I boat in the state of Michigan. I also am a responsible gun owner with a valid concealed handgun license for many years. It is required by law in Michigan, and I assume in other states with similar concealed carry procedures, that the driver of a vehicle, when stopped by law enforcement, must declare when he or she is so armed and produce the concealed handgun license along with the operator's license. But what about when we are on the water? I would think that the same requirement would hold if stopped by law enforcement. Has this ever happened to you in Michigan or any other state? I am asking similar responsible gun owners who may have been boating while armed, if they have ever needed to declare their armed status if stopped by marine law enforcement.
Concealed Carry While Boating
- Thread starter rickwarner
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This is a valid question and I'm leaving it here. However, at the first hint of politics, current news stories, or meta discussions of firearm policies, this goes straight to The War Room.
Thank you for your cooperation.
Thank you for your cooperation.
We were boarded once by Customs & Immigration (!) while anchored off Cat Island on the Mississippi coast. Their first question was, "Are there any weapons on board?" Our (truthful) answer was no. These guys were serious, and I don't think it would be a good idea to lie to them. Or the USCG, or any other LE agency.
A valid question when traveling in many states with firearms.
The 'safest' legal method is to have the arm unloaded, 'cased' and to have the ammunition in a separate place from the firearm. A purpose built metal 'safe' with digital lock bolted to the structure is the least hassle .... as is having arms locked in the trunk of any other vehicle.
For other states such as the North East states, be sure to check very carefully the specific requirements for 'transporting' as they can be all severe and very different.
When confronted its always best to be totally honest, as if boarded you will not be allowed below during any searches, etc. when you declare that you have 'guns onboard'.
Dont forget to include your FLARE GUN in your verbal declaration.
In most venues state/local marine police are not permitted to board you, as thats a function only of the USCG, unless they have specific probable cause of a crime being committed or about to be committed. Best is to carry with you the complete set of each states firearms statues for 'transporting' when traveling through the various states.
As far as I know, Florida is the exception and Leos may board for 'potty inspections'
The 'safest' legal method is to have the arm unloaded, 'cased' and to have the ammunition in a separate place from the firearm. A purpose built metal 'safe' with digital lock bolted to the structure is the least hassle .... as is having arms locked in the trunk of any other vehicle.
For other states such as the North East states, be sure to check very carefully the specific requirements for 'transporting' as they can be all severe and very different.
When confronted its always best to be totally honest, as if boarded you will not be allowed below during any searches, etc. when you declare that you have 'guns onboard'.
Dont forget to include your FLARE GUN in your verbal declaration.
In most venues state/local marine police are not permitted to board you, as thats a function only of the USCG, unless they have specific probable cause of a crime being committed or about to be committed. Best is to carry with you the complete set of each states firearms statues for 'transporting' when traveling through the various states.
As far as I know, Florida is the exception and Leos may board for 'potty inspections'
My state doesn't require disclosement to LEO. I myself carry routinely but can't give you any insite on your question since I've never been stopped while armed on the water.
I was stopped one time for having an armed sailboat when for giggles we mounted a 1" cannon on the fore deck and would fire it over the 4th of July weekend while sailing the lake.
The water cops just wanted to see WTF was making such a boom!
I was stopped one time for having an armed sailboat when for giggles we mounted a 1" cannon on the fore deck and would fire it over the 4th of July weekend while sailing the lake.
The water cops just wanted to see WTF was making such a boom!
I've been boarded more than once, and the first question ever asked is "do you have firearms aboard?"
When I did have a shotgun, I told them where it was, and a coasty with a weapon stood in front of the locker the whole time. Now, I just say no weapons.
When I did have a shotgun, I told them where it was, and a coasty with a weapon stood in front of the locker the whole time. Now, I just say no weapons.
As the former owner of a retail storefront which primarily sold firearms, and a study of firearms laws, I can say that if your boat has a cabin, and is accepted as a dwelling under Federal tax law, then it is your home. This means you can have all the guns you want aboard, loaded, concealed, or otherwise.
The accurate answer to the question "Are there any firearms on board", is "None of your business". However, it's not the polite answer to a LE professional or USCG who are merely looking out for everyone's safety.
This may be entirely UNTRUE on inland waters or even ocean harbors where there are specific local or State regulations regarding possession and types of weapons, including inside dwellings. Or, local or state regulations governing the waters themselves, IE State parks, where in some states firearms are not allowed at all, including on the lake or river.
The accurate answer to the question "Are there any firearms on board", is "None of your business". However, it's not the polite answer to a LE professional or USCG who are merely looking out for everyone's safety.
This may be entirely UNTRUE on inland waters or even ocean harbors where there are specific local or State regulations regarding possession and types of weapons, including inside dwellings. Or, local or state regulations governing the waters themselves, IE State parks, where in some states firearms are not allowed at all, including on the lake or river.
I believe you'll be found incorrect. I base this on a recent discussion on the powers the coast guard has to board vessels registered and or flagged in the USA.
Why in the world would you be carrying a weapon on your person while boating? Otherwise, if a legal weapon was stored safely below, it is of no consequence unless you are being boarded, in which case the LEO should ask if there are weapons aboard. If it is just a safety inspection, there would be no cause for the LEO to go through drawers or cabinets so it would be a non-issue, but were it a more serious boarding and the LEO didn't ask, I might give them a head's up.
I didn't say they couldn't board you, I said there's no law says you have to disclose firearms, or law against having one in the context I described previously.
If they board the boat and find a firearm, or if someone has one on their person, the guardsmen can then admire the stainless steel finish, ask questions about it's shooting characteristics, etc. but they can't confiscate it or cite you for anything. It's your gun in your boat.
Now if you're TRANSPORTING firearms illegally ie: smuggling, or you're a felon in possession, well then that's going to be a problem
The USCG asks the first question do you have any weapons on board? But weapons can be a bit ambiguous since we do have a 12ga flare pistol, several knifes of various lengths, and maybe a gun for some. So the answer should always be YES, then explain.
It seems that wether there be a legal requirement or not to advise a LEO that you have a weapon(s) aboard that it makes perfect sense to do so. You are not relinquishing any of your legal rights to own and have that weapon aboard and it instanstly may relieve some of the anxiety a LEO may have when boarding your boat. Many states allows the carry of weapons in vehicles, RVs, Boats and homes without a concealed license and the Federal regulations allow the transport of weapons from a State were they are permitted to another State where it is also permitted. Your responsibility will be to ascertain which States permit it and which may not.
This all has to be considered with the state in question as a guide.
NY, and NJ do not like people bringing guns into their state, and have repeatedly ignored the provisions of the FOPA that would make interstate transport of a firearm legal.
MD is similarly restrictive of handguns, but seems to have provisional allowances for long guns.
In MD however, there are serious restrictions for having any gun on a boat.
In PA, my home state, there is no duty to inform and widely accepted that you shouldn't unless directly asked.
Similar situation in DE and VA.
I recently read that the USCG confiscated a gun on a sailboat in the NYC harbor and delivered it to the NYPD.
The owner was charged with possession of an unlicensed gun, in spite of the fact that they were not NY residents and should have been protected by FOPA.
I have no idea why the USCG skipper claimed jurisdiction and involved the NYPD, but it happened.
Just be advised that the location matters.
NY, and NJ do not like people bringing guns into their state, and have repeatedly ignored the provisions of the FOPA that would make interstate transport of a firearm legal.
MD is similarly restrictive of handguns, but seems to have provisional allowances for long guns.
In MD however, there are serious restrictions for having any gun on a boat.
In PA, my home state, there is no duty to inform and widely accepted that you shouldn't unless directly asked.
Similar situation in DE and VA.
I recently read that the USCG confiscated a gun on a sailboat in the NYC harbor and delivered it to the NYPD.
The owner was charged with possession of an unlicensed gun, in spite of the fact that they were not NY residents and should have been protected by FOPA.
I have no idea why the USCG skipper claimed jurisdiction and involved the NYPD, but it happened.
Just be advised that the location matters.
This question is irrelevant.
Why he wants to legally carry a gun is of no more consequence than the reasons for his choice of on board literature, or the fuel he uses for his stove.
Concealed Carry
Rick, I see that very few responders understand you're asking about concealed carry. I'm not CC, and only know a few basics, but here are my two cents:
If you're permit carrying, the weapon is on your person, so it's not a transporting situation. I'd treat it the same way I would if I were in an automobile, using the reasoning that, if the LEO or Coastie discovers that you're CC a few minutes after boarding (breeze on your jacket prints you or something), he's not going to like that. I think better to inform.
Here's the problem: during a traffic stop, in many states you're obligated to inform that you're CC to the officer up front, but the script for a boarding is going to run a little differently, so if in such a state, what to do?
If the Coastie/LEO asks the question about weapons before boarding, you have an opportunity to inform, but what if he asks no question about weapons, but does request to board? That's the moment, I think, to tell him, with my hands in plain sight. Then the ball is in his court.
Maybe he decides he doesn't want to do the dance and they push off; maybe his companions are hands-to-holsters as he comes over the lifelines; maybe he gives you some other instruction preparatory to his boarding; but at least you won't be deep into the boarding when he finds out: that's what I'd want to avoid.
Fair Winds,
Jeff
Rick, I see that very few responders understand you're asking about concealed carry. I'm not CC, and only know a few basics, but here are my two cents:
If you're permit carrying, the weapon is on your person, so it's not a transporting situation. I'd treat it the same way I would if I were in an automobile, using the reasoning that, if the LEO or Coastie discovers that you're CC a few minutes after boarding (breeze on your jacket prints you or something), he's not going to like that. I think better to inform.
Here's the problem: during a traffic stop, in many states you're obligated to inform that you're CC to the officer up front, but the script for a boarding is going to run a little differently, so if in such a state, what to do?
If the Coastie/LEO asks the question about weapons before boarding, you have an opportunity to inform, but what if he asks no question about weapons, but does request to board? That's the moment, I think, to tell him, with my hands in plain sight. Then the ball is in his court.
Maybe he decides he doesn't want to do the dance and they push off; maybe his companions are hands-to-holsters as he comes over the lifelines; maybe he gives you some other instruction preparatory to his boarding; but at least you won't be deep into the boarding when he finds out: that's what I'd want to avoid.
Fair Winds,
Jeff
Thanks to Federal Law I am allowed to carry most places (I am a sworn LEO). I still get asked when the Coasties have boarded me about weapons and if I am carrying I let them know that I am sworn LE, I display my credentials, and no hassles. They still check everything on my boat like everyone else.
It is not clear what the laws are concerning carrying a firearm aboard for civilians. The best bet is to ask the Coast Guard and local LEOs in your area because State laws may be different.
If I was carrying as a civilian, I would be concerned when I was sailing certain waters. There are some areas that are "STAY OUT" and if you go in and you have a firearm they may look you very differently.
Honestly, the choice to carry is yours but be smart about it. If you have a weapon it is far better for a LEO to find out about it from you and not find it on their own. Even if you aren't required to say, it is best to be upfront and honest. You don't want to appear to be hiding anything. The answer "None of your business" is not a good one at all, unless you want them to go through your stuff with a fine toothed comb.
It is not clear what the laws are concerning carrying a firearm aboard for civilians. The best bet is to ask the Coast Guard and local LEOs in your area because State laws may be different.
If I was carrying as a civilian, I would be concerned when I was sailing certain waters. There are some areas that are "STAY OUT" and if you go in and you have a firearm they may look you very differently.
Honestly, the choice to carry is yours but be smart about it. If you have a weapon it is far better for a LEO to find out about it from you and not find it on their own. Even if you aren't required to say, it is best to be upfront and honest. You don't want to appear to be hiding anything. The answer "None of your business" is not a good one at all, unless you want them to go through your stuff with a fine toothed comb.
Obivlion, that is so true, how the LEO before you interprets the law is how it will be handed down. Afterwards the attorneys and judges can sort it out. We do not know enough to pass judgement on the State of New York in the case you mentioned. If the gun was loaded and kept within easy access is one thing and wether it was kept ulnloaded in a locked box and the ammunition kept secured away from it is another. The law in NY does not allow for weapons to be carried in a vehicle without a permit and they do not recognize permits issued by other counties or States. I can understand why people in those areas may not be very forthcoming about indicating they may be transporting a weapon. We were seating at a Marina in Long Island and two Coasties on foot (budget cuts?) were conducting safety inspections and boarded us. They asked if we had weapons aboard and we responded that we did not. They did not give it 2nd thought and concluded their business in a proffesional and corteous manner. Is it a case of "we have to ask but don't tell"? You have in the Caribbean some country Islands that have gun laws that make those of NY seem mild. Those people could have lost their boat and been incarcerated so it pays to do your homework well when transporting a weapon.
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