what brand to buy and why: raymarine or garmin or other? Chesapeake and East coast cruising area any thoughts or suggestions will be appreciated
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I cruise the upper Chesapeake and the least
GPS and a VHF radio is all you need, You could round it out with a lot of other stuff. Depth sounders are so essential that I failed to list it as I don't consider it to be optional. The fish finder version is best.
GPS and a VHF radio is all you need, You could round it out with a lot of other stuff. Depth sounders are so essential that I failed to list it as I don't consider it to be optional. The fish finder version is best.
GPS
I have two Garming GPS units and love them. Good friend of mine uses Raymarine, and while his works very well, the Garmin seems to be much more user friendly. Have had no problems with the Garmin, except had some problems origionally getting blue charts into the computer and trasferred into the GPS. But I am only semi literate on the computer. I have found the Garming support people to be top notch.
I have two Garming GPS units and love them. Good friend of mine uses Raymarine, and while his works very well, the Garmin seems to be much more user friendly. Have had no problems with the Garmin, except had some problems origionally getting blue charts into the computer and trasferred into the GPS. But I am only semi literate on the computer. I have found the Garming support people to be top notch.
Second Thoughts
...even though I have and love a Raymarine plotter, I would have second thoughts about dropping a couple of grand into a new one. Instead, I would give strong consideration to a (maybe hardened) laptop running one of the software programs. About half the cost or less and you would have a really flexible system. You certainly don't need to have it out in the cockpit, unless, and a big unless, you are always travelling through shallows and narrow channels. Rick D.
...even though I have and love a Raymarine plotter, I would have second thoughts about dropping a couple of grand into a new one. Instead, I would give strong consideration to a (maybe hardened) laptop running one of the software programs. About half the cost or less and you would have a really flexible system. You certainly don't need to have it out in the cockpit, unless, and a big unless, you are always travelling through shallows and narrow channels. Rick D.
What you need
I would agree with Ross on the essentials. One inexpensive option for chart plotting is SeaClear available free on the web. It uses noaa charts, downlaodable for free, and a lap top. I used last year on my L mich to L Ontario, Great Lakes trip and found it worked very nicely when I was in the US. I did have to spend about $75 for a USB GPS reciever - if you have the lap top already that would be your only expense. I suppose an inverter to keep your lap top charged up - but you can get a cigarette lighter model that would do the job for $20 or so. Raymarine, Garmin, Standard Horizon, or whoever all make good solid products that they back up. Choice really boils down to personal preference.
I would agree with Ross on the essentials. One inexpensive option for chart plotting is SeaClear available free on the web. It uses noaa charts, downlaodable for free, and a lap top. I used last year on my L mich to L Ontario, Great Lakes trip and found it worked very nicely when I was in the US. I did have to spend about $75 for a USB GPS reciever - if you have the lap top already that would be your only expense. I suppose an inverter to keep your lap top charged up - but you can get a cigarette lighter model that would do the job for $20 or so. Raymarine, Garmin, Standard Horizon, or whoever all make good solid products that they back up. Choice really boils down to personal preference.
I agree with ross.
depth sounder is a must. gps is nice but not nesc a must. vhf is also a must. you really don't need all those other gadgets radar,chartplotters,radar detectors etc. in the chesie. S/V que Pasa?
depth sounder is a must. gps is nice but not nesc a must. vhf is also a must. you really don't need all those other gadgets radar,chartplotters,radar detectors etc. in the chesie. S/V que Pasa?
East Coast cruising requires more.
For Chesapeake and the WHOLE East coast here is what I would get in ORDER OF IMPORTANCE Depthsounder...Raymarine...Or Tridata version w/ speed/depth/temp VHF...Icom + handheld. GPS...Garmin GPS76 series...or GarminChatplotter with installed US maps...(GPS478) AND backup battery powered cheap GPS EPIRB... ACR brand w/ built in GPSif you go offshore. Radar...Raymarine...unless you get one of the new Garmin marine networkable plotters which let you add radar for about a grand. (needed for new england or offshore work...not the bay.) *************************** Nice to have: Autopilot...brand depends on boat size and steering type (tiller/wheel)Simrad/Robertson makes a good under-deck and Raymarine wheel/tiller pilots are fine for lighter boats. Masthead wind/direction/speed indicator...Raymarine 42" Flat Plasma TV....<grin>
For Chesapeake and the WHOLE East coast here is what I would get in ORDER OF IMPORTANCE Depthsounder...Raymarine...Or Tridata version w/ speed/depth/temp VHF...Icom + handheld. GPS...Garmin GPS76 series...or GarminChatplotter with installed US maps...(GPS478) AND backup battery powered cheap GPS EPIRB... ACR brand w/ built in GPSif you go offshore. Radar...Raymarine...unless you get one of the new Garmin marine networkable plotters which let you add radar for about a grand. (needed for new england or offshore work...not the bay.) *************************** Nice to have: Autopilot...brand depends on boat size and steering type (tiller/wheel)Simrad/Robertson makes a good under-deck and Raymarine wheel/tiller pilots are fine for lighter boats. Masthead wind/direction/speed indicator...Raymarine 42" Flat Plasma TV....<grin>
Camaraderie, I don't think that my boat is big
enough for all of that and I know that my bank account isn't. I have often wondered if a person becomes a better sailor if he doesn't have a means of calling for the hated coast guard when he get into trouble. I like to watch cats and foxes they never take un-necessary risks and chances because an injury will prevent them from hunting. If they can't hunt, they don't eat, if they don't eat ,they die. If sailors followed the same rules would they still sail their boats as hard? Would they sail boldly in conditions of poor visibility? Would they take better care of their boats? Would they learn better navigation?
enough for all of that and I know that my bank account isn't. I have often wondered if a person becomes a better sailor if he doesn't have a means of calling for the hated coast guard when he get into trouble. I like to watch cats and foxes they never take un-necessary risks and chances because an injury will prevent them from hunting. If they can't hunt, they don't eat, if they don't eat ,they die. If sailors followed the same rules would they still sail their boats as hard? Would they sail boldly in conditions of poor visibility? Would they take better care of their boats? Would they learn better navigation?
Electronics
Ron-- You will find tha all manufacturers of marine electronics are good. The one that is right for you takes knowledge of what your plans are. There legitimate reasons why there are cost differences among electronics. No matter who, or what you choose, there is certain things that you must know. The most important thing is your ability to be able to use them in their intended way. You must be able to be able to see them. You must be able understand what they are telling you. What you need to do is go and take a hands on look and feel for what you want and or need. Let it fit your pocketbook. Understand your needs and limitations. You wont go wrong if you ask the right questions. I know this is exactly what you are doing. there should be no fear in any of the brands out there. BOL. Rob Hessenius
Ron-- You will find tha all manufacturers of marine electronics are good. The one that is right for you takes knowledge of what your plans are. There legitimate reasons why there are cost differences among electronics. No matter who, or what you choose, there is certain things that you must know. The most important thing is your ability to be able to use them in their intended way. You must be able to be able to see them. You must be able understand what they are telling you. What you need to do is go and take a hands on look and feel for what you want and or need. Let it fit your pocketbook. Understand your needs and limitations. You wont go wrong if you ask the right questions. I know this is exactly what you are doing. there should be no fear in any of the brands out there. BOL. Rob Hessenius
Question is a bit open-ended, but...
OK, here goes... I'd have to agree with the K.I.S. crew. Assuming you have two compasses (bulkhead/binnacle mount and hand-bearing) in good working order and properly swung, the minimum would be a depthsounder and a hand-held VHF. I like fishfinders because you can see the bottom profile and can tell at a glance how fast the bottom is shoaling (very nice in channels). They are also pretty inexpensive. My picks after that would be an autopilot, a GOOD radar reflector, a fixed-mount VHF with DSC and a GPS, in that order. I personally prefer paper charts, but I have to say that a GPS with mapping capability is definitely worth having. After that, it's pretty much a question of how much punishment your wallet and the electrical system on the boat can take. That's my two cents...Good luck. Peter H23 "Raven"
OK, here goes... I'd have to agree with the K.I.S. crew. Assuming you have two compasses (bulkhead/binnacle mount and hand-bearing) in good working order and properly swung, the minimum would be a depthsounder and a hand-held VHF. I like fishfinders because you can see the bottom profile and can tell at a glance how fast the bottom is shoaling (very nice in channels). They are also pretty inexpensive. My picks after that would be an autopilot, a GOOD radar reflector, a fixed-mount VHF with DSC and a GPS, in that order. I personally prefer paper charts, but I have to say that a GPS with mapping capability is definitely worth having. After that, it's pretty much a question of how much punishment your wallet and the electrical system on the boat can take. That's my two cents...Good luck. Peter H23 "Raven"
Peter H23 "Raven?
Radar?
You don't say how big your boat is or where you will locate the various instruments. Only thought I have is that if you want radar consider the Furuno units. The chartplotters come ready to plug in the radar antenna which is physically smaller than the Garmin unit. Also won top place in Practical Sailor's last test. If all you want is a chartplotter visit the best chandlery in the area and demo the various units. I think they are all pretty good.
You don't say how big your boat is or where you will locate the various instruments. Only thought I have is that if you want radar consider the Furuno units. The chartplotters come ready to plug in the radar antenna which is physically smaller than the Garmin unit. Also won top place in Practical Sailor's last test. If all you want is a chartplotter visit the best chandlery in the area and demo the various units. I think they are all pretty good.
Tom...
I think you may not be comparing apples to apples. Garmin now makes a 5.2 degree beam width, 18 inch, 4kw radome! While Furuno does make a 15 inch radome it's 2kw with a 6.2 degree beam and they only sell the 15" dome for use with their 1623 LCD radar only display not for use with a plotter. Other wise your buying a Furuno 18 inch dome with 5.2 degree beam and a 2kw signal. The new Garmin radome is going to clean up and yes the first garmin dome was a joke! Once I sell this boat and am out of Raymarine I'll be buying the new Garmin set up for my next boat!
I think you may not be comparing apples to apples. Garmin now makes a 5.2 degree beam width, 18 inch, 4kw radome! While Furuno does make a 15 inch radome it's 2kw with a 6.2 degree beam and they only sell the 15" dome for use with their 1623 LCD radar only display not for use with a plotter. Other wise your buying a Furuno 18 inch dome with 5.2 degree beam and a 2kw signal. The new Garmin radome is going to clean up and yes the first garmin dome was a joke! Once I sell this boat and am out of Raymarine I'll be buying the new Garmin set up for my next boat!
Ross...guess we disagree
Ross...Well...I think an islander 30 has room for the stuff I said I thought was NECESSARY for East Coast cruising. I would say if you can't afford to outfit your boat with the minimum stuff I listed...your risks in East Coast passage-making go up considerably. If we were just talking Ches Bay then I would have said a GPS76 a depth sounder and a VHF would be all that is needed. Once you start going out in the Atlantic you can certainly still do that with those two basics but certainly if you are gonna be coming into New England harbors in fog and with commercial traffic it may be even more important to have radar than a GPS. The epirb you can dispense with I guess if you don't mind going down with the ship when you run smack into the buoy that you didn't see in the fog cause you didn't get the radar. Obviously people have made it across the ocean with far less... I was just trying to give what I thought was a prudent answer to a question that included sailing the EAST COAST and not just in sheltered waters. P.S. I spent 22 years on the Chessie and I've have "done" the entire East Coast and then some...so this is not armchair quarterbacking. You can take what you think you need... I wouldn't go without the stuff I listed above the asterisks.
Ross...Well...I think an islander 30 has room for the stuff I said I thought was NECESSARY for East Coast cruising. I would say if you can't afford to outfit your boat with the minimum stuff I listed...your risks in East Coast passage-making go up considerably. If we were just talking Ches Bay then I would have said a GPS76 a depth sounder and a VHF would be all that is needed. Once you start going out in the Atlantic you can certainly still do that with those two basics but certainly if you are gonna be coming into New England harbors in fog and with commercial traffic it may be even more important to have radar than a GPS. The epirb you can dispense with I guess if you don't mind going down with the ship when you run smack into the buoy that you didn't see in the fog cause you didn't get the radar. Obviously people have made it across the ocean with far less... I was just trying to give what I thought was a prudent answer to a question that included sailing the EAST COAST and not just in sheltered waters. P.S. I spent 22 years on the Chessie and I've have "done" the entire East Coast and then some...so this is not armchair quarterbacking. You can take what you think you need... I wouldn't go without the stuff I listed above the asterisks.
Camaraderie, I was looking at the
traffic lanes around NY harbors. I think that I would plan a passage there during good visibility and daylight. That place is as dangerous as trying to walk across a major interstate highway interchange in the fog
traffic lanes around NY harbors. I think that I would plan a passage there during good visibility and daylight. That place is as dangerous as trying to walk across a major interstate highway interchange in the fog
Radar DOES sound important, but then
there's this, which I post from time to time: ONE MAN'S OPINION September 16, 1997 Cruising World August 1995 C:CStu BoatOPINION.WP6 I can no longer remain silent. At first I thought it was just a few eccentrics, but I am now afraid that I am beginning to see a pattern. I think that the final straw was the recent article I read on sailing in fog that said that if I didn't have a radar on my boat, perhaps I had misappropriated my boating budget. I must confess: I have no radar. Not only do I not have a radar, but I have no intentions of buying one. My new gear priorities list does not even contain this item. I must go on: I do not have a GPS. Can you imagine that I actually sail - even cruise - without one? There's more. I do not have roller furling. Yes, that's right. I actually have more than one jib and what is more, I have to hank it on - one hank at a time - every time I go sailing. Wait! When the wind is up and the seas build I actually go forward, on the top of the deck and - now get this - change to a different jib. Can you believe that anyone can be so primitive? More. My only electronics are a Loran (recently purchased), a speed/log, a depthsounder and a cheap VHF. Yes, I will admit it. My VHF is a low priced model! Furthermore, my electronics are not interlinked or whatever fancy jargon aficionados use to indicate that their electronics talk to each other. No, I do not have an anemometer. At times I can be caught standing on deck estimating the wind speed. I even go so far as to make sail changes based on the boat's sailing characteristics. I have never told anyone this, but I am ready to bare all: I don't have an apparent wind indicator. I am not lying. We use a piece of - I am so embarrassed - a piece of cassette tape tied to the shroud. I do believe it was from "Smurfs Do the Whitbread" or something like that. At any rate, we survive and make port without calling for assistance. We enjoy wonderful meals cooked on the Weber that hangs off the stern pulpit and corn on the cob cooked on, of all things, an alcohol stove. I could go on and on. By now you must have figured out that my boat is OLD (1973). Heaven forbid! It's hard to imagine that I could enjoy sailing under these abominable conditions, but the truth is that I am as addicted as the guy who has all the equipment. I am proud to say that my boat is not a marina queen - she lives on a mooring - from which it is easier to sail her. Her name is Trav'ler and I make sure she lives up to her name. We have lost sight of what this sport is all about. We have lost sight of nature, of ourselves, and our God, unless your God is powered by 12 volts. Mine is not. Once - and I remember this - an RDF was considered a luxury. I remember a trip in fog so thick (you know the cliché) and we made it home with nothing more than a compass, a depthsounder, a sumlog and a VHF. Once we even did a fog run without the sumlog, as it had broken. We just estimated our speed. I know my boat so well that I could estimate her speed within a fraction of a knot. What tremendous satisfaction there is in reaching your port using the true skills of a seaman. We often hear the lament of how nonsailors perceive our sport to be one that is reserved for the wealthy. Is it any wonder when we read articles about how we all should have radar, or how our latest mast project only cost $1,200? These are elitist statements made by people who know nothing about the lives most of us live. Sailing can be done safely and enjoyably on a budget and I feel it is about time that those of us who sail on a budget speak up. Joe Higgins Crystal Lake, Illinois
there's this, which I post from time to time: ONE MAN'S OPINION September 16, 1997 Cruising World August 1995 C:CStu BoatOPINION.WP6 I can no longer remain silent. At first I thought it was just a few eccentrics, but I am now afraid that I am beginning to see a pattern. I think that the final straw was the recent article I read on sailing in fog that said that if I didn't have a radar on my boat, perhaps I had misappropriated my boating budget. I must confess: I have no radar. Not only do I not have a radar, but I have no intentions of buying one. My new gear priorities list does not even contain this item. I must go on: I do not have a GPS. Can you imagine that I actually sail - even cruise - without one? There's more. I do not have roller furling. Yes, that's right. I actually have more than one jib and what is more, I have to hank it on - one hank at a time - every time I go sailing. Wait! When the wind is up and the seas build I actually go forward, on the top of the deck and - now get this - change to a different jib. Can you believe that anyone can be so primitive? More. My only electronics are a Loran (recently purchased), a speed/log, a depthsounder and a cheap VHF. Yes, I will admit it. My VHF is a low priced model! Furthermore, my electronics are not interlinked or whatever fancy jargon aficionados use to indicate that their electronics talk to each other. No, I do not have an anemometer. At times I can be caught standing on deck estimating the wind speed. I even go so far as to make sail changes based on the boat's sailing characteristics. I have never told anyone this, but I am ready to bare all: I don't have an apparent wind indicator. I am not lying. We use a piece of - I am so embarrassed - a piece of cassette tape tied to the shroud. I do believe it was from "Smurfs Do the Whitbread" or something like that. At any rate, we survive and make port without calling for assistance. We enjoy wonderful meals cooked on the Weber that hangs off the stern pulpit and corn on the cob cooked on, of all things, an alcohol stove. I could go on and on. By now you must have figured out that my boat is OLD (1973). Heaven forbid! It's hard to imagine that I could enjoy sailing under these abominable conditions, but the truth is that I am as addicted as the guy who has all the equipment. I am proud to say that my boat is not a marina queen - she lives on a mooring - from which it is easier to sail her. Her name is Trav'ler and I make sure she lives up to her name. We have lost sight of what this sport is all about. We have lost sight of nature, of ourselves, and our God, unless your God is powered by 12 volts. Mine is not. Once - and I remember this - an RDF was considered a luxury. I remember a trip in fog so thick (you know the cliché) and we made it home with nothing more than a compass, a depthsounder, a sumlog and a VHF. Once we even did a fog run without the sumlog, as it had broken. We just estimated our speed. I know my boat so well that I could estimate her speed within a fraction of a knot. What tremendous satisfaction there is in reaching your port using the true skills of a seaman. We often hear the lament of how nonsailors perceive our sport to be one that is reserved for the wealthy. Is it any wonder when we read articles about how we all should have radar, or how our latest mast project only cost $1,200? These are elitist statements made by people who know nothing about the lives most of us live. Sailing can be done safely and enjoyably on a budget and I feel it is about time that those of us who sail on a budget speak up. Joe Higgins Crystal Lake, Illinois
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