Traveler length

Don Guillette · Mar 10, 2009

Bilgewater: Lets talk about what the traveler does. The ONLY element of the 4 elements of sail trim (draft depth, draft postion, twist and angle of attack) that the traveler adjust is angle of attack. The traveler has no effect on the other 3 elements. The secondary sail trim control for angle of attack is the mainsheet. I don't know this for a fact but I think boat builders have a mainsail size factor in mind that they use to determine when they should install a traveler.

The thing I don't like about using the mainsheet to adjust angle of attack is that when you start messing with the mainsheet your also changing TWIST and DRAFT POSITION but if all you have is the mainsheet you have to work with what you have.

I would imagine that a 3' traveler would do the job. I had a catalina25 that had the traveler mounted on the stern area. I don't remember its length but it was small almost to the extent it was useless.

As an aside - when the boat starts to heel say in a big puff the first mainsail trim control that 50% of the skippers go for is the mainsheet. Actually, the first control they should use is the traveler. All they have to do is drop the car and the boat comes back on its feet. The advantages to using the traveler is that it is a quick solution and the shape of the sail remains the same. So when the puff passes by all you have to do is crank the car back to its former position thus powering up the boat and off you go.

Don Guillette · Mar 10, 2009

Bilgewater; I like your name!!

Yes, you have it right. Next time your on the water try messing around with a "make believe" traveler since you don't have one. This is going to take 2 people. Get yourself set up for close hauled and then push it a little so the boat heels over. Relax the mainsheet but hold it in its original place by holding it against the boom or something. With the mainsheet held in its original position just move the boom outward a bit and watch what happens to the boat - it comes back on its feet. Now pull the boom toward the centerline and you'll see the heeling come back. You can pull this off on a smaller boat but with a sail as large as a 30' and above it won't work.

Pulling the traveler toward the centerline powers up the boat and easing the traveler down depowers the boat. It is as simple as that.

Ray Bowles · Mar 10, 2009

Bildgewater, while you are at it the addition of 18" jib car tracts really help with jib trim on the H26. We had a 95 26WB and had the same problems you are experencing. I never installed a traveller so I used a snap shackle on a second mainsheet and moved it outboard to the sidedeck when needed. Not a good remedy. Keep in mind the limits of the B&R rigging as it limits the outward travel of the boom.
Additionally boat really needs a boom vang. I felt the vang was the most important modification as our boat didn't have one.
Fair Winds, Ray

Don Guillette · Mar 11, 2009

Bilgewater: Be careful with the loose footed mainsail. By that I mean it is very easy to induce too much draft depth into your main when it is loose footed. Draft depth equates to power but too much belly causes you too loose power. On average the most draft depth you'll ever need is about 15%. If you would like to learn a quck and easy non scientific way to calculate draft depth let me know.

Is your boat a masthead or fractional rig. If it is a masthead rig the engine is the jib so you should pay close attention to the set of that sail because that is where the power comes from.

Ken Prichard · Mar 11, 2009

Quick & easy draft depth? I'm interested.

Ray Bowles · Mar 11, 2009

Bildgewater, You are fractional rigged and even though the main is the driver the controls for the jib that the factory gave you are woefully poor. I found that the jib cars were massivelly important when sailing anywhere off the wind. Upwind she's a hound and other than that she's hurting.
On the loose footed main. I've owned the H26 and an IP38 both with fully battened mains. After that I had a 1980 Catalina 22 with a standard battened main. I sailed that boat SO hard as to be disrespectful to the honor of a sailboat. Then I put a fully battened loose footed Ulman mailsail on her. This boats performance was the hardest fought, deepest loved I've ever had for anything other that my wife of 46 years. Damn, you can do so way much more with a loosefooted main than any standard paunchy belly main of yesterday. They love to be adjusted and tweeked. That C22 was about the most fun to race for us little guys that is possible to cheaply have. I now have a 1982 San Juan 23 that has more interior volumn. The cabin is large for her size like the H26 cabin. BUT she is faster than the C22. Big boats are great, but small boats work better for guys that like to sail without crews and respond instantly rig inputs and sail adjustments. She is also getting a new loose footed fully battened main this season. Just my thoughts but they sure work for me.
Love your H26 as she's fast when set up and the interior size is impossible to beat.
Fair winds, Ray
P.S. We did'nt use the V-berth for sleeping so we cut 16 inches off the long end of the table and radiused it the same as stock. It inlarged the cabin volumn and made moving around a lot easier. The table still seated four.

Clark · Mar 12, 2009

Quick & easy draft depth? I'm interested Too !!

Don Guillette · Mar 12, 2009

Clark: First let me tell you what the scientific definition is and then I'll give you a common seamans explanation. Do a goole search and you see how technical it is. A chord is a straight line connecting the leading and trailing edge of an airfoil (sail). The draft depth is measured from the chord line to deepest part of the mainsail. No wonder beginners don't get it at first!!

Draft depth is measured as a percentage (%). Suppose a skipper ordered the mainsail trimmer to induce 15% of draft depth. What is he talking about? He is telling the trimmer how many feet of depth (belly) he wants in the sail. Lets assume the the foot of the sail is 10' long. 15% would equal 1'6" - a foot and a half. That is how much belly he wants in the sail. Say he wanted 20% of draft depth. That would equal 2'. This is very unscientific but it gets you in the ball park. So measure the foot of your sail and go from there.

Same goes for draft position. Suppose the skipper ordered a draft position of 50%. What does he mean? He wants an imaginary line running from top to bottom through the deepest part of the center of the sail to intersect the boom at about the half way point of the 5' mark.

This expanation may be as clear as mud!! if it is let me know and I'll go over it again. Once you recognize draft depth and draft position you'll see how easy it is.

paphman · Mar 12, 2009

Ray,

I too have a C-22 that we sail on Lake Ontario. Love that boat. I am thinking of replacing the main next season, and was not sure which way to go. I thought about the loose footed, but am not sure. Is the stock boom strong enought for that set up? We do not race but I love to tweek things. Will the sail flake as easy as the shelf footed ? Did you notice any more speed from the sail? What did you dislike, if anything , about the loose footed sail. Thanks in advance Ray.

Dale

Don Guillette · Mar 13, 2009

Bilgewater: I know you have THE SAIL TRIM USERS GUIDE but I'm not sure if you have my SAIL TRIM CHART. With each sail trim chart I provide a free QUICK REFERENCE which tells you what sail trim controls for the mainsail and jib are used to adjust draft depth, draft position, twist and angle of attack. It also tells you which way to push or pull each control to get the effect you desire.

The mainsail trim controls that adjust draft depth is the outhaul and mast bend. Please note I said MAST BEND not MAST RAKE. The mainsail trim controls that adjust draft position are the boom vang, cunningham (main halyard), mainsheet, mast bend (not rake) and the outhaul. Cranking on those controls moves the draft position forward and decreasing tension moves the draft position aft.

The problem most sailors have is they have to be careful when they push or pull a particular sail trim control. In other words, when you crank on the mainsheet you may think you are just adjusting the angle of attack. Unfortunately, your also effecting twist and draft position.

In THE SAIL TRIM USERS GUIDE the first chapter discusses what I call the "4 element of sail trim" which are draft depth, draft position, twist and angle of attack. At the end of the first chapter I state that you should NOT move on the next chapter until you have a complete understanding of the 4 elements of sail trim. The reason for that statement is none of the aspects of sail trim will make any sense to you unless you understand the 4 elements.

One last point - sailors should spend a small amount of time working on each element ONE AT A TIME. In other words, dial in TWIST and take it out. Watch the top of the sail open and close. Dial in DRAFT POSITION and watch the imaginary line move forward and aft. Draft position is very difficult to see when you first start to work on it but once you actually see it it becomes easy.

Clark · Mar 13, 2009

Cunningham and/or halyard can adjust draft position.

Ray Bowles · Mar 21, 2009

Paphman, Sorry it took so long to get back to you. The Ulman fully battened loosefooted main is the best way to go. Most C22 mains are loose footed now and they are far superior. The boat needs a good vang and you must set up a good outhaul that can be adjusted in 1/4 to 1/2 inch increments. I can catch you off line if you want more info. A C22 can be set up to flat sail the bottom of most trailerable boats. Ray

paphman · Mar 24, 2009

Ray,

Thanks for the info. I think the loose foot is the way we will go. Thanks again

Dale