Fellow liveaboards - any tips for winter insulation?

Dec 28, 2015
1,849
Laser, Hunter H30 Cherubini Tacoma
Pretty tough sail from Boston to Seattle....why wouldn’t he stay in the Caribbean if that was a option? He said he’s going to shrink wrap so the diesel heater is probably out. I’d ditch the blankets on the deck and go with fully enclosed glass insulation battens.
 
May 7, 2012
1,354
Hunter e33 Maple Bay, BC
Meh, it's only 275 or so.
Truth be told, it is much closer than one would think, Phil. Seattle comes in at 147 days/year of rainfall, Boston at 137. Then add a few days of snow to the latter and they are pretty darn close for annual days/year of precip.
But I agree, “275 or so” is close enough.

But this doesn’t help the OP in answering his question. I have a number of friends who spend winters onboard and are plugged in alongside. Insulation is the answer but a help, vice a solution, is heaters and a dehumidifier. With a little care, a 30A power station should feed a Caframo True North (600W/900W/1500W) in the salon, a couple of Caframo Stor-Dry (70W) or other small fans in the forward and after cabins and a small dehumidifier (400W) with continuous drain to a through hull. Tarps draped over the uppers also seems to make a big difference. Whenever I go onboard any of these boats my jacket always comes off, easily 70F plus once the furniture in the boat takes on the heat. Occasionally when the temp falls below 45F, the diesel furnace will be turned on during the day. Shower off the boat and minimize and ventilate when cooking meals that generate moisture.
 
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Mar 26, 2011
3,410
Corsair F-24 MK I Deale, MD
  • Many window screens can be replaced with 1/8" acrylic, making storm windows.
  • Carpet, if you don't have it.
  • Fix the heater.
  • Sometimes the companionway leaks. Put up the dodger and rig a large blanket to drape over the hatch, at least when you are not there and at night.
  • Get a cheap heat gun and scan the walls and hatches. You'll find the cold spots.
 
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Jul 27, 2011
5,002
Bavaria 38E Alamitos Bay
Yeah. It was pretty cold in New England last year as it likely will be again this year. There are yachts out that cruise polar regions but in hemispherical summer, so at least there’s no ice or snow piling up. How to keep the boat “warm” inside when it’s below freezing outside for days on end? Good question. Perhaps “install” carpet over an insulated cabin sole. Install (repair?) a diesel-fired heater (Espar) w/ ducted heat. Run a dehumidifier for the moisture. Get electric blankets for sleeping. The canopy/air insulation idea sounds plausible.

I think you have the most feasible ideas.
 
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Jul 27, 2011
5,002
Bavaria 38E Alamitos Bay
My post from a while back.
Yeah. But are their boats fiberglass hull? One might have a better chance with a wooden ship. More common in Maine I’m to believe. Usually comes to the same question when choosing a boat model. How are you planning to use it? For living aboard in New England year round, a high-internal-volume fiberglass boat with acrylic over portlights, instead of glass, and wide, flat, thin bottoms, & high freeboard, maybe not the best pick. At least starting out, Hunters were Florida boats. Like Catalinas were So Cal boats, etc.
 
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Nov 26, 2008
1,966
Endeavour 42 Cruisin
You can get clear shrink film that uses double sided tape on the frames and creates a double pane window which helps a lot for condensation for all hatches and ports. Big box stores carry plenty of variants by 3M.
Electric heat has no moisture which helps. Is there an extra 110v outlet on the pedestal where you can pull another 15 amps for a third heater via a heavy duty power cord?

Your comforters on deck will probably get wet and loose effectiveness. Consider attic insulation rolls you can roll out on deck and perhaps cover with thin plastic sheet.

Electric blankets don't use a ton of electricity.

A fan to circulate the warm air around helps.

The electric heaters that are oil filled radiators work nice to keep radiating between thermostat cycles.
 
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JRT

.
Feb 14, 2017
2,046
Catalina 310 211 Lake Guntersville, AL
This link is to @JK_Boston_Catalina310 when they lived in MA on their C310 for a winter.


I'd do it their way, all this half baked solitions with blankets and dog pee pads sounds just terrible. Building an enclosure will cost some money but then you could actually fix the leaking ports this winter.
 
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Nov 26, 2008
1,966
Endeavour 42 Cruisin
Hard to know for sure from the OP, but I assume there is a plan to tent the boat with clear shrinkwrap?
 
Feb 10, 2004
3,930
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
I have a Fairclough fitted cover that goes down to the water line. In the late fall and early spring with sun it is quite warm under the cover and inside the cabin. I don't know about the dead of winter. But number one I would get the diesel heater operational. Although I have no experience with one, I suspect it will perform much better than electric space heaters. In a prior boat I had a propane heater in the cabin- a 30 footer. It took a short while, but it made the main cabin very comfy. The vee berth not so much.
For overnight I would get a blonde. Or three. :biggrin:
 
Dec 25, 2000
5,731
Hunter Passage 42 Shelter Bay, WA
Trading a winter in the NE for 300 days of rain a year doesn't seem like a good trade to me.
Phil says 275 rain days, but in order to keep our stories of the PNW proper and in order, it always rains, sun never shines and wind either gale force or none at all, nothing in between.
 
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capta

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Jun 4, 2009
4,772
Pearson 530 Admiralty Bay, Bequia SVG
Phil says 275 rain days, but in order to keep our stories of the PNW proper and in order, it always rains, sun never shines and wind either gale force or none at all, nothing in between.
Gee, that sounds so much better than some warm, tropical place to spend the winter. I'm gonna get through the canal and move up there tomorrow. Thanks.
 
Oct 22, 2014
21,088
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
wind either gale force or none at all, nothing in between.
It blows stink when you are at the dock and just want to relax with some friends, but start the motor and attempt to leave the marina for a sail thewind dies and the mist of the fairies descends on the waters soaking everything in sight. So much water thatit permeates your rain gear and gives a chill to the bone.

Other than that the PacificNW is beautiful. :liar:
 
Dec 28, 2015
1,849
Laser, Hunter H30 Cherubini Tacoma
Phil says 275 rain days, but in order to keep our stories of the PNW proper and in order, it always rains, sun never shines and wind either gale force or none at all, nothing in between.
And we all pay $200+ annual car tabs for the Seattleittes to not ride their lightrail. Ohh wait a minute you guys were fibbing.
 
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CarlN

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Jan 4, 2009
603
Ketch 55 Bristol, RI
Shrinkwrap with tall frame is what they do in colder Maine. Hinged door in shrinkwrap. Huge solar gain “greenhouse” during the day. Insulating air layer at night (close shrinkwrap vents at night). Snow slides off so no shoveling. Press 3/4” styrofoam against inside hull to stop condensation on cold hull. Ventilate during the day. Consider a heat recovery ventilator. Get the diesel heater (espar?) fixed. Most likely candidate is fuel pump, glowplug screen, glowplug. Be very careful of those space heater - fire risk. Even the well known names are cheap Chinese junk. Never run at full wattage (e.g. run at 1000watts not 1500w). Buy new every year. Regularly check inside boat wiring and inside outlets - change at first sign of warmth or scorch marks at a plug. Polish shore power cable contacts and work electrical contact cleaner into plug. Make sure it twists and locks firmly. If you don’t like the look of the marina outlet have them service it before winter.


 
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Jul 16, 2018
125
Hunter 40 Boston
Hard to know for sure from the OP, but I assume there is a plan to tent the boat with clear shrinkwrap?
Yes, it helps quite a bit during the day. It helps a little bit at night. If nothing else, it helps prevent the air circulating over the deck. I'll be doing that again this year too. I was more questioning how to better insulate inside the boat.

You can get clear shrink film that uses double sided tape on the frames and creates a double pane window which helps a lot for condensation for all hatches and ports. Big box stores carry plenty of variants by 3M.

Electric heat has no moisture which helps. Is there an extra 110v outlet on the pedestal where you can pull another 15 amps for a third heater via a heavy duty power cord?

Your comforters on deck will probably get wet and loose effectiveness. Consider attic insulation rolls you can roll out on deck and perhaps cover with thin plastic sheet.
I bubble-wrapped the portholes and that stopped the condensation which I presume means it insulated them enough to be effective.

I'll be using the 30AMP and 50AMP (with a 30 AMP converter) to run both the heaters (and the dehumidifier as needed). Those are the only two connections on the post. It was enough last year to keep the interior safe, but I'd like it to be a bit more comfortable with added insulation.

The comforters mostly stayed dry. Only getting wet where the stays went through the plastic. Still not sure how effective they were. But the good thing is that I can just wrap them up and store them once it warms back up. Insulation rolls seem problematic - tiny shards of glass all over the deck, and hard to store again. Maybe in some key interior spaces?

Get the diesel heater (espar?) fixed. Most likely candidate is fuel pump, glowplug screen, glowplug. Be very careful of those space heater - fire risk. Even the well known names are cheap Chinese junk. Never run at full wattage (e.g. run at 1000watts not 1500w). Buy new every year. Regularly check inside boat wiring and inside outlets - change at first sign of warmth or scorch marks at a plug. Polish shore power cable contacts and work electrical contact cleaner into plug. Make sure it twists and locks firmly. If you don’t like the look of the marina outlet have them service it before winter.

I'm not sure I get the exchanger. It seems more like it's designed to keep the air fresh rather than keep the place warm. If anything, it seems like they help cool it down, just not as much as leaving the shrink wrap door open.

And yes, I'm trying to get the local rockstar electrician to give my wiring a once-over, but he's elusive.

Press 3/4” styrofoam against inside hull to stop condensation on cold hull.
I bought 4 pieces of 4' x 8' x 1" R-5 polystyrene insulation. I'm unsure of how best to apply it. There's a handful of spots where I can cut a piece and put it somewhat flush against the hull. but I was thinking it might be promoting condensation behind the board in the air that's less heated and that seems like another problem. Unless I can somehow make it fairly air-tight.

But I was also thinking it would be nice to line the irregular surfaces too, and I can't imagine cutting board to fit that. So maybe just put board over it and leave a 1" to 2" space behind it and deal with condensation.

Also, carpeting is good idea. (I can't find who said it) and I'll be doing that for my sole. I also have some foam floor tiles (the kind you find at the weight bench at your gym) which is probably at least R-3 and might do better than carpeting.

But I think my main concern is just how to get insulation into all the many irregular spaces and if anything shy of permanently bonded air-tight insulation is going to be a bad idea.

Thank you for the tips!
 
Mar 20, 2011
623
Hunter 31_83-87 New Orleans
Not sure if you had seen these. a young couple (Sailing Uma You Tube videos) insulated their Pearson 36 for colder climates and installed a heater. Hope this helps. In Texas (and south of I-10) we don't have these problems. wish you all the best in keeping warm. Here are the links to Sailing Uma videos.

Wood stove/heater

insulation

 
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