to own a sailboat? Please forgive me if this question has been asked of you many times before, and if they may seem idiotic, but I have never owned a boat before, let alone a sailboat. The questions that linger in my head over and over again is what is a boat slip? What is rigging? How much money do you need to maintain a boat? What are the things that go bad often on sailboats? Do I need to take sailing lessons to be able to sail? Is it possible to sail around the world on a 30 or 28 footer with 2 persons? These are some of the questions I have for you all. I have many more questions I want to ask, but this will be it for now. Thanks for your reply! Armen
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Yikes
Yikes Armen. You have asked enough questions here to fill 5 books. I think you would be best advised to start out with a simple book about sailing and read, then come back with more specific questions. Sailing is a great sport/hobby filled with great people. I started out reading a book and then bought a small 16 foot boat and got my feet wet along with everything else. I spent most of my money on sailboats and women ..... the rest .... I wasted! Good luck!
Yikes Armen. You have asked enough questions here to fill 5 books. I think you would be best advised to start out with a simple book about sailing and read, then come back with more specific questions. Sailing is a great sport/hobby filled with great people. I started out reading a book and then bought a small 16 foot boat and got my feet wet along with everything else. I spent most of my money on sailboats and women ..... the rest .... I wasted! Good luck!
Oh, boy
Q. What does it take to own a sailboat? A. You have to be completely nuts. Q. What is a boat slip? A. A place to park; a large expense. Q. What is rigging? A. The wire and rope that holds up the mast and controls the sails. Q. How much money do you need to maintain a boat? A. Ten percent of purchase cost, perhaps in addition to "slip," above. Q. What are the things that go bad often on sailboats? A. Dirt. You have to wash them constantly. Q. Do I need to take sailing lessons to be able to sail? A. No, you can buy a cheap book and figure it out for yourself, if that is what you prefer. Q. Is it possible to sail around the world on a 30 or 28 footer with two persons? A. Absolutely. See "nuts," above.
Q. What does it take to own a sailboat? A. You have to be completely nuts. Q. What is a boat slip? A. A place to park; a large expense. Q. What is rigging? A. The wire and rope that holds up the mast and controls the sails. Q. How much money do you need to maintain a boat? A. Ten percent of purchase cost, perhaps in addition to "slip," above. Q. What are the things that go bad often on sailboats? A. Dirt. You have to wash them constantly. Q. Do I need to take sailing lessons to be able to sail? A. No, you can buy a cheap book and figure it out for yourself, if that is what you prefer. Q. Is it possible to sail around the world on a 30 or 28 footer with two persons? A. Absolutely. See "nuts," above.
WOW, Armen...That's a TALL order!
I would suggest you start by reading a couple of books. "This Old Boat" and "Chapman's Seamanship" are the first to come to mind. That will get you started by identifying rigging, docking, maintenance, repairs, etc. What often goes wrong on boats is (for the most part) directly related to how well the boat is maintained. Cheers, Bob
I would suggest you start by reading a couple of books. "This Old Boat" and "Chapman's Seamanship" are the first to come to mind. That will get you started by identifying rigging, docking, maintenance, repairs, etc. What often goes wrong on boats is (for the most part) directly related to how well the boat is maintained. Cheers, Bob
Couple of things Armen
Since you are in LA, I suspect you are landlocked. You don't live on the water, but near the ocean, as well as lakes. Think about getting a trailerable that you can learn on, yet sail around Marina Del Ray Harbor, as well as Lake Castaic, or the San Gabriel Reservoir. Take lessons on that boat, and you will get all the questions answered from the instructor that you have posed. And you will learn on something familiar, that you can practice on as well. Then you can move on to something bigger that you can sail to Catalina, or Baja. Just start small. That way you are not overwhelmed.
Since you are in LA, I suspect you are landlocked. You don't live on the water, but near the ocean, as well as lakes. Think about getting a trailerable that you can learn on, yet sail around Marina Del Ray Harbor, as well as Lake Castaic, or the San Gabriel Reservoir. Take lessons on that boat, and you will get all the questions answered from the instructor that you have posed. And you will learn on something familiar, that you can practice on as well. Then you can move on to something bigger that you can sail to Catalina, or Baja. Just start small. That way you are not overwhelmed.
There are two titles in the Chandlery
that I would recommend first; one is sailing for kids and the other is sailing for beginners. Your question is valid but very hard to answer because so much of the language used for sailing is attached to the art. Most of the words are used in other discussions. Just as a simple example if you ask a potter ,"what is slip"? you will learn that it is a mixture of clay and water used to join pieces of green pottery. But if you ask a woman ,"what is a slip"? you will learn that it is an item of clothing. If you step on ice, you may slip. But if you ask a sailor , "what is a slip"? you will learn that it is a place alongside a pier where you can tie your boat. Please consider getting a very basic book and starting from there.
that I would recommend first; one is sailing for kids and the other is sailing for beginners. Your question is valid but very hard to answer because so much of the language used for sailing is attached to the art. Most of the words are used in other discussions. Just as a simple example if you ask a potter ,"what is slip"? you will learn that it is a mixture of clay and water used to join pieces of green pottery. But if you ask a woman ,"what is a slip"? you will learn that it is an item of clothing. If you step on ice, you may slip. But if you ask a sailor , "what is a slip"? you will learn that it is a place alongside a pier where you can tie your boat. Please consider getting a very basic book and starting from there.
What does it take
Armen, I live in Southern California and have been sailing for 30 years. If you would like, you could contact me for a free boat ride and basic sailing lesson. I usually sail out of Long Beach but also put my boat in the water at Marina Del Rey. Then you could decide on what type, size and make sailboat you would want. you can contact me at novelman@adelphia.net to set up a time and date. Novelman
Armen, I live in Southern California and have been sailing for 30 years. If you would like, you could contact me for a free boat ride and basic sailing lesson. I usually sail out of Long Beach but also put my boat in the water at Marina Del Rey. Then you could decide on what type, size and make sailboat you would want. you can contact me at novelman@adelphia.net to set up a time and date. Novelman
Decide to go Sailing
I like the one about spending all my money on sailboats and women ... the rest I wasted. One day I decided I wanted to go sailing so I spent about $4500 on a 21 ft swing keel, sloop rigged trailerable sail boat. Once I had that in hand I called a friend up and asked him what he was doing. He took me out till dark. The next day I went alone. After that I bought some books because I had decided sailing was something I wanted to do. I'm now on my fifth boat, could say I love it. Probably though the best thing to do is find someone who will take you out just to see if you like it. How bad do you want it?
I like the one about spending all my money on sailboats and women ... the rest I wasted. One day I decided I wanted to go sailing so I spent about $4500 on a 21 ft swing keel, sloop rigged trailerable sail boat. Once I had that in hand I called a friend up and asked him what he was doing. He took me out till dark. The next day I went alone. After that I bought some books because I had decided sailing was something I wanted to do. I'm now on my fifth boat, could say I love it. Probably though the best thing to do is find someone who will take you out just to see if you like it. How bad do you want it?
Another way to start is to
get out on the water with someone who sails. Try going down to a marina and looking for someone who is working on his or her own boat and talk (don't stop them from working) to that person. Explain your interest and offer to help them with their maintenance if you are handy at all or can at least take direction. I'm not sure about the seasons in LA if at all but most marinas in the Northeast are filled with people working from April till June. You'll learn alot right there and probably get an offer to crew. There is no substitute for actually getting out on the water and sailing with someone who knows what they are doing. You can learn more about what you need to know to get out on the water and sail in one afternoon than you can imagine. For example - apparent wind is an important concept but it makes alot more sense on a boat than in a book. Maybe it's me, I am a visual, sensory learner and doing works best. I strongly advise that you take a safety course from the Coast Guard or Power Squadron before heading out on your own. As far as costs go (based upon a 25' sailboat), other than the purchase price of the boat, you probably have winter hauling and storage - $400 - $1500, summer dockage - $1500 - $4500 or mooring $500 - $1500, paint and routine upkeep $500, engine winterization/spring tuning - $200 - $500, replace an outboard - $3000, replace an inboard $8000, new sails (main and jib - $2200 - infinity...), insurance - $50 - $300, forgetting about work and everything else for a day - priceless. It was running me about $5000 a year not including beer and ice...
get out on the water with someone who sails. Try going down to a marina and looking for someone who is working on his or her own boat and talk (don't stop them from working) to that person. Explain your interest and offer to help them with their maintenance if you are handy at all or can at least take direction. I'm not sure about the seasons in LA if at all but most marinas in the Northeast are filled with people working from April till June. You'll learn alot right there and probably get an offer to crew. There is no substitute for actually getting out on the water and sailing with someone who knows what they are doing. You can learn more about what you need to know to get out on the water and sail in one afternoon than you can imagine. For example - apparent wind is an important concept but it makes alot more sense on a boat than in a book. Maybe it's me, I am a visual, sensory learner and doing works best. I strongly advise that you take a safety course from the Coast Guard or Power Squadron before heading out on your own. As far as costs go (based upon a 25' sailboat), other than the purchase price of the boat, you probably have winter hauling and storage - $400 - $1500, summer dockage - $1500 - $4500 or mooring $500 - $1500, paint and routine upkeep $500, engine winterization/spring tuning - $200 - $500, replace an outboard - $3000, replace an inboard $8000, new sails (main and jib - $2200 - infinity...), insurance - $50 - $300, forgetting about work and everything else for a day - priceless. It was running me about $5000 a year not including beer and ice...
Go for a sail with Novelman
Looking out the window I see 2 feet of snow. I would offer to take you for a ride too but my boat is snowed under. In the meantime I read all I can find out about sailing. All the books in the world still can't give you what Novelman is offering. Call him up and go for a ride. Conchy Joe has good advice too. He even has good advice when it comes to women. I started in a small boat (a Y Flyer) and then went to the ocean. Have been lucky enough to sail the Gulf of Alaska then to Hawaii. I always say if you dream and want it bad enough, it will happen. Good luck and come back and tell us what you think of it. Ken
Looking out the window I see 2 feet of snow. I would offer to take you for a ride too but my boat is snowed under. In the meantime I read all I can find out about sailing. All the books in the world still can't give you what Novelman is offering. Call him up and go for a ride. Conchy Joe has good advice too. He even has good advice when it comes to women. I started in a small boat (a Y Flyer) and then went to the ocean. Have been lucky enough to sail the Gulf of Alaska then to Hawaii. I always say if you dream and want it bad enough, it will happen. Good luck and come back and tell us what you think of it. Ken
Thanks
to all who put in their time to respond to my thread. You guys are intrepidly fast and pretty wise sailors. I will for sure take all your good advise to heart. I will accept the generous offer of Novelman to go sailing with him, and start reading the books which Bob Todd recommends. One thing I know for sure is that I dreamt of becoming a sailor since I was a kid reading stories about English explorers. I wish I had taken the initiative then. But knowing what I know now, I am determined to make this happen, or at least try! Money or time are not issues. Although, I don't make much, I can budget for an important goal. And yes, Ken, just like you I also believe that if you really want something bad, nothing can stop you on your tracks. Armen
to all who put in their time to respond to my thread. You guys are intrepidly fast and pretty wise sailors. I will for sure take all your good advise to heart. I will accept the generous offer of Novelman to go sailing with him, and start reading the books which Bob Todd recommends. One thing I know for sure is that I dreamt of becoming a sailor since I was a kid reading stories about English explorers. I wish I had taken the initiative then. But knowing what I know now, I am determined to make this happen, or at least try! Money or time are not issues. Although, I don't make much, I can budget for an important goal. And yes, Ken, just like you I also believe that if you really want something bad, nothing can stop you on your tracks. Armen
cart before the horse
Sounds to me like you've never been sailing...maybe never even on a boat in open waters. If that is the case, you first have to find out if it really is for you. Like many, many, MANY others, they buy a boat first and then find out if it is for them and of course, many pay a lot of money to learn it's not for them. Take that free offer but don't go to learn about sailing, but learn to see if it's right for you. Ask yourself these questions first: 1) How do I feel about going 36 hours without sleep? 2) How do I feel about being scared of dieing and nobody around to help because I'm 1,000 miles from anybody? 3) How do I feel about living in a 10' x 10' box? 4) How do I feel about having to take a shower with half a gallon of water? 5) How do I feel about being tossed around by mother nature like a ping pong ball? 6) How do I feel about having to dive into 50-60 degree water? 7) How do I feel about having to spend an entire weekend two times a year just to wax the boat? 8) How do I feel about having to fork over $200 (low estimate) a month on just maintanence? 9) How do I feel about it taking forever to get someplace because the boat can only do 7 mph? 10) How do I feel about having to fix something on the boat while the boat is being tossed all over the place (things always break at the absolutely wrong time such as two days ago when I had to turn around and save a boat from being smashed to death by a hugh ship bearing down on it because the engine died in the middle of a shipping channel)? I just delivered a boat for a new owner and I believe sailing isn't for him. He doesn't want to take naps during the day so he will be fresh at night. He doesn't seem to like the wave action on a light day in open water. He thinks sailing at night is too dangerous...that sailing is a daytime thing. He refuses to wear his glasses so he can actually see things (I asked him many times to put them on). He doesn't seem interested in learning the names of lines or basic knots. To top it all off, when somebody needs help, his first thought is "how will I be liable" instead of "How can I help". Yet he wants to cruise Central America in his new boat...and I got the impression he is talking about next summer. He isn't a sailor but maybe he could transform someday. You need to find out if being a sailor is for you first before you spend money and reading tons of books. How? Take that free offer. Join a club and get out on the water...in all kinds of conditions...not just the nice days. Only then will you know if it's for you or not (don't forget to bring the woman along because you need to find out if she is a sailor too).
Sounds to me like you've never been sailing...maybe never even on a boat in open waters. If that is the case, you first have to find out if it really is for you. Like many, many, MANY others, they buy a boat first and then find out if it is for them and of course, many pay a lot of money to learn it's not for them. Take that free offer but don't go to learn about sailing, but learn to see if it's right for you. Ask yourself these questions first: 1) How do I feel about going 36 hours without sleep? 2) How do I feel about being scared of dieing and nobody around to help because I'm 1,000 miles from anybody? 3) How do I feel about living in a 10' x 10' box? 4) How do I feel about having to take a shower with half a gallon of water? 5) How do I feel about being tossed around by mother nature like a ping pong ball? 6) How do I feel about having to dive into 50-60 degree water? 7) How do I feel about having to spend an entire weekend two times a year just to wax the boat? 8) How do I feel about having to fork over $200 (low estimate) a month on just maintanence? 9) How do I feel about it taking forever to get someplace because the boat can only do 7 mph? 10) How do I feel about having to fix something on the boat while the boat is being tossed all over the place (things always break at the absolutely wrong time such as two days ago when I had to turn around and save a boat from being smashed to death by a hugh ship bearing down on it because the engine died in the middle of a shipping channel)? I just delivered a boat for a new owner and I believe sailing isn't for him. He doesn't want to take naps during the day so he will be fresh at night. He doesn't seem to like the wave action on a light day in open water. He thinks sailing at night is too dangerous...that sailing is a daytime thing. He refuses to wear his glasses so he can actually see things (I asked him many times to put them on). He doesn't seem interested in learning the names of lines or basic knots. To top it all off, when somebody needs help, his first thought is "how will I be liable" instead of "How can I help". Yet he wants to cruise Central America in his new boat...and I got the impression he is talking about next summer. He isn't a sailor but maybe he could transform someday. You need to find out if being a sailor is for you first before you spend money and reading tons of books. How? Take that free offer. Join a club and get out on the water...in all kinds of conditions...not just the nice days. Only then will you know if it's for you or not (don't forget to bring the woman along because you need to find out if she is a sailor too).
Franklin, I wonder how you would advise
a boat person that has never driven an automobile if the person asked the same question but with cars being he subject instead of boats. I don't think that it is fair to throw all of the negative aspects of any endeavor before a person without also providing that person with a knowledge of the bebefit of the activity. I think that the cost of owning and operating a car would put most people off were the benefits not so obvious.
a boat person that has never driven an automobile if the person asked the same question but with cars being he subject instead of boats. I don't think that it is fair to throw all of the negative aspects of any endeavor before a person without also providing that person with a knowledge of the bebefit of the activity. I think that the cost of owning and operating a car would put most people off were the benefits not so obvious.
Read, read, and read some more
Read Joshua Slocum's "Around the World Alone", a riveting account of a solo sailor going around the world in a wooden boat he built in Massachusets (circa 1890). Read almost anything by Tristan Jones which gives you a lot of flavor about being on the sea (even if most of his tales are embellished for the sake of you, the reader). I would highly recommend you check out Tor Pinney's Sailing Tips webpage: http://www.tor.cc/tips.htm and check out David Pascoe's web pages for lots of information about buying used boats: http://www.yachtsurvey.com/buyingaboat.htm David Pascoe is a boat "surveyor", which just means that he knows a lot about the various systems on boats (mostly motor boats but hey, both sailboats and stink pots float!) and gets to tell insurance companies how much the boat is worth and what systems are defective. Boating is a lot of fun so do not be dissuaded by people telling you that boat means: Bring Out Another Thousand and other such chilling tales. Where there is a will there is a way. I have a partner in my 27' Tartan from 1967 which helps to diffray the costs; technically, our boat could sail around the world (someone in a T27 has) with the right crew and equipment on board. Go sailing with Novelman, he really wants someone to go sailing with. Please!
Read Joshua Slocum's "Around the World Alone", a riveting account of a solo sailor going around the world in a wooden boat he built in Massachusets (circa 1890). Read almost anything by Tristan Jones which gives you a lot of flavor about being on the sea (even if most of his tales are embellished for the sake of you, the reader). I would highly recommend you check out Tor Pinney's Sailing Tips webpage: http://www.tor.cc/tips.htm and check out David Pascoe's web pages for lots of information about buying used boats: http://www.yachtsurvey.com/buyingaboat.htm David Pascoe is a boat "surveyor", which just means that he knows a lot about the various systems on boats (mostly motor boats but hey, both sailboats and stink pots float!) and gets to tell insurance companies how much the boat is worth and what systems are defective. Boating is a lot of fun so do not be dissuaded by people telling you that boat means: Bring Out Another Thousand and other such chilling tales. Where there is a will there is a way. I have a partner in my 27' Tartan from 1967 which helps to diffray the costs; technically, our boat could sail around the world (someone in a T27 has) with the right crew and equipment on board. Go sailing with Novelman, he really wants someone to go sailing with. Please!
I like Drews answers best ;D
One more thing to all your questions -- It depends. Don't think it can't be done on a shoestring budget because it absolutely can. Its just that the boat wont be as big or as new or as luxurious and you will probably have to do more inconvenient things like leave a boat on a mooring instead of and do most of the work by yourself. There are many 20-30 year old sailboats that are just begging to be taken and sold for a song. I dare say you could probably pick up solid sturdy old ones for the price of a 1979 Pinto
-- all it would need is elbow grease and work But if you DO decide to take to sailing by whatever measures it takes you to get on the water then I think you will be closer to the elements & enjoy the fruits of your labors even more Good luck (Ps. The first few answers that Franklin posted are really only in reference if you really wanted to sail around the world or long distance. Its not that bad if you are doing coastal cruising like long weekends or a week or two vacations on a boat)
One more thing to all your questions -- It depends. Don't think it can't be done on a shoestring budget because it absolutely can. Its just that the boat wont be as big or as new or as luxurious and you will probably have to do more inconvenient things like leave a boat on a mooring instead of and do most of the work by yourself. There are many 20-30 year old sailboats that are just begging to be taken and sold for a song. I dare say you could probably pick up solid sturdy old ones for the price of a 1979 Pinto
-- all it would need is elbow grease and work But if you DO decide to take to sailing by whatever measures it takes you to get on the water then I think you will be closer to the elements & enjoy the fruits of your labors even more Good luck (Ps. The first few answers that Franklin posted are really only in reference if you really wanted to sail around the world or long distance. Its not that bad if you are doing coastal cruising like long weekends or a week or two vacations on a boat)
I cant believe ....
I cant believe that you guys believe that this is a serious post. He dont know anything about boats or what a slip is, but he found this site. Give me a break.
I cant believe that you guys believe that this is a serious post. He dont know anything about boats or what a slip is, but he found this site. Give me a break.
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