Tiller .vs. Wheel

Apex

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Jun 19, 2013
1,211
C&C 30 Elk Rapids
...again?..... no, instead I wanted to hear what was the moment you "got it" switching to wheel.
For me, i would always steer the wrong way, intuition was using a tiller. Then finally someone mentioned, just steer it like a car. That made sense.

How about you? Was it simply time? Or perhaps you are going the OTHER way , trying to learn tiller steering
 

jssailem

SBO Weather and Forecasting Forum Jim & John
Oct 22, 2014
22,836
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
Sailing I started with tillers.
It was simple instruction in the water. Pull the bow falls off the wind. Push away the boat heads into the wind. Sitting low in an El Toro trying to keep the boat upright you pick it up quick or you are swimming.

Also using power boats in the marina the wheel steering is like riding a hot wheels trike. No issues.

Taking the helm of a big sailboat with a wheel was just putting the two together. Using the wheel to come into the wind or fall off.

Now do it all again, but with the boat going backwards.
 
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Likes: Ward H
Jun 21, 2004
2,791
Beneteau 343 Slidell, LA
Trained on tiller boats and it became a natural thing. When switching to a wheel had no difficulty making the transition. Initially, I did have some problems backing until someone told me to stand in front of helm to back. Been driving boats with wheel steering now for over 30 years so no problems; however, when I rarely drive the dinghy, with a tiller outboard, got to think about it, especially when backing.
 
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Likes: jssailem
Oct 19, 2017
7,947
O'Day Mariner 19 Littleton, NH
I'm a very visual person. I think I can remember a time I had trouble with the whole steering from the rear, but for me, when I maneuver a boat, I picture the rudder, hull connection, not the thing in my hand. That is just the game controller. Which way should the rudder turn. Tillers are easy because they are driven by a stick, directly connected and forward of the rudder. Wheels are connected directly to the direction you want to point.

I initially found compass steering hard because the disk is read on the back side, but then there are other compasses that are more like a dome, read on the front side.

-Will
 
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Likes: jssailem
Jun 12, 2021
290
Hunter 240 Aqualand Marina, Lake Lanier
My only issue with a tiller is the space it demands. A wheel takes up a lot of room but it doesn't randomly demand any additional space as it moves up and down, left and right. That being said, I have never had a boat with a wheel. Coming from a lower middle class family, none of our boats were that big and I still have a feeling that a wheel is some how pretentious. It also doesn't help that the editor of Motor Boating is reported to have said, "If Billy Atkin ever designed an Ocean Liner, it would have a tiller." I love Atkins boat designs.
I still go to Atkin & Co. - Boat Plans and review all the boat plans. From the 29 foot raised deck rescue boat Heaven (my dad called it a rum runner) and the 22 foot schooner Florence Oakland (I found one for sale that I so truly wanted to buy) that would have been the prettiest boat on Lake Lanier had I pursued it.
I am quite happy with our little Hunter 240 with it's tiller pushing it's way into everyone's lap and knees. But if I ever bought a blue blazer and a pipe I would have my picture taken behind a ship's wheel with the sun setting off the stern and the wind blowing through what is left of my hair.
 
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Likes: FastOlson
Apr 5, 2009
3,102
Catalina '88 C30 tr/bs Oak Harbor, WA
I have never understood all of the anguish I hear over steering either with a wheel or a tiller. I have honestly never given it a monents thought. First time on a vehicle, I wiggle the directional thingy and my brain interpreters that response and that it is.
It is like riding a bike. Does anyone really "think" about how to turn one? If you analyze the action, it is just like a tiller. You turn the wheel right to go left. (the right turn initiates the off-center lean that allows the bike to turn.)
 
Aug 19, 2019
45
C&C 25 mk2 Seneca Lake
I sail with a tiller and on the occasion when I helm on a wheel I sometimes catch myself turning the wheel opposite to the desired direction. It's muscle memory and when helming a sailboat is no big deal for me to overcome. I appreciate the simplicity of a tiller and its ability to transmit feedback more directly. On the otherhand, it takes up a lot of room in a smaller boat's cockpit. On reading this thread, I was reminded of a video (link below). There is more to this phenomenon that one might assume at first glance. This video link has really nothing to do with sailing, but the concept is related to this thread.
Cheers.

 

Tom J

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Sep 30, 2008
2,323
Catalina 310 Quincy, MA
Then finally someone mentioned, just steer it like a car. That made sense.
:p Yeah, I tried that once. I had two inexperienced guests on board and had to use the head. I gave the wheel to one guest and said to just keep the bow pointed straight ahead, and the wheel turns just like a car. As I was leaving the head, the boat started turning in an ever tightening circle. By the time I got back to the wheel, we were coming up on our original heading. I said something about, wow, I didn't know my boat could turn like that. When I asked what happened, my guest said she had turned the wheel a little to bring the bow back in line, but nothing happened, so she turned it more. Eventually, she had the helm hard over. I forgot to tell her the boat steers from the rear, not the front.
 
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Likes: Apex
Jun 21, 2004
2,791
Beneteau 343 Slidell, LA
On reading this thread, I was reminded of a video (link below). There is more to this phenomenon that one might assume at first glance. This video link has really nothing to do with sailing, but the concept is related to this thread.
Cheers.
Reminds me of re-learning how to ride a motorcycle. In the 70’s I had a street / trail bike. Never had any training, just pointed in the direction l wanted to go & leaned a bit into the turn and went. Very simple. About 20 years ago I decided to start riding again & bought a Harley. Much bigger, heavier, & powerful machine so I enrolled in a state conducted training course. I was introduced to a concept called “counter steering”; it is counter intuitive to instincts until you learn the physics involved. For instance, if you want to go left, you push the left handlebar left, that’s right, you push to the left. The front wheel will point right and the bike leans left; since the tire is running more on the side surface of the tire ( smaller diameter surface) the bike turns left instantly. The bike leans on its own without input from your body posture. Takes awhile to get used to it; however, this technique gives you more control in curves and for evasive maneuvering. Try this principle using a styrofoam coffee cup, placed on its side and note how the cup turns in the direction of the narrow end of the cup. BTW, sold the Harley about five years ago; lots of fun, but too much risk.....too many distracted drivers out there. Much worse than power boaters & jet skies!!
 
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Likes: Tom J
Feb 26, 2004
22,996
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
I have never understood all of the anguish I hear over steering either with a wheel or a tiller. I have honestly never given it a moments thought.
:plus: Me, too. I see it a lot, and wonder if people have this kinda issue, how do they manage to sail the rest of the complicated sailboat? :banghead::wow3::beer::beer::beer:
 
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Tom J

.
Sep 30, 2008
2,323
Catalina 310 Quincy, MA
:plus: Me, too. I see it a lot, and wonder if people have this kinda issue, how do they manage to sail the rest of the complicated sailboat? :banghead::wow3::beer::beer::beer:
:plus::plus: I admit I didn't think much about how to steer a boat, until I saw some people new to boats attempt it, like my guest in my earlier post. It's funny how children, though, don't seem to have the same problem. Just like when you put a kid on skis, they take to it within an hour or so, while the adults are struggling for hours to do the same thing. When I put my 10 year old granddaughter on the helm of my sailboat, she was doing fine within a couple of minutes. For an adult used to steering a car, handling the steering on a boat takes a lot longer. When I was a kid, my Dad always had a runabout for us to use on the lake where our cottage was. Using the tiller on the outboard, and then the wheel steering with cables to an outboard just seemed natural.
Maybe as we get older, it gets even harder to master boat handling if we are new to it. I had a brother-in-law who bought a nice Grady White 20' cuddy cabin when he retired, which surprised me, since he had never expressed an interest in boating. I went with him a few times to get him used to the boat, but he always did the same thing. He would point the bow in the direction he wanted to go, regardless of current and wind, etc., as if he was driving his car. Eventually, he would wander out of the channel, or run over a lobster pot. After the third time getting towed in with a lobster buoy tangled in his prop, he sold the boat.
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
7,089
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
I think a tiller is just a beautiful way to steer a boat. I have toyed with the idea of converting my Tartan 3800 to tiller steering. I'd get that binnacle out of the cockpit and literally never need an emergency helm, as the tiller would connect directly to the top of the rudder post. Would design a folding tiller so at anchor I could fold it in half and up, out of the way. Maybe put autopilot auto/standby switches into the end of the tiller, too.
 
Apr 5, 2009
3,102
Catalina '88 C30 tr/bs Oak Harbor, WA
I have had a few tiller skippers on my boat for distance races who could never get the hang of the wheel. I now tell them to sit to windward like they were on their own boat and hold the wheel only on the bottom half. (Low hand rather than high hand.) Then just forget that it is a wheel and drive the boat. Pull to bear away and push to head up. Problems solved! This trick has never failed (except when they forget to hold the bottom half of the wheel.
 
Jan 13, 2009
394
J Boat 92 78 Sandusky
I’ve had wheels and tillers. My current 30’ race boat has a tiller and extension which is great when steering from the rail. Any boat over 35’ is a pain with a tiller. Long offshore passages are physically demanding in conditions where an autopilot is not feasible. Small boat and shorter distance racing/cruising- tiller. Bigger and heavy boats, especially on long downwind courses- wheel. One of the toughest sails I’ve done is 150 miles driving a Catalina 38 in the Mac Race. We wore out all 4 drivers in the crew. Winds were 15-25. The lack of mechanical advantage with a heavy boat and a big rudder made it tough. I would have killed for a nice big wheel in those conditions.
 

jviss

.
Feb 5, 2004
7,089
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
I’ve had wheels and tillers. My current 30’ race boat has a tiller and extension which is great when steering from the rail. Any boat over 35’ is a pain with a tiller. Long offshore passages are physically demanding in conditions where an autopilot is not feasible. Small boat and shorter distance racing/cruising- tiller. Bigger and heavy boats, especially on long downwind courses- wheel. One of the toughest sails I’ve done is 150 miles driving a Catalina 38 in the Mac Race. We wore out all 4 drivers in the crew. Winds were 15-25. The lack of mechanical advantage with a heavy boat and a big rudder made it tough. I would have killed for a nice big wheel in those conditions.
Not everyone would agree. Some pretty big sailboats were tiller steered, for centuries! And, much bigger than 35'.

II don't understand the unfeasibility of the autopilot comment, though. Was it undersized for the vessel?
 
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Likes: Will Gilmore

Tom J

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Sep 30, 2008
2,323
Catalina 310 Quincy, MA
Here in Hawaii it is all about "tiller" steering. More accurately, a steering oar.
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