Yet another keel question

[Redemption]

So I know most of the vets around here have been through this question before as my research has shown a number of swing keep questions. However none of them really touch on my issue.

Having spoken with Blue Water yachts we are trying to figure out what the hell my boat is weather the make or year is off which is somewhat unrelated but anyway I am working on the underside and tomorrow is stands and primer on the remainder of the underside.

The Issue: The keel which is covered in fiberglass or plastic or something is in awful shape so Im considering doing some repair work. However here is the issue BW Yachts tells me that their vessels in that year bracket did not come with any fiberglass or anything over the keel sooo im looking at it and thinking to myself, do I need the material there or not. I would consider the wear of the glass or whatever it is to be heavy enough that Im concerned of the condition of the keel under it (sagging and split fiberglass) Of course until I get in there and start tearing it off I wont know. so the question is, do I need the cover thats over the keel? is there a benifit to having that cover?

 

[dmc]

I own a 23' Clipper Marine.......

swing keel built in 1976. After a few years of the boat being in storage the keel had quite a bit of rust on it. I checked with the people from West Epoxy System, they said a cover of epoxy would prevent future rusting. The trick is to cover the keel immediately after cleaning all rust from the keel. I did this and it works.

Peace

dmc

 

[MSN-Travelers]

We owned a Mac for several years. It was the 26M model. It sounds as though you have the 26S model ("S" for swing keel). Sometimes referred to at the 26C (classic sailboat vs. the powersailors 26X & 26M). The 26D and 26S were basically the same except the D had a daggerboard & the S a swing keel.

If you haven't already found it, I strongly suggest you go to the MacGregor Sailors web site at - http://www.macgregorsailors.com/ It is the most active MacGregor site I found and a treasure trove of information.

Good luck ....

 

[Sumner]

If your boat is an S (1990-1995) then it has a swing centerboard (keel) and could be an after market centerboard. IdaSailor....

http://www.idasailor.com/catalog/default.php

... made these along with their great rudders. Our boat had both on it when we bought it.

Here is a picture of ours....

...it is solid and at the time the picture was taken we were painting the bottom...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor2/outside-39.html

....and after the picture we put bottom paint on the centerboard. It did not need a barrier coat like we put on the rest of the boat since it can't blister.

Yes come over an visit us on the board listed above,

Sum

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

 

[Redemption]

I have a 71 or so the title claims it is 26 feet and bears a striking resemblance to a 24 foot mac I have seen on google images. now the title also claims it to be a mac.

Here is where my doubt lies on this a search of the hull number online (which is only on the title due to the age of the boat) says the boat is home made which I know is a common thing but also the people at BWYachts have looked at photos and said that in 71 and in fact all of the early 70's they didnt make the macs or ventures in 26 foot so now im like durrr so it is making it hard to find any info on that or stuff like the rigging setup or if I need fiberglass on the keel or if paint will suffice etc etc

 

[Paul Brinkley]

Redemption- there seems to be a lot of confusion in this thread; let's try to straighten it out. First of all, the length of the boat: if you have a water ballast boat, it is a 26 footer, made in 1987 or later. 26 footers were made with either a fiberglass centerboard (26S, made 1987-1995) or a daggerboard (26D, made 1987-1989). If it is not a water ballast boat and it has a metal swing keel with or without a fiberglass covering, it is a 25 or less footer. On these boats, made in or before 1987, the metal keel is the ballast and it has a winch to raise it. Some of those models had keels covered with fiberglass, and some did not. It is also possible that a previous owner had the keel covered with fiberglass as part of a repair. This should help you narrow the model and year. -Paul

 

[Redemption]

Paul good idea ok

On visual inspection:

I have a boat that from bow to stern not measuring anything extra is 25 feet, including bow railing and engine mount maybe 26 feet. it is a swing keel there is NO water ballast there isnt a tank to be had on the vessel. the interior is a baby blue with like a weird 70's era wallpaper. I can say that the mast does not appear to be consistent with that year of mac and could have been changed I havnt measured the mast but it is longer than the boat by several feet so it may be a 28 or 30 foot mast some of the cleats are that weird material that looks like etched wood some are aluminum the pullys are that weird material and the winch drums also contain material of this type as well. I have not gone through the running rigging terribly well but what appears to be the down draw and outdraw assembly is also that weird material

The title:

the title claims I have a 1971 Mac S hull which is swing and also claims it is 26 feet.

The hull number: Which is on the reg and title only (this is consistent with the year the title claims) However I put the hull number into www.boathistoryreport.com and here is what it says: HIN: nmz007901181 Model Year: 1981 Certification Year: 1981 (November) Manufacturer: NEW MEXICO HOMEMADE BOATS Manufacturer City/State: NM

no clue if I should trust that site or not and to be honest I have this up in the all sailors section and there is a lot of confusion there as well people seem to be convinced its a mac (and it looks EXACTLY) like a mac 24 of the era in fact the fore section of the salon and port hole style are exactly the same.

 

[alexco38]

Why don't you post some picture.

Hard to tell from your words. Can't you post some pictures?

 

[Redemption]

here are all the photos I have on her

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4891895...7625795236895/

 

[HEINZIR]

here are all the photos I have on her

http://www.flickr.com/photos/4891895...7625795236895/

Sure looks like a Venture 24.

Ignore what the title and registration say, they are wrong. The actual hull number is either imprinted on the starboard corner of the transom or, if it is an older boat, drilled into beam under the cockpit.

Check out this site dedicated to Venture 24s: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Venture24/
I'm sure they can answer all of your questions.

Here is a quote from one of the messages there:
To look for the hull number, crawl back in the starboard quarter birth, you will have to take a flashlight and look on the stringer. You will find the hull number bored in as dots with a drill tip. The pattern will show the hull number as a series of dots. You might have a covering over that space that might have to be removed to reveal the stringer fully. This was the early way they put the hull number on before having to place them on the transom.

According to the database on this (sailboatowners.com) site, the Venture 24 is 24'7" long. If you measured 25' I'd say that is pretty close. Did you account for the extra distance the tape had to travel to go over the cabin top and down to the stem or to go around the curve of the hull?

Your mast has either been painted or was taken from another boat. 28' is about right; that is the length used on the 23 and 25 foot models. But no Venture mast ever came with jumper struts AFIK.

 

[Redemption]

Heinzir, I went crawling into the boat just now and I couldnt find anything there is nothing on the starboard corner I even crawled into the aft storage and into the aft starboard cubby I dont see anything. it is an older vessel I am going to go check the beam right now then ill post my findings. not sure where on the beam. The stringers are pretty small in the aft section and I just dont see anything hopping out at me. as for the beam in do you mean the verticle beam under the mast that is inside the cabin. if so it is some time of finished wood and I dont see anything there.

I just spoke with the po who is an idiot and no help whatsoever although I did notice that next to the knots meter on the inside of the cabin there is two screws that go through the bulkhead and a rectangular patch where something used to exist, who knows maybe a light or something but it just appears to be a bare patch. the PO insists that he believes that is where the plate used to be and that possibly one of the people who looked at it before me stole it because he let them go in while he wasnt there.

Im off to take my son to karate I hope someone is able to help me out on this

 

[HEINZIR]

I didn't mean to say "beam"; I should have said "stringer". This would be under the cockpit on the starboard side. You will need a flashlight to find it.

My 23 is a 1974 model and has the hull ID imprinted on the outside starboard transom corner. I'm really not that familiar with the 24; I'm only passing on what I have read. If you still have trouble, ask your questions at the Yahoo Venture 24 site. I'm sure they will be able to help you.
Here is another quote
from the V24 site:

If you have a V24, (and not the V224 with a pop top), you should find the hull number on the starboard stringer about 3 or four feet aft of the aft end of the cabin.
Just crawl back there and have a look. You'll find it on the vertical surface of the 2 x 6 stringer. It looks like somebody drilled thru the 2 x 6 in a pattern of holes that spells out the hull number. I'm pretty sure they forgot to inject polyester resin into the resultant holes, and thereby have introduced a great rot starter.
More modern boats from MacGregor have the hull # on the upper starboard weather side of the transom, so you don't need to be a contortionist to find it.
Try it. I bet you'll find it, or it isn't a V 24 (I don't know where the V 224s have their hull #s)

 

[Redemption]

yea it isnt a pop top here is the problem I am seeing or well several rather. the aft storage locker acess point is dead center aginst the stern. now on the inside there is a tansom or beam or whatever that separates the cabin from the aft storage in a very complete sense now on the cabin side at least as far as I know the stringer is the beams that run down the center of the vessel to add stability from things such as the vessel twisting etc

maybe I am misunderstanding what the stringer I am still a fairly novice sailor I would say less than 30 hours at the ropes. but if I am correct about that their tiny like only an inch by an inch if I am wrong on that please educate me.

Thank you everyone for your help thus far. its going to be a little difficult to check anything inside the vessel for a little bit I just put the back end up on stands and now im trying to figure out the best way to go about the front end and im very nervous. being that I am so far inland I do not have a lot of people to draw on for information and the internet tends to be dodgy at times

 

[HEINZIR]

Fwiw, here is a post I found on the Sailnet forum. It is for a V17 but all of the early Ventures are similar:


V17 Hull ID No.
If you go in the cabin, crawl a little less than halfway towards the stern on the port bench. Twisting awkardly, look at the starboard bench. You should see a series of holes drilled into the vertical surface. That is the hull i.d. no. I haven't been able to figure out what year our boat is though, just pre-1973.

 

[Redemption]

interesting. I will have to take a look. I just remeasured the boat bow to stern 24 feet. thats the last time I ever measure a boat in the dark on a windy night. so the title got rounded up due to rudder and bow railing. the boat seems pretty consistent with the 71 24ft mac http://www.sailingtexas.com/smacgregor24100.html

Im going to change going in with the stands ill just have to be carefull

 

[Redemption]

nothing on all accounts. checks both sides cabin side and the stern storage side as best I could. caught sight of a spider, killed it and decided not to go in the stern storage not a lot of room in there til I pull out all the gear.

 

[Redemption]

here is someone who redid an old 17 foot venture. I didnt look on the center side of the stringer so maybe its there but im not crawling back in there tonight. anyone else have any ideas? http://www.flickr.com/photos/25826781@N07/2929192051/in/set-72157604736968896/

 

[`Marc]

I just restored a '73 Venture 224, and the only numbers that I could find on the boat were on the starboard transom just below the rubrail. Good luck. Your boat sure looks a lot like my boat. Marc

 

[Redemption]

I agree except that the internet claims that the 224 is a pop top and mine is not a pop top

 

[Freedom77]

As far as I can see you have a Venture 24. There will not be a plate with the hull number on it. Check under the cockpit and there should be a fore/aft stringer with the hull # drilled into it. Mac didn't start putting number on the stern until mid '70's as required by law. See my response to your other post about the keel mess. I'm the voice of experience. If you can get an unglassed cast iron keel you're better off. Just don't know where you might find one. Maybe MacGregor in Costa Mesa although they don't keep a lot of old stuff around. Check with Minnies in Newport. Fair Winds and Full Sails...