Cuba

Dec 14, 2003
1,424
Hunter 34 Lake of Two Mountains, QC, Can
Even though diplomatic relations are being restored, there will be no US tourism in Cuba until the Helms-Burton Act (1996) is repealed. I believe the current administration in the US has set the stage for that to happen but not sure what Congress will do with that, although I have my suspicions.
 

Kper

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Mar 12, 2014
148
Catalina 25 Iowa
This whole thread angers me. It's full of political injections and a completely ignorant disregard to what's best for America as a whole just for a new place to sail.

Go ahead and flame me... I think this should be pulled.
 
Oct 26, 2008
6,248
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
Not sure why you are angry Kper ...

I thought this thread was a pretty good balance between sailing and politics. Like it or not, politics is part of the fabric of our lifes. It certainly affects our sailing ambitions in numerous ways, so it's pointless to try to separate sailing from politics in all instances.

I agree with you that some sailors appear to have their own selfish interests at heart ... but I'm not so sure that hostile relations between US and Cuba is in anybody's self-interest. We certainly have nothing to lose by opening diplomatic ties, except maybe we lose the right to moral indignation. Personally, I think that tourism can be a form of exploitation (when Cuban citizens aren't free). But who knows, maybe that will change with pressure.

I think for years, we have shown deference to our Cuban-American exiles, whom prefer to be hostile to Casto. The Castros are brutal dictators, to be sure. That is what makes me uneasy. Yet, Cuban citizens appear to be enthusiastic for the new developments. Who am I to disagree with their viewpoint?
 
Feb 20, 2011
8,058
Island Packet 35 Tucson, AZ/San Carlos, MX
No, I don't... But I was expecting it. :)

Would I love to sail there? Heck ya, but... no.

Safe travels, fellow sailors and Merry Christmas.
The "discussion" on Cuba in the war room has devolved, anyway.

Happy Festivus!
 

Tom J

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Sep 30, 2008
2,325
Catalina 310 Quincy, MA
Coincidence! The headlines in the local paper read "U.S., Cuba relations resolved". I haven't read the story yet, anyone else read it?
 

Bob Mc

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Apr 7, 2012
34
Catalina 28 Worton Creek, MD
Hey Terry, remember when you told me if I made it to Naples we could go sailing. I think this might be our trip. I'm in.
 
Jan 22, 2008
8,050
Beneteau 323 Annapolis MD
Any other recommendations on cruising guides? good charts?
Ooo. Ooo. I nailed it. I saw this coming- maybe even in my lifetime- so I picked up a used copy of "Cuba: A Cruising Guide" by Nigel Calder. Published in England, 1997. First edition, and is probably the last? It is even autographed by him! What am I bid? :D

Try Bluewater Books and Charts, www.bluewater-info.com ,
800-942-2583 if it still works.
 
May 4, 2005
4,062
Macgregor 26d Ft Lauderdale, Fl
Thanks Ron, I saw those copies on ebay and amazon... those said 1999 edition....

Anything else to consider?


IF (and its a huge if), the Cuban government isn't so worried about human traffic, or smuggling of technology, there looks to be a lot of nice cruising grounds. north and especially on the south coast.

it would be wonderful to gunkhole around cuba, diving and fishing.

maybe some day!


-edit anyone read Cheryl Barr, book?
(this is link for bluewater books (IN FLL) http://www.bluewaterweb.com/?

http://www.bluewaterweb.com/p-48520-cruising-guide-to-cuba-vol-1-varadero-to-trinidad.aspx


 

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
I thought this thread was a pretty good balance between sailing and politics. Like it or not, politics is part of the fabric of our lifes. It certainly affects our sailing ambitions in numerous ways, so it's pointless to try to separate sailing from politics in all instances.

I agree with you that some sailors appear to have their own selfish interests at heart ... but I'm not so sure that hostile relations between US and Cuba is in anybody's self-interest. We certainly have nothing to lose by opening diplomatic ties, except maybe we lose the right to moral indignation. Personally, I think that tourism can be a form of exploitation (when Cuban citizens aren't free). But who knows, maybe that will change with pressure.

I think for years, we have shown deference to our Cuban-American exiles, whom prefer to be hostile to Casto. The Castros are brutal dictators, to be sure. That is what makes me uneasy. Yet, Cuban citizens appear to be enthusiastic for the new developments. Who am I to disagree with their viewpoint?
You are correct!
This is still a good discussion as whats being fundamentally discussed is the current US Law vs. the intrinsic right to freely travel. How in the hell can that be 'political'?
Your commentary on self interest is valid and correct.
Your commentary on the enthusiasm of Cubans is a bit off however, as many still have death sentences or long term imprisonment pending in Cuba.
 
May 4, 2005
4,062
Macgregor 26d Ft Lauderdale, Fl
There are at least 2 sides of every story.

go back to the 1900's when the uss Maine was sunk, and we entered into the Cuba war....
and the ensuing control of the country by Bastista.

The USA has long had a history of selective memory, and rewriting history.

None of that excuses the current dictatorship, but there is a reason Fidel was so popular with the masses, and still is to an extent...


my point is you should not just look at the last 50 years.

Who said the monroe doctrine was fair or just... other than the USA.


regardless of politics, its a unspoiled region, close to my home. I want to visit.
 
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Oct 26, 2008
6,248
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
There are at least 2 sides of every story.

go back to the 1900's when the uss Maine was sunk, and we entered into the Cuba war....
and the ensuing control of the country by Bastista.

The USA has long had a history of selective memory, and rewriting history.

None of that excuses the current dictatorship, but there is a reason Fidel was so popular with the masses, and still is to an extent...


my point is you should not just look at the last 50 years.

Who said the monroe doctrine was fair or just... other than the USA.


regardless of politics, its a unspoiled region, close to my home. I want to visit.
Mr. Bill, please elaborate! What is your point? In 1898, the US assisted Cuban rebels to overthrow Spanish colonization in Cuba. We also did not have intent to occupy as stated by the Teller Amendment and a politically independent Cuba was always the objective. The Platt Amendment was also advanced due to fears of political stability in Cuba and it (Platt A) was eventually a thorn in the side of Cuba (and eventually repealed in the 30's under Roosevelt's "good neighbor policy" - except we kept Gitmo), but the Treaty of Reciprocity was advanced to provide Cuba with favorable trade status with the US. All this in the period immediately following the Spanish-American war was basically advanced in the interest of insuring political stability and prosperity in Cuba - certainly in the interest of the US, no doubt.

Batista was born in 1901 so the immediate years (1900 - 1930) following Cuban independence were certainly not "ensuing control by Batista". In fact, the way I read it, the US was always uneasy about Batista because of his rebellion in the 30's which led to the overthrow of a pro-American government. Indeed, the political in-stability of Cuba, as America feared, was always a reality. It seems that Batista was always an un-easy ally, but eventually an ally nevertheless due to his anti-communist position.

I'm not sure how the Monroe Doctrine is unfair in this circumstance, as you insinuate. The intent of the Doctrine was to prevent Latin America from future colonization by European powers. At the time, all colonies except Cuba and Puerto Rico had gained independence. The Brits were on board with the Doctrine as well. So how does the Doctrine apply with regard to the independence of Cuba?

I think there is no denying that some Americans politicians had at least hoped for annexation of Cuba at the time of the Spanish-American war, but the Teller Amendment to the joint resolution for war against Spain seems to have prevented it.

Marco Rubio made reference a few nights ago to the mystifying behavior of our current President, who also expressed some disdain for American colonization in Cuba, which never occurred.

But thanks for stimulating my interest! I read some interesting things about this topic. It seems that our interest in Cuba has always been for political stability and prosperity - surely to protect American financial interests in the sugar industry in origin. If that's selective memory and rewriting, let's hear the rest of the story. :D
 
Nov 26, 2012
2,315
Catalina 250 Bodega Bay CA
Scott: You didn't mention the Bay of Pigs fiasco where after much assistance and preparation for us to assist in the beach landings we left the rebels to be slaughtered on the beaches! That one was on Pres. Kennedys watch. Chief
 

Sumner

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Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
.... surely to protect American financial interests in the sugar industry in origin. ..
Usually the case no matter where we are. I've had friends that have made the trip and loved it there.



Being also a car guy I would love to go before us car guys here go there and snap them all up.....

There's literally no where else in the world you're going to find a 1954 Buick with a Lada engine, for example. It's estimated that there's about 50,000 vintage American cars lumbering around Cuba still
Sumner

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Sep 25, 2008
1,096
CS 30 Toronto
There goes affordable vacation spot for Canadians.

I am going next week (by air). Before the place got overrun by new tourists.
 
Nov 13, 2013
723
Catalina 34 Tacoma
This whole thread angers me. It's full of political injections and a completely ignorant disregard to what's best for America as a whole just for a new place to sail.

Go ahead and flame me... I think this should be pulled.

Sounds like something they do in Cuba...maybe we are not all that different?
 
Jan 3, 2009
821
Marine Trader 34 Where Ever I am
We have cruised the entire south coast of Cuba and will return as soon as it's possible or if we get another writing assignment. For a glimpse of what that might be like, have a look at our blog post taken from an article we had published in Soundings Magazine. http://trawler-beach-house.blogspot.com/2011/06/cruising-south-coast-of-cuba-east-to.html . Nothing has changed as far as travel restrictions and that will probably remain as is for quite some time. The "normalization of relations" simply means more diplomatic contact and the possibility of more business relations with Cuba. The embargo and travel restrictions can only be lifted through an act of Congress and that will not happen in the near future. But it is the first step. Chuck