small!

On the good side;
1. they are small for 100 Watts
2. they are light weight

I think they would best be used by mounting them to a secure hard top or the like that will never see any contact.

Hope this helps some one out there.

Greg

I had always been under the impression that heat was a factor in solar panel output efficiency. Following this thought, I mounted our rigid panels on the Bimini, but with a 1" space behind them to allow air flow. Is this not a factor for flexible solar panels? Can they be mounted to cloth or should they be mounted in cloth, with no material behind them?

 

[Delezynski]

I had always been under the impression that heat was a factor in solar panel output efficiency. Following this thought, I mounted our rigid panels on the Bimini, but with a 1" space behind them to allow air flow. Is this not a factor for flexible solar panels? Can they be mounted to cloth or should they be mounted in cloth, with no material behind them?

Capta,

It's my impression that these panels are flimsy and would not hold up well (permanently mounted) on a sail boat without some type of ridged backing or a frame built around them.

I made an error in the original post (I have corrected it now) about how thick they are. It's more like 1/8 inch thick, not 1/4.

I have decided that I will have to put some type of protection around the panels. Something like split 1/4 inch aquarium tubing, or ????

Greg

 

[JK_Boston_Catalina310]

The quality issue comes up again. If these are at all comparable to the Solbian's, Maine Sail has been mounting those directly onto the bimini with Velcro. http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/solbian_solar_panel

The Sobian's are thin. Maine Sail has a photo comparing the panel to the thickness of a penny.

 

[Maine Sail]

Capta,

It's my impression that these panels are flimsy and would not hold up well (permanently mounted) on a sail boat without some type of ridged backing or a frame built around them.

The panels, or this type, were invented for marine use by Solbian of Italy. They are ideally suited to be affixed to a bimini top or canvas in a semi permanent installation. Alternatively they can be affixed to the deck but efficiency can drop off due to the inability to dissipate heat as well as they do on a bimini..

Of course the Chinese who stole the technology from Solbian do a very poor job of both copying the Solbian and educating consumers as to how best to install or use them.


In most installations they are mounted straight to the canvas using Velcro. The Sunbrella disipates heat extremely well and I find they actually run cooler than rigid frame glass panels likely due to their being less thermal mass, of the glass, to retain the heat.

Note the junction box on a genuine Solbian...

I made an error in the original post (I have corrected it now) about how thick they are. It's more like 1/8 inch thick, not 1/4.

I have decided that I will have to put some type of protection around the panels. Something like split 1/4 inch aquarium tubing, or ????

Greg

They should be thinner than 1/8" but I would not doubt a 1/8" knock off. At the Newport show the importer had a Chinese knock off in the Solbian booth (he is not afraid to show customers the differences). It was heavier, horribly assembled, the j-box and wiring was a joke and it already had blisters/bubbles in it.

We have also seen many of the knock offs not putting out anywhere close to their rating. The performance warranty is also very lacking (on one brand there is none, workmanship and materials only for 5 years). Check with Renogy on the specific performance warranty for the flexible panels.

The best advice I can give is to A/B test all the panels BEFORE you install them. They should all have near identical performance. If not keep sending them back until you get a matched set. Look at both current and voltage when you test them. Best to build an easel and set them on it on a clear day so all A/B's are comparable.

If you do that and they last a few years you got a good deal. DO NOT buy these panels and not test them!!!!

DO NOT bend these panels anywhere near the 30 degrees they suggest you can!!!!!

While the Solbian panels are a lot more expensive they are far superior in construction, they were built and intended for the marine environment and have a proven round the world record as they are widely used by Vendee Globe racers...

The best part about any semi flexible panel is the ability for them to be slid under a berth mattress during storms. Out of the way and no sharp edges banging around the cabin.

There is a Solbian 125W panel under this one:

 

[Delezynski]

The quality issue comes up again. If these are at all comparable to the Solbian's, Maine Sail has been mounting those directly onto the bimini with Velcro. http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/solbian_solar_panel

The Sobian's are thin. Maine Sail has a photo comparing the panel to the thickness of a penny.

As you said, quality is the issue. I have never seen (in person) a Solbian panel, so I can not compare the Renogy to them.

What I am comparing them to is the 3 types of panels that I have and use, or used, aboard our boat. That is.....

UniSolar 32 Watt roll-able panels I bought back in 2001 or so. Still going strong! But heavy and low power per square foot of space.

DuraLite 20 Watt semi-flexible panels. Working good, tough as nails, but also low power per square foot. If I had the deck space I would mount them as you can walk on them!

Our Kyocera 85 Watt ridged panel mounted aft (see photo in an older post in this thread). We like it a LOT! decent power and was mounted in the one spot that I could permanently mount it.

I am planning to store these in our aft cabin and put them out at anchor.
The backs of the panels

Greg

 

[Maine Sail]

As you said, quality is the issue. I have never seen (in person) a Solbian panel, so I can not compare the Renogy to them.

What I am comparing them to is the 3 types of panels that I have and use, or used, aboard our boat. That is.....

UniSolar 32 Watt roll-able panels I bought back in 2001 or so. Still going strong! But heavy and low power per square foot of space.

DuraLite 20 Watt semi-flexible panels. Working good, tough as nails, but also low power per square foot. If I had the deck space I would mount them as you can walk on them!

Our Kyocera 85 Watt ridged panel mounted aft (see photo in an older post in this thread). We like it a LOT! decent power and was mounted in the one spot that I could permanently mount it.

I am planning to store these in our aft cabin and put them out at anchor.
The backs of the panels

Greg

Greg,

The first two panels you list are armorphous, though the Duralite could have been polycrystalline. Armorphous panels deal better with shading and can be rolled or slightly bent depending upon the brand. Polycrystalline or monocrystalline panels have significantly higher output but the silicon cells/wafers are brittle and can only flex so much..

The newer semi-flexible panels are monocrystalline or polycrystalline & are supposed to be ultra light weight to mount on a bimini or other canvas. The cells in these panels are like your Kyocera hence the lack of full roll-ability like the armorphous panels.

 

[Delezynski]

....SNIP....
The newer semi-flexible panels are monocrystalline or polycrystalline & are supposed to be ultra light weight to mount on a bimini or other canvas. The cells in these panels are like your Kyocera hence the lack of full roll-ability like the armorphous panels.

Main,

THANKS for put. I do have a basic understanding of the types of panels. My background is in space craft. We used a number of different types of cells depending on the requirements.

I DO like your Velcro mounting system!
I may try do do a hybrid of it. On my 27 foot boat I don't have a lot of real estate to use.

I would like to mount them on our ShadeTree cover, but they must be able to come off easy as we reef the ShadeTree each night. I do like the idea of the forward shade cloth mounting as show in the photo up the thread. In that case, they would be backed by the open weave shade cloth Jill (my wife) used to made our cover.

By the way, the panel I returned did have bubbles/blisters on the back covering.

I DO believe in testing all of the items we install BEFORE we take them out for a cruise! So, yes I will test them. I do not have test bench setup at home, so plan to use my Link-10 and do a real test of each panel ( individually ) on the boat (now in storage close by) before I accept them. Thanks to Amazon.com I have time to test before I have to keep them and the return policy is GREAT.

Greg

 

[Maine Sail]

Main,

THANKS for put. I do have a basic understanding of the types of panels. My background is in space craft. We used a number of different types of cells depending on the requirements.

I DO like your Velcro mounting system!
I may try do do a hybrid of it. On my 27 foot boat I don't have a lot of real estate to use.

I would like to mount them on our ShadeTree cover, but they must be able to come off easy as we reef the ShadeTree each night. I do like the idea of the forward shade cloth mounting as show in the photo up the thread. In that case, they would be backed by the open weave shade cloth Jill (my wife) used to made our cover.

By the way, the panel I returned did have bubbles/blisters on the back covering.

I DO believe in testing all of the items we install BEFORE we take them out for a cruise! So, yes I will test them. I do not have test bench setup at home, so plan to use my Link-10 and do a real test of each panel ( individually ) on the boat (now in storage close by) before I accept them. Thanks to Amazon.com I have time to test before I have to keep them and the return policy is GREAT.

Greg

A link 10 will work fine. Try and keep the battery/load voltage as constant as you can (same or similar SOC) and set up each panel so they a facing the identical direction on a clear day. Plug one in and measure the current. Unplug quickly and plug in the next one repeat until all are tested for current at same angle, time of day and as close to the same battery SOC and voltage as is possible. You will want your battery in bulk or between 50 & 60% SOC unless you have a bank of resistors etc. to create a known dummy load... The link 10 will work fine for this testing as you just want to see each panel putting out the same or very similar current (+/- 0.1A - 0.2A) under the same conditions.

 

[Delezynski]

A link 10 will work fine. Try and keep the battery/load voltage as constant as you can (same or similar SOC) and set up each panel so they a facing the identical direction on a clear day. Plug one in and measure the current. Unplug quickly and plug in the next one repeat until all are tested for current at same angle, time of day and as close to the same battery SOC and voltage as is possible. You will want your battery in bulk or between 50 & 60% SOC unless you have a bank of resistors etc. to create a known dummy load... The link 10 will work fine for this testing as you just want to see each panel putting out the same or very similar current (+/- 0.1A - 0.2A) under the same conditions.

THAT IS MY PLAN.

Will run the reefer over night and have all other power sources disconnected.

Plan to set up a camcorder focused on the Link and connect/disconnect from on deck. Then review the video. Only have 2 panels to check so not a hard task.

The hard part is waiting for a sunny day. Here in Az. I have to wait till the remains of hurricane Odile passes. May be early next week.

Greg

 

[Hello Below]

THAT IS MY PLAN.

Will run the reefer over night and have all other power sources disconnected.

Plan to set up a camcorder focused on the Link and connect/disconnect from on deck. Then review the video. Only have 2 panels to check so not a hard task.

The hard part is waiting for a sunny day. Here in Az. I have to wait till the remains of hurricane Odile passes. May be early next week.

Greg

Greg,

Have you had a chance to run those Renogy puppies through their paces? Interested in seeing your test results.

Len

 

[Delezynski]

Greg,

Have you had a chance to run those Renogy puppies through their paces? Interested in seeing your test results.

Len

Not yet, sorry. Been working other stuff.

I did test them at home with a meter. Don't remember is I posted it or not, but I ordered 2. when they got here I tested them with a meter at the house. They did NOT match. Sent back the low one and got a replacement. Love Amazon.com! I now have two that match electrically wise.

I actually put them in my truck to take to the boat TODAY. It started to pour rain before I got there. So, no play today.

Greg

 

[Hello Below]

Not yet, sorry. Been working other stuff.

I did test them at home with a meter. Don't remember is I posted it or not, but I ordered 2. when they got here I tested them with a meter at the house. They did NOT match. Sent back the low one and got a replacement. Love Amazon.com! I now have two that match electrically wise.

I actually put them in my truck to take to the boat TODAY. It started to pour rain before I got there. So, no play today.

Greg

I stand by patiently as I am having a real tough time trying to convince myself to fork out near 1 boat unit to buy a single 100W Solbain panel (I need 3). When in 5 or 10 years there will be something on the market that will provide energy at a fraction of the price. Or at least I'm hoping there will be. However, in the mean time there doesn't seem to be an in between expensive and junk to keep by beer fridge running while on the hook.

Len

 

[Delezynski]

I stand by patiently as I am having a real tough time trying to convince myself to fork out near 1 boat unit to buy a single 100W Solbain panel (I need 3). When in 5 or 10 years there will be something on the market that will provide energy at a fraction of the price. Or at least I'm hoping there will be. However, in the mean time there doesn't seem to be an in between expensive and junk to keep by beer fridge running while on the hook.

Len

Len,

I hate to say it, BUT, get used to it. You might be shocked at how much I paid for 4 each 32 Watt flexible panels back in 02. Or, how much power my first reefer used when running. Then how happy I was to find one that used only 4~5 Ah running. NOW running the Engel that uses 2.5 and under Ah.!!!

Things just keep getting better. But no time to wait.

Greg

 

[Hello Below]

But no time to wait.

Yeah, well ain't that the truth.