Wanted - Toilet with option of Pumpout or Manual emptying

[Jim Hawkins]

*Title should have read "and" not "or"

I sure hope Peggy is out there or someone that can steer me right. I want to get a portable toilet for my boat where I have the option to remove the holding tank to take and dump but also have it plumbed so it can be pumped out.

NOW, I know there are toilets with these options BUT you have to pick one or the other. Is there any model where once it is plumbed for pump-out can still be emptied manually?
Thanks

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

An "MSD" version portapotty is what you're looking for. They're designed to be "permanently" installed--secured to the head sole with clamps...but those are just CLAMPS, they can be released. They have fittings installed to connect a vent line and pumpout line, but hoses CAN come off. If you expect to have a frequent need to take the tank off the boat, consider putting quick connect fittings in the pumpout and vent lines.

Both portable-only and MSD portapotties are available in two sizes--2.5 gallons and 5 gallons. A 5 gallon tank holds about 50 flushes and weighs nearly 50 lbs--a LOT to carry off a boat, or even up the cockpit a 2.5 gal. holds half as many flushes, weight half that much...but 25 lbs is still a LOT to pick up and carry anywhere.

The only mfrs who make MSD portapotties are Dometic/SeaLand Technology and Thetford. The online store right here on sbo.com carries both, in both sizes....at least they DID. All I can find today SeaLand, but a lot of this site is still under construction, so you'll have to ask if they still carry the Thetford.

 

[Jim Hawkins]

Thank you Peggy,
I had the Thetford 550 in mind until I called today and the nice folks there told me it could be used 1 way or the other but not both. If I understand you correctly then in order to manually empty it when it's hooked up for pump out would be basically disassembling it from the pump out configuration and then reassembling it again. Is that correct?

Also, on a side note, I would always opt for the 5 gal over the smaller. If I don't want to have to empty 5 gallons I can always empty it when it's half full but at times when I'm not able to I will have that extra capacity in reserve.

 

[Fred]

I previously had a dometic. The MSD adaptor can be removed with a quarter ( or was it half?) turn and replaced by the manual spout. If your pump out and vent hoses are long enough and if you have some space to turn the holding tank, you can remove the MSD adapter without removing hoses and clamps. Just slide a plastic bag over the MSD adaptor while you empty the ( portable) holding tank.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I had the Thetford 550 in mind until I called today and the nice folks there told me it could be used 1 way or the other but not both.

It's designed to use one way, but that doesn't mean you can't modify it. However...

Unless you plan to spend a lot of time in waters where no pumpout facilities are available--or too expensive, why you do think you need to be able to have it both ways? Most boat owners would jump at the idea that they can have a self-contained system that doesn't ever have to move!

 

[Jim Hawkins]

Because I plan to be Coastal Cruising and use the facilities 3 miles out.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Because I plan to be Coastal Cruising and use the facilities 3 miles out.

All you need to do is put a y-valve and an overboard discharge pump (macerator pump or manual diaphragm) in the pumpout line...one side from the y-valve to the deck pumpout, the other side to the pump and a thru-hull. If there is no thru-hull yet, install one. It doesn't get any easier than that to have it both ways.

 

[Jim Hawkins]

OK, that's sounds good, but I'm trying to get the fine details of the engineering. On the toilets I've seen, the tube to empty the waste tank is at the top of the tank and the tank must be tipped to empty. If an inline macerator pump is to pump the tank dry it would seem it needs to pull from the bottom of the tank or how would it work?

 

[kito]

I have the Thetford MSD and have it setup like Peggie said. I have it set for "pump out" but in legal waters I can turn the "y" valve and pump out overboard with a manual hand pump. I guess one could add another "y" valve pass the hand pump and pump the crap into a portable tank and take ashore for dumping too.

 

[seadaddler]

My head always pumps into my built in none remove holding tank and has a pumpout
from top of the tank but also on the bottom has opening to macerator to thru hull to pump overboard.
Nick

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

The pumpout adapter on MSD portapotties has a pickup tube inside the tank to the bottom. They couldn't be pumped out without removing the tank if there weren't. I think somebody added the opening at the bottom of yours, Nick...I've never seen one "out of the box" from the mfr that has any "holes" anywhere but on top because the possibility of a leak is higher than mfrs are willing to risk.

 

[Jim 5757]

OK folks I gotta get my hands dirty here. We have the Thetford 2.5gal potty with the pumpout adapter. As Peggy said it replaces the cap. It
has a small(1/2"?) fitting for the vent line and 1.5" for the deck pumpout & dip tube to draw from the bottom of the tank. Remove the fresh water tank, 1/4 turn to remove, install the regular cap and dump wherever you can.

 

[dziedzicmj]

You may want to note that in Ontario and, I bet that in many other provinces and states, it would be illegal to make a modification like this. The marine toilet has to be "permanently" mounted (I guess one could argue what "permanently" means). But the general idea is to prevent people from dumping the waste overboard (when no one is looking).

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Canadian law on all inland waters--at least all those in the eastern provinces--does prohibit any ability to discharge any toilet overboard. However, it's easy for TRANSIENT foreign flagged vessels that are plumbed to dump a tank at sea to comply: close and lock (tie wrap works) the seacock.

 

[Jim Hawkins]

Thanks again Peggy,
I think your first suggestion about the quick disconnect hoses makes sense. I'm thinking to just have one that is able to be pumped out or be disconnected to manually dump without the extra plumbing needed for a thru hull discharge. Can you suggest a model that would work best for that?

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I think your first suggestion about the quick disconnect hoses makes sense.

That would make sense only if you're somewhere inland where you'd have no choice but to carry the tank ashore...'cuz a) every time a hose is disconnected it's gonna drip something smelly...b) holding a full tank--which despite your best intentions, it will be more times than not--over the side of a boat that's pitching and yawing in the rain (which you can count on at least half the time)--will splatter waste all over the side of your boat IF you don't drop it over the side.

The ONLY thing that makes sense for the kind of coastal cruising you plan to do is a 5 gal MSD portapotty in which you'll install a y-valve in the pumpout line and an overboard discharge pump--and a new thru-hull/seacock so you can use them if none is already installed-- to give you choice of pumping out where you can or dumping at sea outside the "3 mile limit." There's no earthly reason why anyone should even THINK of lugging a tank up to the cockpit to dump it over the side if there's any other choice...which the ability to pump out or dump would give you.

And DO get the 5 gallon MSD portapotty. Why have to pump or dump any more often than you have to?

 

[Jim Hawkins]

Of the 2 Companies you mentioned above that make MSD's which models would you suggest?
For Thetford I suspect it's the 550? What about for Dometic?

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

965 or 970 MSD...Thetford, the 550P MSD

Btw, I edited my previous post after you read it.

 

[Doug J]

Jim,
I did exactly what you described to my MAC 26S, links below.

http://macgregor.sailboatowners.com/mods.php?task=article&mid=157&aid=7971&mn=26S
http://macgregor.sailboatowners.com/mods.php?task=article&mid=157&aid=7948&mn=26S

And I just finished doing the same thing to my Hunter 26.
I like the SaniPotties, I have owned four. The material they are made of makes them nearly indestructible, and replacement parts are readily available and easy to replace. Also, the design lends them perfect for what you want to do.

 

[Jim Hawkins]

Thanks everyone for all the great input! I know what I have to do.