Did I make a mistake buying this boat?

TedGrant · Apr 23, 2012

Yes, you made a mistake!
EVERY boat purchase is a mistake!
(This coming from the guy who just made his EIGHTH mistake...)

So now that you've joined this stupid (mostly happy) crowd, let's be practical. You've got the boat, now what? There are two classes of issues: First is dealing with the current mistake, second is making a better mistake next time.

Current Mistake:
- Do the bare minimum to get out on the water. Don’t spend any money or time fixing the boat unless absolutely necessary. It’s not an airplane, you won’t fall out of the sky! That being said, start out on quiet days, under 10 kts wind. No small craft warnings!
- Handle the Admiral with care. You may or may not be the captain; I guarantee you she is the Admiral. If she's not happy, you'll soon be restricted to shore duty or sailing solo. Take the boat out with another sailor, or alone, do NOT start out with the Admiral on the boat. Have an idea what you're doing before you take her out.

Next Mistake:
- Make sure there are no structural problems. Unless you're very handy and really enjoy doing that sort of work, it's almost never worth your time to fix major issues. Plus, lack of such problems lets you flip the boat to someone else if you need to. I always have projects on deck for my boats, but I never let a project keep me from sailing!
- Learn from the current mistake. See what you like, don't like.

Cheers,
Ted

We can only learn through mistakes. If Providence is kind, we get our lessons in small doses, so we live and learn.
-OR-
Whatever doesn’t kill you makes you stronger.
Whatever does kill you... kills you.

DougH · Apr 23, 2012

On a boat this size and at $1,000 ???

Sorry but a survey on a $1,000 boat is a little over the top. Maybe if there was another "0" in the price. Just give them the money and run, you got a good deal for your first boat.

DH

jerseyjoe said:
paying the cost of a good boat surveyor is well worth the investment. This enables one to make a decision based on what repairs should be expected and then get estimates for repairs and know if it's worth the investment. I did actually purchase my boat before I had it surveyed because I knew it was a good price and I was correct. My boat surveyed for $15,000 more than I paid.

Cool Beans · Apr 23, 2012

GaryMayo said:
Don't stick a bunch of money in an old boat trying to make it new again.

Amen to that!

I'm starting to have second thoughts about my "fixer-upper" first sail boat

Especially seeing all the nicer, newer boats on the market for good prices.

I've fixed up plenty of vehicles, and this is NOT like fixing up an old truck

SailingCal21 · Apr 23, 2012

Buying a boat is generally a mistake, it's what you do with it that counts. If it has issues, learn to repair it to make it safe and go sailing.

Erik Garcia · Apr 23, 2012

No mistake!

Bought a Hunter 216, and have had to mend cracks (many), replace the tiller cartridge, and I know there are countless other things that can and will crap out. And I love it: best sailing of my life (also trailer sailing) and I learn new repair skills to boot. Avoid gale force winds and trans atlantic cruises and you'll have a great and safe time. No boat is perfect, and - having used fiberglass and bondo for the first time, recently - it's not that daunting. Enjoy!

We2Sail12113 · Apr 23, 2012

Wet Core? Check CPES Epoxy!!

If you have a concern about the possibility of wet core beneath the mast step, Jamestown Distributers has a video dealing with wet core.

West Systems does also, but there is one important difference between West Systems epoxy and CPES Epoxy (carried and sold by JD Disributers).

Don'e misunderstand me. I am not knocking West System products. I use them and keep them current. The basic difference between the two epoxies is that CPES works in a damp )not a puddle, damp like a towel) atmosphere, and West System does not (or did not).

CPES will cure even if the core is still damp. If going this route and drilling holes, I used a "forstner bit" with a "drill stop" coller on the bit. A forstner bit as it is a flat bottom drill, instead of the pointy normal type. I used a 1/4 inch.

When all was done, I sealed the holes with epoxy, finished it, and painted the area with a good non-skid paint.

Bob

islandjim · Apr 24, 2012

No mistake if you can sail

I think over the years I have heard the doubt of many who just purchased a boat and think they have to put money into it to sail. As noted in previous posts, go out and try the boat, if you have a problem there are always other boaters around that can give you a hand. Sure there will be some maintenance required, but with each repair you do, you will know the boat is that much better than when you purchased it. After a few years you should have worked out all the kinks and have yourself a pretty nice boat.

When I have run into costly problems, I had thoughts of getting rid of our boat, but I hung in there and made the repairs needed and found myself in a better boat than before. Many think twice about investing money into an old sailboat, but if you like sailing, most costs can be overcome and you can enjoy a vessel with growing confidence.

Every season I make up a list of things to do to the boat while she is sitting on her mooring ball. Spending a quiet day on the water in the boat making repairs is much better than doing them in the back yard. Where else can you work on a boat with other boats sailing all around you or neighbors talking with you as you make repairs. You will find that most sailors are some of the nicest people you will ever meet. So try the boat, fix the things that really have to be fixed, and enjoy yourself on the water.

islandjim · Apr 24, 2012

I think over the years I have heard the doubt of many who just purchased a boat and think they have to put money into it to sail. As noted in previous posts, go out and try the boat, if you have a problem there are always other boaters around that can give you a hand. Sure there will be some maintenance required, but with each repair you do, you will know the boat is that much better than when you purchased it. After a few years you should have worked out all the kinks and have yourself a pretty nice boat.

When I have run into costly problems, I had thoughts of getting rid of our boat, but I hung in there and made the repairs needed and found myself in a better boat than before. Many think twice about investing money into an old sailboat, but if you like sailing, most costs can be overcome and you can enjoy a vessel with growing confidence.

Every season I make up a list of things to do to the boat while she is sitting on her mooring ball. Spending a quiet day on the water in the boat making repairs is much better than doing them in the back yard. Where else can you work on a boat with other boats sailing all around you or neighbors talking with you as you make repairs. You will find that most sailors are some of the nicest people you will ever meet. So try the boat, fix the things that really have to be fixed, and enjoy yourself on the water.

SailingCal21 · Apr 25, 2012

I concur with not taking the "Admiral" out till you have confidence. That is unless she is more adventurous than you are.

Prior to sailing my "first mistake" we put in sans-mast to check out the hull and motor-ability of the boat. We figured that we'd test what we could before raising the mast and setting the sails. We also rigged and de-rigged it 3-4 times on the hard, just to check out the standing and running rigging and gain competency prior to committing to a wet sail.

Kinda interesting in the level of responses that you have gotten. Do you think that many of us have been in the same boat as you

Nelsonhow · Apr 25, 2012

If it floats .... it's a boat.....

For $1,000 bucks ...if the water stays on the outside and you have a set of sails and a small outboard that works I'd say you're a sailor.

Have fun with your new old boat and absorb all it has to teach you. The lesson that you need to learn is that you DO NOT HAVE to fix everything. Of course you should address safety issues but you can let the rest of the items keep. With a small boat that you use in protected waters you have much less to worry about. Keep an eye on the weather and do not go out if it looks like it's going to blow....

I agree that the mast step doesn't look too bad as long as there is a compression post in the cabin. (Don't know if this boat has a post or an arch arrangement.... but probably a post). On the motor mount see if you can see the inside if the glass is cracked through the laminate. If so, a backing plate or a fiberglass patch might be in order but my guess it that if you use a smaller motor (say less than 8HP) and are gentle with it you can use it as is without any changes.

An old cheap boat is just that an old cheap boat have fun and don't worry about cosmetics. You can't make a scow into a Hinkley unless you have unlimited time and funds. Don't be to eager to invest your time and money unless you absolutely love THIS boat.

If you only like it... use it andhave fun then and then like the rest of us.... move up!

Bad Obsession · Apr 25, 2012

I agree with a lot of others. Fix the BARE MINIMUM and have fun with it. It is a small boat so the projects usually won't take as long and the systems are basic.

If you have an adequate support to set the mast on, adequate rigging to hold up your rig, and sails that are good enough to catch air then you are in business. You don't need anything fancy.

The best advise I can give to you is remember the KISS principle. Keep It Simple Stupid! In other words there is nothing better than the basics. Don't out think yourself.

As others have said, pick a day with light winds.

The only other thing is to get familiar with the boat before you use it. Set it up in your yard.

Good luck and have fun with it!

kendrick2 · Apr 26, 2012

Hey Ward, Saw your post and couldn't help but wonder if we are taking the safety course and basic keel classes together. I am taking the safety course on the 28th and basic keel May 7&8 at Nelsons in Toms River

Piotr · Apr 26, 2012

If you are not bored with the responses yet, here is one more - I bought a Mac 25 with a lot of small problems. After I inspected everything and realized that to get the boat the way I wanted would exceed it's value, the biggest investment I made was to replace the foam in cushions (the PO stored fuel tank inside and all of them smelled terrible of gas). It was the Admiral's condition to go sailing (it cost about 1/6 of the value of the boat. the second investment was a new main halyard. That's it. I just made sure the boat was safe (replaced the swing keel bolt). I'm slowly replacing stuff butchered by PO (replaced main halyard cheek block, mainsheet, rewired the whole boat), but only things that are safety related (for now).

As to the outboard - my mount is solid, but I ALWAYS attach lanyard to the outboard to make sure it doesn't go overboard (somebody else suggested it above).

I was terrified of doing my own fiberglass repairs until I tried it and found out how easy that was (and any mistakes are easily fixed). Just start doing it, and after a day you'll be an expert.

Definitely confirm if you need a compression post and if the mast step is rotten. That's one issue I would NOT put off. When the mast comes down, people get hurt. I would NOT just fiberglass around the old one without checking for rot. And if it is - well, it's just a piece of wood with fiberglass above it. Just replace it.

When I've got my estimate to build up the fiberglass rubbed off in the keel trunk, it was $800. After talking to the guy who was going to do the work and finding out what should be done vs what HAD to be done, the price went down to $300, and today I would probably do the whole job by myself.

Of what you said in your posts, the total repairs you should do are about $200-$300 (materials) and a weekend of sweat. It will be worth it - I guarantee .

Me and Boo · Apr 27, 2012

The best things in life are free.
Okay so advice is free and the best things cost a few $.

You figure correct, about $500 for the boat. Use this boat for your education. Cut out parts and then put them back together. You will learn boat construction and repair. Better to do that now than on a real expensive boat in the future.

Go through everything on her to learn. Make mistakes and fix them now. Use this boat for your school. Find used hardware to add to her, you get to learn how to drill holes in the deck and hull.

Everything you learn on this boat will be useful at some time in the future.

And have fun.

kendrick2 · Apr 27, 2012

Ward H said:
Wow, that's close. I'm taking the safety course at the auxCG building in Westville (Gloucester Co) and the ASA101 at Barnegat Bay Sailing School 5/11 & 12. (www.sailingnj.com) BBSS is at Cedar Creek. I looked up Nelson's. Cedar Creek looks to be a few miles south of Toms River.
Have fun!

You as well, see you in the Bay sometime. Look for a C&C 24, red boot stripe & If you find yourself laughing it's probably me

cyasurfin · Apr 27, 2012

what is the story behind this boat

Squidd · Apr 27, 2012

E-Bay boat....

Me and Boo · Apr 29, 2012

oops wrong posting for this thread.