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Hurth HBW50 replacement

Discussion in 'Catalina 30' started by uralite, May 18, 2018. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Today was quite the day. 7D93FB71-4EF1-4E33-96B4-BFACA21CA56F.jpeg
    Got the shift lever in place. The threads on the pressure sensing unit were indeed buggered. I used a tap to recut threads, tried to insert, but see why they used bronze nipples. The unit comes in contact with oil filter and bracket for alternator. Will have to keep on it. There has got to be a way to reduce length of piping. Got some help from mechanic at marina today. Was glad he did tap, I was scared to bugger it up more. Plus we ruled out electrical issues. Looks like I’ll have to replace starter and solenoid. Will deliver Tuesday. Omg, one thing after another. I have now got mad skills with using extensions and swivel socket to get starter bolts on and off. Like butter, only drew blood x2. It was only a flesh wound.

    Gotta get this thing working.

    On a more positive note....baby number 4 . Found out the wife and I are gonna have number 4. ...whoooo hoo!!!!
     


    Last edited: Jul 6, 2018
  2. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    9A53602F-A12A-4DBF-B615-9A2C5250A7EE.jpeg
    Guess it’s a Kubota d722, still can’t find ID number, almost took off valve cover to see if I could scrape paint off, maybe tomorrow
     


  3. Maine Sail

    Maine Sail Moderator

    Joined Feb 6, 1998
    10,713 posts, 542 likes
    Canadian Sailcraft 36T
    US Casco Bay, ME
    Please be aware that the oil pressure tappings on your Kubota are JIS threaded not NPT. For tapered threads BSPT and JIS are interchnageable.
     


    jviss likes this.
  4. jviss

    jviss

    Joined Feb 5, 2004
    3,069 posts, 402 likes
    Tartan 3800
    US Westport, MA
    Good one, @Maine Sail , and good to know! I assume this would apply to Mitsubishi (some Westerbekes) as well?
     


  5. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Waiting on starter, coming Tuesday. But 3 kids and spouse got to sit in cockpit and watch the show Sat night. I wished I had recorded the finale

     


  6. Ward H

    Ward H

    Joined Nov 7, 2011
    1,846 posts, 223 likes
    Catalina 30 Mk III
    US Barnegat, NJ
    @uralite
    Just an FYI, I've been following your thread with interest. Give you a lot credit for what you have taken on. Glad you got a chance to enjoy the fireworks with your family.
    And a big congratulations on the new addition!
     


  7. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Dear Ward, thanks for your encouraging words, I cannot tell you how they help. Ordered new starter, for Kubota d722 are shims something I’ll have to worry about for flywheel alignment?
     


  8. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Oh boys, I am just loving boat projects. The new starter came in Tuesday... That being said....I got it today. Mechanic was busy in the bilge of another boat and did not have a chance (since Tuesday) to look at it to see if it was the same. I took it and installed in the boat....it was quite of bit rounder, much shorter....the moment of truth..........lots of grinding of flywheel and no start. BLEEP, BLEEP, BLEEP!! I wanted to be so mad at the mechanic, but truthfully, customer service issues aside, I am guessing that the flywheel is also "upgraded" and starter is going to be the same as the flipping damper plate. I took it out, found him and compared to original which is nowhere near alike. I am told by parts guys that they are universal, do not need to be shimmed and that starter should work for Kubota. Of course it should!!! But this is not going to be easy and successful.....I am told that there is one other model it could be, it is being shipped to Spokane tomorrow from Seattle. I told him to give me the starters and I will just drive there for him to look at it in hand. Why bother, it will be another 4 weeks to figure that process out if I don't just drive there. FUBAR...CF. If I have to have it rebuilt it will be some time to get back to it.

    Then a truly need to change my shorts moment.....the mechanic asked me if the flywheel turned........I had a moment of abject horror.....the oil running out of pressure sensing unit, starter solenoid firing but not engaging flywheel?!?!?! Crap, did it work after I lost oil? I topped it off with maybe a quart to quart and a half.....OMG. I said "dah, of course" to the mechanic, calmly left the shop, then ran back to the boat and got out my screwdriver. I reached into the flywheel from vacated starter hole......and the damn thing did not turn. Desperately tried again when I realized....that its a left hand turning engine and I was trying to turn it the wrong direction..aaaggghhhhhh!!!!! . It is turning fine.....both directions. PRAISE GOD.

    Here is the oil pressure sending unit. It is still cobbled together, with old buggered threaded nipple and not what I would like. I have some new parts to try and make it shorter and in better shape. I cannot get a pipe wrench in there, so I only have a small vise grips (YIKES I know). I thought about a short extension, a 90 deg elbow and then sending unit. Im not going to do it until starter is in because that banging around was what bunged it up in the first place.
    IMG_2898.JPG

    I am open to any suggestions, as you can see the sending unit will not be able to be screwed directly into case due to proximity of oil filter and that little threaded dog ear (which I do not know what goes there). I thought maybe if I did the 1 1/4 threaded pipe, 90 deg elbow and then sending unit it would reduce the weight and allow it to be out of the way with less chance of injury. What do others have in that spot. This is a kubota right? WTH do other people have in that spot?
     


    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
  9. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Ok, so seriously, I was looking at this and pondered if I could train my 3 & 6 y/o with a little outboard so we could use it as a tug. Im sooooo tired of sitting at the dock during these perfect days!! Not sure the owner would spring, not so sure I would either. But the DESIRE is there. Not sure my wife would let the 3&6 y/o handle the ding ding tug, but I have NO doubt they could get there quick. IMG_9010.JPG Seems pretty nice for $500. Aluminum floorboards, seems solid. Anyone have one? Ratings?
     


  10. LeslieTroyer

    LeslieTroyer

    Joined May 20, 2016
    1,770 posts, 616 likes
    Catalina 36 MK1
    US Everett, WA
    The old M25’s had a hose nipple in the engine block hole your using for op switch and op sensor. Then a hose ran the oil to a manifold with three taps located ahead of the heat exchanger - only the center tap was occupied by the op switch. The oil hose ran into a side tap. Maybe something like that would work for you.

    Les
     


  11. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Thanks for suggestions Les. I’m trying to visualize what that could look like and what materials to use, and where to put it. What if I used fuel hose, double clamps, and run to suspend from wiring harness near wiring for units? They make bronze nipples with hose barbs.
     


    Last edited: Jul 13, 2018
  12. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Omg. 4436B1E5-99E9-49B5-B75A-F5DDA155C922.jpeg
    Starter in. Fired right up. More updates to follow. Shift cable nightmare in junked up locker, transmission did 15-20 min, got hot, but able to keep my hand on it....got more to do....but just had to get OFF THE DOCK!!
     


  13. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Here is video of transmission in gear, still need to lock down mounts with split lock washers. I need to figure out oil pressure sending unit. But here is after starter. I also need to change fuel separator filter, it threatened to puke out and it was hard to start. The fuel filter has not been changed in over 3 years, maybe a little dirty? Could just be dirty and need to run for awhile. After I ran it for 15-20 min with frequent speed changes, the gearbox was definitely hot, but it was cool enough that I could keep my hand on it. This is supposed to be solid test for transmission on Russian motorcycles, hopefully it holds true for sailboat transmissions too. It seems to have a lot of vibration at idle, with early engagement, then smooths out with throttle. I am planning on having it checked out by marina mechanic. Never hurts to have work checked.

     


  14. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    I should not let you see my un-seamanlike behaviors, but the marina was absolutely dead tonight. No one got to share in the glory!! Last night I drank cold beer to drown my sorrows, tonight I toasted to glory!! I still have a TON to do...but maybe Ill get to it in a few weeks....seriously, my family needs to experience some fun on it.





    The furler is a nightmare, I need to bring it down and lube bearings. The line around drum is old and thick, it binds and bunches so you cannot get the whole sail out. Different post for that.
     


    Last edited: Jul 13, 2018
    Ward H and BrianRobin like this.
  15. CaptnDean

    CaptnDean

    Joined Apr 27, 2014
    18 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 30mklll
    US Hudson, FL
    Regarding the oil pressure senders, I used a "grease hose whip" that I purchased at NAPA for about $10. It is complete with 1/8" NPT fittings attached on each end and is rated for about 3,000 PSI. I think it was about 10" long. I made a bracket that I attached to the engine near the starter mount to hold the sender units. If necessary, you can purchase an adapter to go from NPT to BSPT. (I don't know it NAPA has the adapter, but I've seen them on Amazon).
     


  16. Ward H

    Ward H

    Joined Nov 7, 2011
    1,846 posts, 223 likes
    Catalina 30 Mk III
    US Barnegat, NJ
    Congratulations getting out on the water! I know its been a long haul.

    I didn't see it mentioned so I'll ask, did you align the motor to the prop shaft? In your video it seems to be vibrating a bit.

    Now hopefully you can balance working on the boat and sailing it.
     


  17. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    Hi Ward, Thanks again for encouragement. I did spend quite a bit of time aligning using feeler gauges, I am not sure how centered in the bearing tube it is and I am wondering if the cutlass bearing is needing replacement. That will have to wait, hauling the boat now is not likely to happen. There is a lot of vibration with the boat at idle without the transmission engaged. Im going to have her checked out by a marine mechanic to double check my work.
    I spent all that time, I don't want it to do anything else major. I also am nervous about doing any long motoring until its checked out.
     


  18. Ward H

    Ward H

    Joined Nov 7, 2011
    1,846 posts, 223 likes
    Catalina 30 Mk III
    US Barnegat, NJ
    I just went through this with my C30.
    I checked the alignment, made some adjustments, thought it ran with more vibration. Had yard guy check my work. He advised it was very close and just shift the front of the motor over a very small bit. I did that and checked again.
    Then I noticed there was as much more vibration at idle and medium throttle while in neutral as in gear so I believe I am OK.
     


    Last edited: Jul 14, 2018
  19. Alan Gomes

    Alan Gomes

    Joined Nov 22, 2011
    582 posts, 73 likes
    Ericson 26-2
    US San Pedro, CA
    You did confirm that you have the correct transmission fluid at the correct level, right? (Figured it wouldn't hurt to ask.)
     


  20. uralite

    uralite

    Joined Apr 26, 2018
    92 posts, 30 likes
    Catalina Catalina 30
    US Bayview
    1D289B8E-DAA9-4290-8548-A7BAB0A82B19.jpeg

    Can’t see it in pic...but check
     



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