Transom hung vs well hung outboards

[c_witch]

Hiee all,

Recently I've been mussing with the idea of getting rid of the transom bracket for the outboard and fabricating a well inside the aft locker and mounting the OB there. It would me centered on the keel line, that 100#s or so would be moved forward inside the boat about 2 feet and the prop would virtually never come out of the water.

Has anyone made this mod to their boat? We have a bulkhead at the aft end of the cockpit that could be beefed up ie thickened to hang the motor on and then 2 sides added and glassed into the hull to form the rest of the box. The actual hole opening thru the hull would not have to be particularly large maybe 6x6 or 6x8. How much drag might it cause?? I'd end up with 2 aft lockers instead of the current one but both large enough to carry fuel tanks. The tiller would have to be reworked to clear the engine cowling etc.

Just wondering about the idea for now.

c_witch

 

[Mike B1026]

Ever wonder why so few boats use that design? Sounds like a lot of work for any questionable advantages. Not to mention the pain of lifting the motor (or leave it in the water all the time if boat is kept in the water) If you had a lighter motor it wouldn't be as bad. The well also limits your ability to turn the motor which limits turning the boat in close quarters (at least with some well type boats I have seen)

Is this mainly for "looks?"

 

[HukilauMike]

It's your boat, and its sounds do-able, but I agree with Mike B; there's a reason that no one builds boats with outboard wells anymore. You can't get the outboard out of the water (at least not without a lot of effort), which means you have to coat it with bottom paint, and deal with all of the maintenance issues constant immersion means. And I don't know about you, but I love being able to turn the outboard on my boat. The manuverability is fantastic around the docks, and I would be very reluctant to give that up. And I don't see how the prop will be lower in the water with a well than it is with a bracket; maybe I'm missing something with how your boat is set up, but you should be able to have the engine lower with a bracket than in a well.

Although I have to agree that having the engine hang off the back of the boat is much less visually appealing, IMHO the benefits of the bracket-hung engine outweigh the cons.

Having said all that, this is your boat. One of the best things about sailing is doing what you want on your boat. Go for it. It will undoubtedly make your boat better looking!

 

[caguy]

My Luger is Well Hung (Great Pickup Line)

It does sound like a lot of work, but there are some advantages. I haven't tested it yet but I understand it is much quieter. I also understand that having the prop in front of the rudder improves steerability. Access to the motor is much improved. It has a nice sliding bracket and block that allows you to easily raise and lower the motor. I believe he motor can be pulled out of the water. Whether there is still need for a long shaft is yet to be discovered. It doesn't look difficult to add steerage to the motor if needed. The well has two compartments on the sides, one for a gas tank and the other for propane.
Here are some old pictures of when I first bought the Luger, please excuse the mess.

 

[dave lundy]

Re: My Luger is Well Hung (Great Pickup Line)

Having owned a Cape Dory 25 for years I can offer you some insight on having the OB in a well. The motor will be air starved which will necessitate running with the hatch over the well opened. When sailing or steaming at hull speed the stern wave will rise up into the well and flood it, in a small space not so bad but in a big space this poops the stern, not good. I had that boat (hull #10) for six years and a day did not go by when I wasn't thinking about a transom bracket of some design or other.
My vote is that you stick with the bracket and leave well enough alone.
Dave

 

[dscribner]

My boat originally had a motor well. A PO did a really nice job of glassing over that hole and moving the OB onto a bracket. Can't tell you whether it was a good move or not, but it was worth it to him to put lots of time an money into the change.

 

[caguy]

My boat originally had a motor well. A PO did a really nice job of glassing over that hole and moving the OB onto a bracket. Can't tell you whether it was a good move or not, but it was worth it to him to put lots of time an money into the change.

I don't like the setup that Novelman has on his Lancer 25 either. The notion of the gas cans floating around in that well was not reassuring.
As far as being air starved the Luger has some large air vents. It also has some side compartment for gas and propane that are well above the water line.

 

[c_witch]

I think some of you may be confusing the idea I have here. I am NOT TALKING about a transom well with the motor still hanging off the back of the boat. I am talking about a well in front of the transom and behind the cockpit. This puts the motor inside the boat. It will sit at the same height more or less as it does now when the bracket is in the up position. Think of it kinda like a sail drive unit only the leg could be turnable ie direction control although with the prop in front of the rudder that feature shouldn't really be needed.

c_witch

 

[Mike B1026]

I may be wrong but I think everyone understood your idea.

 

[alexco38]

There's a Etchells sailboat with a Honda outboard inside a well inside the cockpit. The lower unit was secured in a rubber skirt to the hull. Although the motor sits in a well, it doesn't steer. It's like a saildrive.

BTW, there is no way to mount an outboard on a Etchells due to long overhung.

Etchell is a super fast racer.

 

[Joe]

There were many boat designs in the 60's and 70's that incorporated an enclosed motor well. There are two such boats neighboring my own. The Columbia 26 Pilothouse next door stows his motor in the cabin, because it won't tilt up inside the well.. that also limits the size... but he has fabricated a set of boards to fit around the shaft to help keep water out of the motor well.

I can't see there being a great enough improvement to justify the labor and expense of such a conversion.

I can, however, see putting effort and money into installing a remote control for your OB.....

 

[caguy]

I can't see there being a great enough improvement to justify the labor and expense of such a conversion.

I can, however, see putting effort and money into installing a remote control for your OB.....

Second that Joe, I really, really like my electric start and throttle/ shift remote.

 

[dscribner]

Nope. I was missing it. Now it's interesting.

 

[Sumner]

.. that 100#s or so would be moved forward inside the boat about 2 feet and the prop would virtually never come out of the water...

I'm with most of the others here and wouldn't do it for the reasons given. Too many negatives.

I'm curious about the 'prop coming out of the water'. Is it a long shaft now? Also can you or have you considered moving current weight forward in the boat to offset the stern weight.

We have one of the two batteries moved forward and also...

.... about 40 gallons of water forward and much more forward under the v-berth,

Sum

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[c_witch]

Hiee Sum and others,

Ok they say a picture is worth a K words so here it is below. I've yet to have the prop come out of the water but then I have not been in any sea's greater then about 2 feet. Actually it was coming out of the water but was in the up position at the time.

Only the leg/prop assembly would be in the well. So we maintain full steerage of the motor tiller side to side. We have a split baby stay on the transom about 5 feet long. The port one makes it very difficult to start the engine and to lift/lower it as well as tilt, due to it being in the way. Also its in the way of the tiller unless I swing the tiller nearly vertical to miss it. With the 20 gallon water tank under the forward berth we have plenty of weight forward. Having the motor inside the boat makes having to do any work on it very easy and also makes steering with it 100% easier ie not having to reach back and down to the tiller.

c_witch

PS again I'm just toying with the idea as we don't intend to keep this boat as its purpose was to rehone my skills and better learn to sail before moving up to our 35 cruiser.

 

[HukilauMike]

I think some of you may be confusing the idea I have here. I am NOT TALKING about a transom well with the motor still hanging off the back of the boat. I am talking about a well in front of the transom and behind the cockpit. This puts the motor inside the boat. It will sit at the same height more or less as it does now when the bracket is in the up position. Think of it kinda like a sail drive unit only the leg could be turnable ie direction control although with the prop in front of the rudder that feature shouldn't really be needed.

c_witch

I understood your plan when I made my comments. To me the benefits are: better looking boat; better protected engine; enjoyable project. The cons clearly outweigh the benefits for me, especially the loss of manuverability. I agree that having the prop in front of the rudder is better than a fixed direction prop behind the rudder, but it is still clearly inferior to a movable prop. I can almost make my boat spin 360 degrees in place with my pivotable outboard. Can't do that with a single fixed prop. And unless you plan to take your boat out into blue water, I really wouldn't worry too much about the vulnerability of an outboard on a bracket. That leaves the "better looking" boat argument, and the enjoyment you would get from completing the project. If that's enough for you, then go for it. I just don't think you are going to get a "better" set up out of the deal.

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

I did it for a customer years ago- he was delighted. James Baldwin ( 2 time circumnavigator aboard Atom) has done several- take a look at his "articles" section-

http://www.atomvoyages.com/

I've also run some 10,000 miles on a boat with the outboard in a well.. Including twice across the Gulf Stream and twice on passage across the GOM.

Best setup I've ever had, other than not being able to lift the lower unit. Quiet, much easier to reach controls, etc So anti-foul it, and scrub it once in a while..If I could do it on my current boat, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Engine in a well beats the daylights out of one on a bracket in my opinion

 

[Sumner]

....again I'm just toying with the idea as we don't intend to keep this boat as its purpose was to rehone my skills and better learn to sail before moving up to our 35 cruiser.

Considering the above I'd also not do it. Is this a winter project or how long is the boat going to be out of commission when you could of been using her. Also are future owners going to look at this as a plus or a minus when considering buying the boat? It is a big mod, one I probably wouldn't tackle and I like mods. It will have to be done very well in my opinion or it will distract from selling the boat in the future.

I guess I could see it for crossing oceans if that is your intended use of the boat, but I don't think it is. I'm sure glad that we didn't have something like it....

...crossing Florida Bay when there was floating grass every where and we had to keep pulling the prop out of the water to clear it. If the outboard would of been in the well I would of had to dive under the boat about 10 times 20 miles from shore or would of had to pulled the outboard out of the well. That would of not been fun. As it was we were moving again in a couple minutes.

We have friends that have a Cat with 2 outboards in wells. They fouled one on a pot line in Florida near Marathon. They have a long tree-trimmer/cutter they take them and they were able to cut the line and go on, but only because their well is large enough to get the cutter down into the water by the prop. With the line cut they went on using the second outboard as the prop was still fouled on the other one. Later they got under the boat and cleared the prop.

As others have said it is your boat, so do what makes sense to you and if you make the mod post pictures on the work and the results,

Sum

 

[HankPhillips]

The previous owner on ours cut the well open at some point and the did a sloppy repair sealing it up. We have a transom mount on our boat and have no intention of reinstalling the motor in the well.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

As a small sailboat dealer for over 30 years, I have seen much and experienced mor than most but the cons outwiegh the project C withch wants to do.

The motor would sit in a well. It is fixed in place with no ability to turn it which is not good particuarly when you are trying to dock or turn in small places. The lower house will corrode unless you want to take the motor out everytime and store it inside the cabin where it will stink up the cabin from the fumes not to mention the mess it can cause. If racing, water will slow it down with that hole in the hull not to mention the motor remianing in the motor well. Finally, I was amazed seeing the gel coat and fiberglass being worn down from the friction of the water at right angles with the motor well. FYI