Adrift in movies tonight ...

[25yearslater]

Yeah, but where does this "adage" come from? What validity does it actually have? Anyway, that's not the version I've heard. It's more like: "If you're thinking about reefing then you probably should be doing it, etc." and "Reef early." However, "serious sailors" probably do not pay much attention to the "guidelines" and "adages" expressed by the dilettantes.

There's a whole other point of view out there derived from the clipper sailors and since them, racers; namely, you should carry all the sail that the rig can bear [to make destination in good time.] You even hear in Mutiny on the Bounty, Capt'n Bligh (Laughton): "No change of sail without my order."

Tsk, tsk. Quibbling over semantics are we. We are talking about a Cat 4 hurricane here. No and I repeat no boat could take the forces exerted on sails in winds exceeding 140 knots. My BS meter goes off the scale when I hear outlandish claims to the contrary. Been through a Cat 1 on a 340 foot ship and it is virtually impossible to walk on deck. A small sailboat has less chance of keeping the rig up with sails than the snowball surviving in a hot place. Perhaps they could use 50 ounce cloth for sails but when the chainplates tear out those missiles are going to be a joy to avoid. Perhaps the El Faro crew could have used some tips from experts here.

 

[jssailem]

I don't know many 30-something year-olds who would be studying weather patterns while having a love affair w/a new girlfriend,

Even if they did consider the weather, as the poet states...
"We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."
- Anais Nin

There vision would be clouded by the emotions.

 

[jssailem]

Perhaps the El Faro crew could have used some tips from experts here.

But then there would be no "fantastic" story and no need for a movie.
Recently read the accounts of the typhoon that disrupted the Halsey fleet heading across the Pacific in 1944. It discussed the lack of weather specific knowledge, the lack of proper planing or the smaller vessels and the benefits of being on a Carrier in a troubled sea. From the standpoint of the Destroyer Captains, they were left with few resources and lucky to survive if they did. Not all did.

 

[Kings Gambit]

Tsk, tsk. Quibbling over semantics are we. We are talking about a Cat 4 hurricane here. No and I repeat no boat could take the forces exerted on sails in winds exceeding 140 knots. My BS meter goes off the scale when I hear outlandish claims to the contrary. Been through a Cat 1 on a 340 foot ship and it is virtually impossible to walk on deck. A small sailboat has less chance of keeping the rig up with sails than the snowball surviving in a hot place. Perhaps they could use 50 ounce cloth for sails but when the chainplates tear out those missiles are going to be a joy to avoid. Perhaps the El Faro crew could have used some tips from experts here.

I did not mean to imply sailing in a hurricane is a viable thing to consider. I meant that an experienced (serious) skipper does not rely on "adages" to decide when to reef or otherwise shorten sail, etc., so why know about them?

 

[Kings Gambit]

But then there would be no "fantastic" story and no need for a movie.
Recently read the accounts of the typhoon that disrupted the Halsey fleet heading across the Pacific in 1944. It discussed the lack of weather specific knowledge, the lack of proper planing or the smaller vessels and the benefits of being on a Carrier in a troubled sea. From the standpoint of the Destroyer Captains, they were left with few resources and lucky to survive if they did. Not all did.

If I recall it correctly, Halsey was actually on a battleship during that experience. I remember being surprised by it; but, I could be wrong in my recollection.

 

[jssailem]

You are correct KG. Halsey was on the New Jersey.

"Halsey was in his flagship, the 45,000-ton battleship New Jersey..... part of Task Group 38.2."​

 

[Kings Gambit]

You are correct KG. Halsey was on the New Jersey.

"Halsey was in his flagship, the 45,000-ton battleship New Jersey..... part of Task Group 38.2."​

Most of the publicity has had him on a carrier as his flag ship at different times (e.g., as in The Caine Mutiny--movie version); so, as I said, I was surprised to read his flag ship was actually a battleship during one or both of those typhoons. Obviously, The Caine Mutiny fiction was a take-off on the real-life typhoon episodes but one which had Halsey on the U.S.S. Enterprise, I believe, instead of the U.S.S. New Jersey.

 

[jssailem]

Yes... While the Enterprise was sweet and I have a personal connection to the name and CVAN65 you just can't take the Battleship out of an Admiral.

 

[JRT]

My grandfather was a plank owner on New Jersey and told me of that event.

 

[All U Get]

Most of the publicity has had him on a carrier as his flag ship at different times (e.g., as in The Caine Mutiny--movie version); so, as I said, I was surprised to read his flag ship was actually a battleship during one or both of those typhoons. Obviously, The Caine Mutiny fiction was a take-off on the real-life typhoon episodes but one which had Halsey on the U.S.S. Enterprise, I believe, instead of the U.S.S. New Jersey.

Yes... While the Enterprise was sweet and I have a personal connection to the name and CVAN65 you just can't take the Battleship out of an Admiral.

Where could I get some info on the USS Enterprise, my wife's father had been aboard. Sorry to drift so far from the thread.

 

[kappykaplan]

CV-6: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Enterprise_(CV-6)
CVN-65: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Enterprise_(CV-6)

 

[Soñadora]

With the last kid out of the house in 6 years, my sailing dreams have been rekindled. I've been scarce from this forum for quite some time. Long before the new digs. I like it.

So, naturally, with a renewed passion for our future cruising goals, we went to see "Adrift". Then, the next day, watched "All is Lost". We both commented that no one was wearing a life jacket. And that gave us comfort because "we're not THAT stupid."

I read 'Red Sky in Mourning' years ago. Very poignant story. I don't fully recall in the book and didn't read all of this thread, but my recollection was that they were warned about the possibility of cyclones. I reckon they realized there was a risk, but figured they were good enough sailors that they could manage it.

Personally, homey don't do hurricanes.

 

[NotCook]

Maybe I'll the only one who thinks it was silly and overly dramatized.

How can any knowledgeable sailor enter a storm, while not wearing a vest, under full sail?

How could anyone expect a radio to work after a pitch pole demasting?
While powered by flooded batteries...
While an electric fresh water pump worked under water?

Where did they get an EPIRB in 1983?
Why didn't that imaginary futuristic thing work?

I could list more flaws but I guess I was expecting a realistic plot.

I still thought it was a pretty good movie, despite those flaws. I’m guessing many of the flaws in Adrift might have been documenting what actually occurred. A lone, non-sailer might actually try a radio, hoping it would work, not thinking about the electronics being out, or the antenna being under water on the top of the mast, for example. Some of the other flaws, great observations.

Still, Infinitely better than All Is Lost, which had even more flaws.

 

[Kings Gambit]

Good point! But to head north on a port tack in the North Pacific, the cyclone (storm winds) would have to be arriving from west of their position, it seems. It was not clear from the movie the location of the storm.

So, I just watched the movie again on Pay-Per-View. Some of the "mystery" I invented earlier is resolved. Before tacking in the movie, they were in eastern North Pacific near 11 deg N, and more-or-less close hauled on the port tack. They were sailing into the seas. When they got the Cat 4 warning the storm (Hurricane Raymond) was heading west so they decided to tack, come about to the stb tack, and head north, still punching into it from the appearance of the "seas." Unfortunately for them the storm track changed; it started heading WNW making about 15 kt, winds peaking close to 130 kt (64 m/sec) near 12.4 deg N, 121.2 deg W. They were caught in it & the boat pitch-poled, etc.

Having seen it again, the movie is not so much about sailing as it is about her struggle to bring the boat to Hawaii in the aftermath. We can excuse the Hollywood absurdities in the screen play; it happened. They were there, the boat was pitched and rolled, the skipper was lost, and she made it through a truly horrific ordeal!! Actually, not a bad movie.

https://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/pdf/10.1175/1520-0493(1984)112<1419:ENPTCO>2.0.CO;2

 

[DAVA390]

Just watched it this afternoon, Admiral had a few eye rolls at me as I picked at a few things. Did some research on Tami after we watched it, some interesting stuff there. She lost a daughter last year, rough going.

 

[PotomacDaysailer]

First mate and I finally caught it on ppv night before last. I liked it. I thought they did OK considering it was meant for the mass market - more faithful to the facts than usual even with movies billed as "a true story". Shailene Woodley is a dead ringer for the young Tami Oldham. I was very impressed by the real Tami Oldham's story, her courage and resourcefulness at just 23 years old was remarkable.