Can a prop be too far gone?

[Hermit Scott]

This was on my boat for probably five years or more with no zincs. Apparently someone cracked a blade and didn't know/didn't care and left it that way. There was/is bottom paint, a black layer and a blue layer, black may have been primer. The surfaces are pitted. I wire wheeled it and the bronze underneath shines pretty good. What is the price range to restore this prop? Can a prop like this be restored?

 

[Randy Burns]

I doubt it, time for ea new one.

 

[kendall]

I'm pretty much with Randy on this.

I'm a big fan of repairing instead of replacing, But this one looks as though there is enough damage that it would come close enough to the cost of a new one to make it not worthwhile.

I'd take it in and get a free repair estimate, then base your decision from that.

Ken.

 

[Tim R.]

Too far gone

You are concerned about the edge that has cracked off. Look at the cracks in the base of the blade where it attaches to the hub. Toss it. Depending on budget, buy a used replacement or a nice new folder. Either way, I would go for a 2 blade to help with your boat speed under sail. A fixed 3 blade like that is really better suited for offshore work in big seas. That thing is like a sea anchor.

I have a used 2 blade. Not sure of the pitch(11RH?) but the diameter is 15". The hub is 1 inch tapered. It was original on an Ericson 35 with a Universal M25XP. I could let you have it for the cost of my favorite Scotch plus shipping. Well, not my favorite but something in the $30 range

 

[Bob S]

It looks awefully big for a Catalina 30?

Hey Scott,

I have a 2 blade prop on my Cat 30, yours dwarfs it. Not sure if that's an issue but I seem to remember discussions on prop walk and properly sizing to the boat. Curious if anyone else thinks so?

Bob

 

[Hermit Scott]

Dimensions

I should have included the dims. The prop is a 12 LH 10. 12" diameter left hand with a 10" pitch.
Tim, I wish that the prop you have fit. I would gladly buy you bottle of scotch for it. Offshore is where I intend to use it.
The repair estimate is $100. But they haven't actually looked at it yet. I just gave them a detailed description over the phone. That is to fix the crack at the base and the chipped off part. And polish it up I guess. I am going to have it powder coated anyway to stop any further corrosion, the finish is not as important to me.
Does anyone know of a good source online where you can get a used sailboat prop. I tried ebay. Not alot of sailboat props, more power boaters there.
A new one online is $250 to $350. Man, I am cheap! If this was the only thing needed I wouldn't mind a new one but she's in the yard now, so I have to pay for all that.

 

[Tim R.]

I wouldn't powder coat it. leave it bronze and it will not corrode if you have a good zinc. Growth shouldn't be too bad as the prop is bronze. You may need to give it a brushing about every 3 or 4 months.

For used props try a surplus shop like Minney's. Also check your local boat yards. I frequently see used props sitting all around their shops.

http://www.minneysyachtsurplus.com/

Call them. They have more than just sails.

I will double check my prop specs tonight just in case I am not remembering it properly.

 

[Maine Sail]

In my experience...

Dezinctification of Bronze can not be repaired unless you melt it down and start over..

The pinkish/coppery colored areas on the prop look like areas of dezinctification. You can see one area where the prop has cracked near the hub, right in what looks to be a heavily dezinctified area.

Unfortunately it's time for a new one.... Did you have a survey??

 

[Ross]

Dezinctification of Bronze can not be repaired unless you melt it down and start over..

The pinkish/coppery colored areas on the prop are areas of dezinctification. You can see one area where the prop has cracked near the hub, right in a heavily dezinctified area.

Unfortunately it's time for a new one.... Did you have a survey??

If you polish the hub the alloy name should be stamped in there. not all bronzes have zinc in their alloy. My prop is Nibral ( nickel aluminum bronze). I rather agree that your prop should be replaced. Check with the shop that was/is going to work on it and see if they have a good reconditioned prop if yours can't be reconditioned.

 

[Hermit Scott]

totaled

After reading everything on here, I think that the prop is now a paper weight. As maine said the dezinctification can not be cured. I will have to find a replacement. I have been calling around but no luck yet.
Tim, I would take a 2 blade prop if it was a 12 LH. I am not sure about the pitch that would be required on a 2 blade. I could probably ask the guys on the catalina website, but I am not farmiliar with that site or anyone on there. The yard where it is on the hard has a 12LH6 or 12LH8, I guess one of those would get me back to the marina, but pretty slowly.

I did not get a survey. I got it sooo cheap that I could put 6k in it and still be ahead. I looked it over myself and decided that there was nothing that was beyond my ability and decided to take a leap. To have it surveyed, it would have to be running, or be towed to a marina that can haul it, then the bottom would have had to been scarped.
I'm kinda winging it and learning things as I go along. If I was spending more than 3,500 on a boat I would have had it surveyed by someone I trust. This will sound a little wack, but after talking with the PO for a few hours, I trusted what he had to say. And therfore I trusted what he had to say about the boat. He had a 26 footer next to mine on his private dock that he completely restored. He told me what the C30 would take to make it sea worthy and I did my own calculations from there.
Maine Sail, do you still get surveys? You seem to me to be the most knowledgeable person I know, when it comes to sailboats. I'd rather have you or any number of guys from this site survey a boat for me than an actual surveyor. For me it's a matter of trust. Someone already told me about the zinc being eaten from my prop by seawater. I did not count that as true right away because he was a prop salesman. His motivation is to make money not to save me money.

 

[Maine Sail]

I still get surveys..

Maine Sail, do you still get surveys? You seem to me to be the most knowledgeable person I know, when it comes to sailboats. I'd rather have you or any number of guys from this site survey a boat for me than an actual surveyor. For me it's a matter of trust. Someone already told me about the zinc being eaten from my prop by seawater. I did not count that as true right away because he was a prop salesman. His motivation is to make money not to save me money.

Yes I still get surveys because insurance companies generally require them from NAMS or SAMS accredited surveyors.

That being said I looked at close to 50 boats before I found one worth bringing my surveyor in on when I bought my current boat. It's been a while since a surveyor found something I had not already found but it can happen.

It was a good thing I found a boat when I did because I dropped my moisture meter off the deck of a boat just the week before. It had paid for itself about ten times over by the time I got to that boat and smashed it. Next time I'll zip my jacket pocket!!:cry:

Anyone can learn to survey a boat but not every one can satisfy the requirements of an insurance company. Oil analysis and rig inspections are two other things that are a good idea beyond a hull survey..

At your price point, sounds like a good deal, a survey is somewhat overkill if you are not getting hull coverage insurance.

 

[Ross]

Re: totaled

Hermit, my research indicates that a 2 blade prop of the same pitch as a three blade needs to be 1 inch larger in diameter or 2 inches more pitch. This spring I had a 13x15 three blade repitched to 13x13 and the prop man showed me that it had started life as a 14x15 and had been cut down. I paid 75 for it and 125 to have it repitched and straightened. Money well spent.

 

[TT23844]

Hermit - In your case, perhaps you should ask a more fundamental question : was that prop a good choice for your boat in the first place? To judge from your photos, the blade width is huge for aux. power on a sailboat. It looks more like a prop for a motorboat and, as someone has already commented, would create a helluva lot of drag under sail. I had a very similar prop on my boat when I bought it, a Michigan Dyna-Jet 13 x 8 LH. It had the same wide blades as yours, and in addition to creating much drag when sailing, it loaded my little Yanmar engine so much I could only reach abt. 2500 RPM at full throttle. Michigan Wheel have a good on-line site where you can look at their props that are designed for your application : you'll see that the blade area is much smaller. Don't just throw a prop on the boat: do a little research and try to get one that is a good match for your hull & engine. The Michigan Whel site has a calculator where you can enter your boat/engine data and get a spec for the correct prop for your boat. It's free too. Good luck.

 

[Tim R.]

Sorry Hermit

It is deffinately a 15" RH.

I envy your dedication and bravery. I have thought about doing what you are doing but economically it really is better to buy the very best boat you can. However, you are learning a great deal about boats and you will carry that forward when you upgrade. And don't worry about all those other boats that are shinier or bigger or sail faster. You will have as much if not more fun on this boat especially knowing all the work you have invested.

 

[Hermit Scott]

prop talk

Tim, I DID buy the best boat I could. I'm not rich like you guys...yet.
I'm a struggling inventor that lives in his shop. Economically I didn't have a lot of choices to which boat I was going to buy. I'm not ashamed to say it, becasue I NEVER worry about what the other guy has that I don't.
I realized long ago that if I keep looking for the next thing to make me happy in life, that my life would pass by without happiness.

 

[Steve Dion]

Re: prop talk

You can't fix one for the prices that these guys sell them for.

http://www.minneysyachtsurplus.com/p1.html

 

[Manny]

Re: prop talk

Wow, great link Steve!!!! That's definitely being added to my bookmarks! Great prices!!!

Manny

 

[Hermit Scott]

YUP

Tim R. posted that also. I did check them out. I gave them a call; they didn't have the exact match as the prop list says, but as TT238599867 has pointed out, it may not be the best for my boat anyway. They did have a 2 blade prop that was the same diameter and pitch though, and I will probably call and get that one tomorrow. Thank you for that link guys, those are the cheapest props on the net unless you can get lucky on ebay somehow. I just don't have the time to wait for that right now. So it will be $80 shipping included.

SO...my prop shaft looks the same nasty pink color as my broken prop. I assume it's toast too? I can make one out of 316 stainless for around $100-150. Do I want to make it out of 316 or doI want to make it out of the nibral as Ross pointed out that his prop is made of? How does 316 do submersed with zinc on it?

I'm going to fix that after I put it back in the water though. I figure I can slide the prop shaft out and have some one put a plug in the packing tube. Then slide it back in and have them take the plug out while I slide the shaft in. Is that how it's done in the water?

 

[Manny]

Oops!

Your right Hermit, Tim did also post the link
Kudos to Tim also

Manny

 

[Manny]

Re: YUP

Hermit, how long are you going to be hauled out for? Changing the shaft in the water sounds kind of difficult. For one thing getting the flange off old shaft and back on the new one while in the water might be tricky. Also if you are replacing the shaft and the prop you would probably want to put in a new cutlass bearing and definitely repack the stuffing box...
It never ends, does it?

Manny