welding aluminun

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redhead78

redhead78

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Dec 30, 2009
680
jeanneau 38 gin fizz sloop Summer- Keyport Yacht Club, Raritan Bay, NJ, Winter Viking Marina Verplanck, NY
Hey all, I have 2 small about 2" long cracks in the base of my mast,I am wondering how to repair these? weld? Right now the mast is in the peekskill NY area. I will post pics of the cracks when I go to the boat on sunday...Thanks Red
 
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alexco38

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Sep 25, 2008
1,096
CS 30 Toronto
look for a mobile welder service in your area. It isn't easy for DYI to weld aluminium. Special tools / equipment required.
 
sailaway78

sailaway78

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May 11, 2005
3,431
Seidelman S37 Slidell, La.
Be sure

Be sure you find a really good welder. You don't want a half a$$ job here.
 
kloudie1

kloudie1

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Nov 6, 2006
10,219
Hunter 34 Mandeville Louisiana
Might be prudent to wrap a thin plate of aluminum over the cracked places and after welding the cracks and smoothing, weld a plate over the cracked place. Depends on what the pix show.. Ya have to be careful about melting the electrical wire insulation for the stuff that runs up in there.
 
RichH

RichH

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Feb 14, 2005
4,773
Tayana 37 cutter; I20/M20 SCOWS Worton Creek, MD
The problem with welding a mast butt while on the boat is you may inadvertently weld the mast to the mast shoe on the coach roof ... then how do you ever get the mast down?

Kloudie's offering of welding the crack, then applying a 'sister plate' over the cracked/welded area is a good one.
 
Sumner

Sumner

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Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
RichH said:
...Kloudie's offering of welding the crack, then applying a 'sister plate' over the cracked/welded area is a good one.
Click to expand
I'd also do that or have it done. The weld might not break, but the metal next to the weld might. You have the problem of using the right rod for the aluminum the mast is made of.

Finding a good 'certified' welder with a TIG should end up finding someone that knows what they are doing. I weld aluminum all of the time and would do it on our boat, but not for someone else as I might use the wrong rod for the job. I'm not 'certified',

Sum

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caguy

caguy

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Sep 22, 2006
4,004
Catalina, Luger C-27, Adventure 30 Marina del Rey
Sum,
Not sure that it applies here, but have you ever used Dura Fix? I watched a guy demonstrate it on all kinds of welds at the boat show. It works with just a propane torch. It looked lik it had pretty good penetration and flowed easily. I was skeptical and decided to research it and have read some pretty good reviews from other skeptics.
Seems like a good substitue for remote welding where transporting a large object to the weld shop is not convenient.
http://durafix.com/
 
dscribner

dscribner

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Nov 9, 2008
1,338
Pearson-O'Day 290 Portland Maine
Have it professionally done. Unlike steel, aluminum looses 15% or more of it's strength within 1" of the heat affected zone. This varies depending on which engineer is doing the calcs and what he's trying to justify. I'd have it welded, ground and patched, depending on how deep my pockets were on that day.
 
redhead78

redhead78

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Dec 30, 2009
680
jeanneau 38 gin fizz sloop Summer- Keyport Yacht Club, Raritan Bay, NJ, Winter Viking Marina Verplanck, NY
Frank, I watched the demo on dura fix, and called the company in NC, I am no welder but that stuff looks pretty dam good......Red
 
caguy

caguy

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Sep 22, 2006
4,004
Catalina, Luger C-27, Adventure 30 Marina del Rey
dscribner said:
Have it professionally done. Unlike steel, aluminum looses 15% or more of it's strength within 1" of the heat affected zone. This varies depending on which engineer is doing the calcs and what he's trying to justify. I'd have it welded, ground and patched, depending on how deep my pockets were on that day.
Click to expand
The thing about Dura Fix is that it does not have to be heated as high as conventional Tig welding. It has a much lower melting point.
 
Sumner

Sumner

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Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
caguy said:
The thing about Dura Fix is that it does not have to be heated as high as conventional Tig welding. It has a much lower melting point.
Click to expand
I looked at it pretty quick and noticed they are mainly using it on cast aluminum repair. It also appears to be more similar to brazing than true welding. Brazing is also very strong if done right.

Aluminum takes a lot of heat. If I weld the same thickness of aluminum as steel I might use 140-150 amps on the aluminum vs. 100-120 on the steel. You need heat to get a puddle going and then control to back the heat off as you weld along, thus the foot pedal you use that controls the amps down from wherever the welder is set with full amps at that setting being full pedal.

The control is critical and you also have to get the oxide off of the aluminum before welding as if you leave it on and try welding by the time you get enough heat to melt the surface oxide you will then instantly flow the aluminum under it onto the floor.

I'm not saying that their product doesn't work, but I can't see it being use for structural welding. I'm sure they are very good at demoing it. I've seen guys weld cast steel before, but never had luck myself.

I have a 225 amp Lincoln square wave TIG that I use and love it. It is very user friendly. By the time you get it and the bottle and accessories you will be over $2000 though,

Sum

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monkeybars

monkeybars

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Dec 8, 2007
303
-mac 26M -26M tucson-san carlos mx
dura-fix is more easily compared to soldering then welding,no comparison at all.if you have a decent size airport nearby ask one of the hanger mechanics who is the local faa cert welder they use for repairs.theres usually one nearby.
 
MrUnix

MrUnix

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Mar 24, 2010
626
Hunter 23 Gainesville, FL
We need to see some pictures! At the very least, and until a proper repair can be made, I would drill a small hole (1/16" or so) at the tip of each crack to prevent any further progression.

Cheers,
Brad
 
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plainssailor

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Feb 18, 2012
32
oday 25 branched oaks
welding cracks on aluminum mast

I did alot of welding in my day, but not much anymore. If it were my boat I would do it myself for sure. I would only use a tig machine with high frequency stabillization. I would really clean the entire area and then with a magnifying glass really inspect the cracks.. I might stop drill the very end of the cracks and then weld vertically up the crack.. controlling the heat is the key. Then I might even patch weld over the area. It is hard to say w/o seeing the job. You may have a problem w/wiring in the mast if it is touching inside the spar behind the weld zone, something to consider before the welder arrives on site. You may even want to disconnect any electronics that could be grounded? Good luck and let us know how it goes. I would not limit welders to certs, because usually certs are for a company job, or project and don"t follow from job to job. At least in the powerplant steamfitting work I did.
 
Joe11688

Joe11688

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Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
redhead78 said:
Hey all, I have 2 small about 2" long cracks in the base of my mast,I am wondering how to repair these? weld? Right now the mast is in the peekskill NY area. I will post pics of the cracks when I go to the boat on sunday...Thanks Red
Click to expand
I had the same problem with my mast a few years ago Red. I took my mast to a marine welder on the other side of my city who was also a marine surveyor and he heliark welded it.
While I was there he told me that the bottom of my mast was corroding due to a stainless steel mast plug. I had a Kenyon stainless steel hinged tabernacle by Rig-Rite in Warwick RI back in the 1990s and they made a special mast plug out of stainless steel and installed it. Just last year the bottom of my mast got so corroded that it was ready to blow out. The holes for the screws going through the side of the mast that held the plug in place were corroded and enlarged and it was all caused by electrolysis.

Last year I had to cut 2" off the bottom of my mast and I Mickey Moused the old mast plug with a couple of pieces of 1" Trex to get me through the rest of the sailing season. It was heavy and ugly but it got me through the season.
Last month I replaced all of that with a combination of Trex, PVC Foam Board, and a piece of 1/4" Aluminum plate.
Hopefully I'll never have that problem again.
 

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Joe11688

Joe11688

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Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
It looks good and it should work for you. I used two stainless steel bolts to hold my mast plug to the hinge plate and where the bolts came in contact with the 1/4" Aluminum plate, I coated them with Never-Seize. This should prevent electrolysis.
I think that entrapped water in the mast can escalate electrolysis faster when two dissimilar metals come together for any length of time. I made a provision in my mast plug to drain that water out of the mast.

My Z-Spar mast came with a cheap cast Aluminum tabernacle extrusion made in France and installed in America. It had a single sheave for the Jib Halyard built into it and I hated it with a passion. Changing it over to a stainless steel hinge plate was probably the smartest move I made after I got my new mast made up. I only wish that the rigger had made up something else other than a stainless steel mast plug.
I'm confident that what I made up is going to work and keep my boat sailing for a long time.
 
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