West Marine Closing Canadian Stores

[YVRguy]

Just read that West Marine is pulling out of Canada. That can't be good for competition here. I can understand if they didn't have enough business here to make it work but I don't get the logic they're using. Here's a quote from the WM rep in the Victoria Times Colonist:

“It’s a generational thing.”

In the past, someone would start by building an eight-foot dinghy, for example, with his or her father, and work up to a 42-foot boat in two-foot increments during 30 years, Thomson said. Such customers still buy their own materials and want to be self-sufficient.

Today, a buyer of a 42-foot boat might be a first-time boat owner, Thomson said. The new owner is more likely to take the vessel to a yacht-servicing company for repairs or upgrading.

- See more at: http://www.timescolonist.com/busine...ncouver-island-1.1751699#sthash.JfO69BYU.dpuf

 

[Stu Jackson]

WM's logic is appalling. It's backwards. There was a loong thread recently over on cf.com about them changing their "strategy" to sell clothes instead of marine gear.

Dumbells.

For most of us, that is. There may be some validity to their statement about 42 foot new boat owners. From many questions I see on other boating forums, folks are buying huge "first boats" and asking dumber and dumber questions. Just today some guy with a 40 foor IP asked about how to avoid high prices for "marine" boarding steps. The obvious answers like Ace hardware, Home Depot and Ikea simply amazed him!!!

Most of us grew up in boat sizes as well as age! But we bought our parts from WM, 'cuz they provided a service we needed at the time. Parts. We fixed our own stuff.

The question is, have boaters changed or has WM forsaken their original concept? From this, it's the latter.

It may be GOOD for competition in Canada, all the old Mom&Pop chandleries can survive. Might be harder to get stuff in the short term, but other folks will fill the void.

Get as much as you can when they do their going out of business sales.

 

[woodster]

that article said they had 273 stores in total it seems to me just a year ago they had 400 stores...they have combined a lot of smaller stores in recent times and built mega stores...they must be doing the walmart business model thing

 

[Solstice]

WM's logic is appalling. It's backwards. There was a loong thread recently over on cf.com about them changing their "strategy" to sell clothes instead of marine gear. Dumbells. For most of us, that is. There may be some validity to their statement about 42 foot new boat owners. From many questions I see on other boating forums, folks are buying huge "first boats" and asking dumber and dumber questions. Just today some guy with a 40 foor IP asked about how to avoid high prices for "marine" boarding steps. The obvious answers like Ace hardware, Home Depot and Ikea simply amazed him!!! Most of us grew up in boat sizes as well as age! But we bought our parts from WM, 'cuz they provided a service we needed at the time. Parts. We fixed our own stuff. The question is, have boaters changed or has WM forsaken their original concept? From this, it's the latter. It may be GOOD for competition in Canada, all the old Mom&Pop chandleries can survive. Might be harder to get stuff in the short term, but other folks will fill the void. Get as much as you can when they do their going out of business sales.

I was in a WM last weekend to look at a piece of gear--that I plan on buying at the Defender sale....it occurred to me that they have become the Best Buy of the boating world. People window shop, then go to Amazon. I mentioned to the guy (who was actually knowledgeable for one) that the item I was looking at was almost $400 more than the pre-sale price at Defender. His response 'but you get triple points'...really??? The other nit I have is they no longer send the catalogue to members and if you aren't a member, it's $5.95...sad...

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

And all this time, I though the folks on the Internet have no experience building a multi-million dollar annual sales business from nothing. You tell them guys! Those dummies just did it to trick us...

 

[Stu Jackson]

And all this time, I though the folks on the Internet have no experience building a multi-million dollar annual sales business from nothing. You tell them guys! Those dummies just did it to trick us...

Don, perhaps you missed my point.

WM "was" great. They started from nothing and filled an immense void in the chandlery business.

I highly admire Randy and what he did.

I also understand that "times change."

But they set a standard for a store with knowledgeable salespeople.

Then they hired kids who couldn't read or add.

Then they went through changes by becoming something they weren't.

Now they're just a clothes horse, with boating logos.

There are successful companies still out there who haven't gotten into or gone the full bore corporate route, where the end result of unbridled capitalism is to kill off the customers.

Not WM, sadly.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Here's that cf topic

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...phasising-sailing-related-support-140042.html

 

[Bill1565]

Don, perhaps you missed my point. WM "was" great. They started from nothing and filled an immense void in the chandlery business. I highly admire Randy and what he did. I also understand that "times change." But they set a standard for a store with knowledgeable salespeople. Then they hired kids who couldn't read or add. Then they went through changes by becoming something they weren't. Now they're just a clothes horse, with boating logos. There are successful companies still out there who haven't gotten into or gone the full bore corporate route, where the end result of unbridled capitalism is to kill off the customers. Not WM, sadly.

I agree. Back when WM was mail order only in Santa Barbara and Randy Repass was active in managing his company, it was the best boat parts business going.

 

[JK_Boston_Catalina310]

I have a good friend who is a store manager for WM. Thier whole insight into the boating industry is flawed. He has a good amount of time invested and he is in a medium sized store where he can reasonably make his bonuses.

They just opened one of their flagship stores (greater than 50% clothing) in Braintree. He looked at bidding on being the manager. The metrics they had set up were all wrong and the store was doomed from the beginning. Not one single senior manager in the chain bid on it. Its a flagship store in a location where it is the closests WM to at least 10 marinas and 5 large anchorages. The old manager got the store by default.

If you find a manager like my buddy you can build a good relationship with him. He is a boater and follows a lot of the online stuff. He had a guy go in and point out that 6 volt GC flooded batteries are Deka's you can get the same from Sam's Club with a different sticker. He agreed and matched the Sam's price. I tried the same thing with the guy in Braintree and he said "who is Deka?" Every time I walk in there I end up leaving mad because they are either out of what I am looking for or they are way overpriced and won't price match with Defender or Amazon anymore.

I feel like the only reason they stay in business is new boat owners. They go there buy a bunch of overpriced stuff. Later they learn about Defender and other more reasonable outlets and never go back. The said part is that they have driven out almost all of the mom and pop places near me.

 

[gettinthere]

There is a big upsurge in non boaters buying big first boats and having very unrealistic expectations.

But I dont think that is connected to the West Marine issues.

Somebody plunked down a lot of money to buy the chain. They expect a big return on their investment. Then the internet buying mode takes off just as they are raising prices to cover the purchase. Then the great recession hits. Staples, Best Buy, Sears, Penney's etc are all struggling from similar issues. The market changes, companies come and go. Management make excuses.

 

[smacklin]

I never found west marine price competitive in Canada. The store near me also did not carry enough inventory compared to catalog or their local competitors. There are only 10 Canadian stores total. looks like they could not figure out the model to be successful here.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

Businesses have to evolve and if they don't they die. Stu recalls the early days when WM filled a void and became very successful. All businesses that experience rapid growth soon find out how difficult it is to maintain the character that made them successful to begin with. Do you think it is easy to grow into a massive chain and retain the same level of customer service? Not so. Maybe there just aren't that many good managers willing to take on the relatively meager pay that a manager of a chain chandlery is paid.

The customers certainly aren't willing to support quality expertise. Just look at the testimonials in this forum alone who state that if the price can't be met, we're gone.

WM didn't suffocate the ma and pa stores. The ma and pa stores were either under-supplied, over-priced, or lacked the expertise that WM offered when they moved in. If the ma and pa stores were better than WM, then they are still around. It's as simple as that.

WM runs into difficulties with cash flow, personnel, supplier prices, you-name-it, just like any other business does. The more wide-spread their chain becomes, the greater their logistical problems. It's pretty simple to recognize when small efficient stores lose their character when growing pains are not resolved correctly. I don't know what they need to do to survive but I suspect that consolidation may be part of the answer. I think that too many stores in close proximity is simply a bad way to go when larger, better-stocked and better managed, centralized stores might improve overall performance.

But in the end, it's not WM screwing the customers so much as the customers are all too happy to screw WM as soon as they realize they can save a dime by going somewhere else. If you don't like them, don't go there. There are plenty of options, as almost everybody is happy to point out.

If poor executive management at WM is responsible for ruining the business, there is little reason to lament (most of us are griping about them anyway). The void they leave is somebody else's opportunity.

 

[Ken Cross]

We do have competition where we live

Of course, when a mega company like West Marine comes in, it often smothers or buys up the competition, leaving it the only game in town.
Then when it decides, for whatever reason, to depart, it leaves it's customers with zero alternatives.
At least with the Canadian socialist system, one would think that your government could require West to support an alternate supplier, until it becomes an economically viable company. We in the states can expect no such support from our government when the mega companies decide to sh*t all over their customers.

Here in Everett, WA we do have competition. We have local retailers and online (as does everyone else.) I'm amazed when I buy from Sailboatowners.com how fast things arrive on my doorstep. You can have our WM store anytime. We don't need their inflated prices or their poor advice. It's no wonder they are struggling.

Ken

 

[dparilla]

Even their port supply side is lagging. Their "wholesale" prices are what defender charges retail. I asked about a special order part last week and Port Supply said it would take 6 weeks to get it. Defender said I would have it by this Friday, and 70 bucks cheaper too.

 

[shemandr]

I agree with Scott T-Bird and gettinthere. I think the market pretty much drives the business rather than the other way around. WM may be facing a new world where Bass Pro Shops and Cabela's have tourism stores. Maybe they've figured out that most of the public prefers to walk around a climate controlled touristy "Outdoors" with fish tanks and displays of wild animals over going out into the real outdoors. They sell them some T-shirts and Jerky, and soda for the kids, maybe even some hamburgers.
And let's face it, the youth of America and other countries have lost interest in the real world preferring the digital world. They are not going to be the next generation of outdoorsmen.
And then there's the whole Internet thing. I can't really blame WM, or anyone else, for trying to adapt.

 

[Kings Gambit]

Yeah, it's just another example of the business cycle driven by technology. WM stores sprung up all around and put local chanderlies out of business. The internet with its eBay, Craigslist, Amazon, and Defender has sprung up and is putting WM out of the boating supply business at least. Many yacht clubs are basically in the process of exchanging boating-savy members for social members to stay open. Members who do not now own, or in some cases have never owned, a boat are becoming Flag Officers, etc. One YC here in southern California published its cruising schedule recently; every one not land based is to mooring balls somewhere at Catalina Island except for the Commodore's cruise which will be 7-days on a cruise ship, etc. I was stunned a couple of years ago when one or more YC's of Southern California evidently lobbied to moved the So Cal mid-Winters Regatta to the 3rd weekend of February (from the 2nd) so as not to interfere with Valentine's Day socials at the clubs, etc., so the story went!! So now WM stores sell clothes, fishing equipment, safety grear, electronics, and miscellaneous do-dads to fix some stuff that breaks down periodically--like the toilet; plus some rope. The few items I've purchased lately for the Bavaria have been from various internet stores--GPS/DSC VHF hand-held radio, 30 mm wrench (keel bolt nuts), First-aid supplies, bilge pump switch & alarm, etc. Why shop at a store with limited inventory instead of at ALL of the stores out there with limitless inventory? BTW-- a guy just moved into a slip a couple of slips down from me in his FIRST boat--a Catalina 42, fairly late model.

 

[woodster]

this is really sad that a major company like west marine has gone the way of merchandising dry goods as there main line..... they need to change their name to West General Mercantile purveyors of cotton piece goods and tackle shops .......they have plenty of that kind of things but not so much in the way of marine hardware.....

and after reading this thread if i were the CEO i think i would resign...the message is very clear but do you think they will heed the warning i think not as corporate america has no intelligence...... just a bottom line......

 

[Chris & Lenore]

People tend to buy based on price and availability. Our choices in Canada have expanded in the past few years.
Outfits like Binnacle, Marine Outfitters offer lower prices and free, fast shipping.

As an example, I was at the WM megastore in St Petersburg last week. I was looking for a Blue Sea ACR and a Balmar Smart Gauge. The ACR was $99. With tax and exchange that brings into $140 CAD. I can get it for $99 CAD, delivered to my door in two days from either of the outfits I mentioned. The Smart Gauge came up at almost $400 at WM but I purchased one from Binnacle for $354 all up.

Even with electronics, few (if any) retailer in either country can touch Radio World in Toronto. With the exchange, I'm not sure why anyone in the US would buy elsewhere.

But there sure was an advantage (for me anyway) when it can to warranty service at WM. Last year I purchased a rather expensive set of binoculars - waterproof and nitrogen filled. A few months ago I was cleaning them and noticed what looked like water spots all over one of the internal lenses. I brought them to the WM in St Petersburg, the guy took one look, said "that's not right" and said they would be replaced. Unfortunately, they were out of stock but I won't fault them for that. Hey, another reason to go back to Florida!

I had a warranty issue with a mail order place and it was a waste of time and money. Had to send it back at my expense only to be told it had to then be sent to the manufacturer (again at my expense). Shipping added up to more than the item cost.

I'll be sad to see then go but then again, I didn't give them much of my business.

Chris

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Years ago, it use to be Americans in the building trades who were dominant but that is fast fading given to other groups. No disrespect here gents. The younger generations rely on others to do the hard work and relying more on the digital world. We have allowed this to happen.. What would happen if all electronics were out. I use to own a farm and can split wood by hand, raise a garden and so on. The younger folks in a sense do not know what to do. God help us. We have sold out ourselves and looking at what is being said, WM younger execs are getting away from the core principals which made the company years ago. As for Randy Repass, he has made his millions and does not care. When that happens, then a company will fail.

Did you know out of greed a company relying on rare earth metals was sold to the Chinese and that technology and business you can only guess where it is now. We rely on rare earth metals in our cell phones and more to even include components derived from that in our own military hardware. I think the idiots at the Pentagon do not care about our security. If I was in office that would change.

 

[ISABELLA5]

The WM clothing and marine supply store here in Panama City recently relocated to a larger facility in order to triple or more the clothing floorspace.