The Newb went sailing for the first time solo

justsomeguy · Apr 12, 2014

You just needed a little mainsail, I think, to help you point more into the wind.

And with a 30 knot breeze, an even littler mainsail!

Congratulations on your first singlehanding, and reef early.

The Garbone · Apr 13, 2014

Yup, what Just said. A bit of main to move the center of effort aft. Think of the keel as a pivot.

Knuttle · Apr 15, 2014

Jib

Two comments. First the boat is not designed to be sailed under jib only. You are better off sailing with Main only, but again that is not efficient. You need the ballance of both sails and learn how to handle both sails to lean to sail.
Note: Sailing is not getting the boat to move, BUT getting the boat to move where you want to go.

Second: you comment about the flapping jib. I learned to sail by reading, and doing. No where did I see that all of the Jib sheets should be knotted on the end after passing through the last eye before the cleat, or knotted after passing through the base of the cleat. I had an experience similar to yours. It was a nice day and I had had the boat our a couple of times. I had confidently taken my wife and year old daughter with me. As you experienced a Wind came up, the sheet got away from my wife and we ended up with my wife shouting she had to take care of the baby who was crying and both jib sheet flying out in front of the boat, (I believe that is where the experesion "all sheet to the wind" came from. It is a very helpless feeling

We finally got the sheets back and this time knotted them.

It is done now as we put the mast up the jib sheets are knotted before the mast goes up

Justin_NSA · Apr 15, 2014

I agree completely with what Knuttle says!
When the wind is high, I will sail under main alone because it's easier for me to control from the tiller. I have a single line reef system but I've seldom used it. The furler is nice when i have a crew because I can let out a small headsail and maintain balance.

The Garbone · Apr 15, 2014

Only time I run jib only is when running as I do not have a preventer and do not wish to accidental jibe.

In heavier wind I will wrap the furling line around the winch once before pulling it from the clutch. That way I can control how much unfurls as it can get away from you otherwise.

John23883 · Apr 15, 2014

Jib or main

If single handed or with the expectation that the wind will build, use the main only. If you need to, you can ease the main sheet as needed for a gust or if you are being over-powered and heeling too much. You cannot ease the jib, it's cleated tight, so if you need to ease it, you're stuck! People will say that if you are using one sail it should be the jib but that assumes you have a deep heavy keel and you are experienced enough to be comfortable with lots of heel.

So, main only and reef early and often! If in doubt, reef before you go out, it is much easier to shake the reef out than it is to put it in while all hell is breaking loose.

Piotr · Apr 15, 2014

1) Macgregors are rigged as sloops, so require 2 sails for proper balance. If you run jib only, the wind will exert force on your boat in FRONT of the keel. Therefore, your bow will be trying to pivot AWAY from the wind (as you experienced). If you run on Main only, the wind will exert force on your boat BEHIND the keel trying to swing the bow into the wind. NEVER run the boat under a jib only - it's actually dangerous, as the boat will not turn into wind. If you lose control, you will end up on the windward shore. If you are uncertain of your skills, sail under a main only. If it gets too windy - reef the main. If you post the pics of your boat with the main up, we'll tell you how to reef it. Ideally, you should run both sails. If it's too windy, reef the main first, then drop your jib. for puffs, control your heel by letting out sails, starting with the main.
2) Whitecaps staring to form at about 10 kts (wind force 3 on Beaufort scale). at 11-16 kts whitecaps become numerous (force 4). It's also the best sailing wind for most Macgregors. at 17-21 kts,(force 5) you will notice some spray being pulled from the wave tops. This is the strongest wind I would go out in my Mac 25, and likely what you experienced. on land, small trees begin to sway. Next one is 22-27kts (force 6) where large trees begin to sway and telephone wires begin to whistle and white caps are common. At this wind a small craft advisories are usually issued. Force 7 is 28-33kts also called a near gale wind. I'm fairly sure that's NOT what you experienced. I could likely managed to get into a marina on my outboard, but I would have dropped both sails or, at best, sail under a double-reefed main only, and only if I had to. Waves would likely be 2-4 feet at that point. I experienced wind like that on a lake- once. In a 16-ft Melges, with a VERY experienced racer.We were barely able to get under cover. When we landed, the broken tree branches were everywhere, and his house lost several screen windows.
3) Always tie an 8-knot at the end of each sheet (main and jib) before going out.
4) welcome to sailing ;-)

Piotr · Apr 15, 2014

One more point on balancing the boat - back in the old country, we had to pass exams to be allowed to sail. For crewing or renting small boats on a lake, we had to pass a seamanship exam, to steer bigger boats (3/4 ton and up), we needed a helmsman rating, and to skip any sailing vessel, you needed (of course) a captain's rating (there were 3 different ones, with the Ocean Captain being the highest). The tests were both theoretical and practical. Practical part of the captain's exam was to perform a jibe and a tack (sailing "figure 8") WITHOUT using your rudder, i.e. by steering with your sails alone. The idea is that a well balanced boat will sail in a straight line without the helmsman needing to even touch the steering wheel or a tiller. To tack or jibe, you had to move the center of the wind force back and forth by tightening or letting out jib and main in a specific sequence. I bet that if you let go of a rudder while sailing under jib alone, the boat would start turning with the wind, i.e. it was unbalanced. try it the next time you sail under both sails.

Piotr · Apr 15, 2014

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgBoAD8LBMI
here is an example of what I'm talking about

Piotr · Apr 16, 2014

RideTheWind said:
Yep... You are of course correct. When a good puff comes along I definitely have to force it on the rudder to stay at a decent angle. And as you stated it became near impossible to face into the wind. The logic is definitely clicking. As to the jib waving wildly in the high winds... I never actually lost the sheets, however in an effort to deepower the jib as the boat heeled. Frankly I probably over reacted, but I was concerned that I might get wet.... Like all the way wet.
I feel pretty silly in a way for purchasing a sailboat without vastly more experience, however there just doesn't seem to be a sailing community right here.
On the other hand there is a Yacht club up in Tahoe, and from what I read they do accept rookie crew, so I am considering signing up.
I will get some picks of the main when I am able... It's just always windy.
I may be able to pull it off in the marina as the lake is very low so the marina is in a bowl right now.

Nothing silly about buying a boat to sail it. I sailed as a teen on dinghies, but the first time I bought a keel boat (Catalina 18), it was a struggle. Don't worry - we'll help you!

If you become a member of a yachtclub, I'm sure you'll find plenty of people willing to show you the basics. BTW, wind=good. On Chesapeake, we have NO wind from mid June to mid August- it sucks. One more advice - the more you sail the better you get, so sail often. Don't feel embarassed about your skill level - we all had to learn sometime. there are plentyof youtube videos dealing with the basics, a well as books where you can learn terminology. Finally, look up the sailing schools - they are usually offered in the yach clubs.

Piotr · Apr 16, 2014

One more thing - is mac 21 a keel boat? if it is, don't worry about getting wet, aka getting a knockdown, aka going "turtle." Keel boats are constructed in such a way that the more you are heeling, the stronger the force trying to right you up. If you feel uncomfortable with a heel angle (usually 30 degs or more), simply let out the main sheet and the boat will right itself up. But it takes a LOT of wind to do that. Look up on youtube "sailboat knockdown" if you want to learn about it.

walt · Apr 16, 2014

Im a little fuzzy on the details as its been a bunch of years but I used to be very much into windsurfing and seemed like Topaz was a great place for windsurfing - one of those places you heard about because it had particularly good winds.

"good winds" for windsurfing when I was younger now means it might be "windy as hell" now that Im considerably older.

Is Topaz the lake Im thinking of? Was there a lot of windsurfing there at one time or maybe still?

Justin_NSA · Apr 16, 2014

walt said:
"good winds" for windsurfing when I was younger now means it might be "windy as hell" now that Im considerably older.

The windsurfers seem to only come out on Cheney when it's too windy for most sailors. We had them buzzing around our boat one day. I thought one of them was going to get fouled up in the mast!

Knuttle · Apr 16, 2014

Piotr said:
One more thing - is mac 21 a keel boat? if it is, don't worry about getting wet, aka getting a knockdown, aka going "turtle." Keel boats are constructed in such a way that the more you are heeling, the stronger the force trying to right you up. If you feel uncomfortable with a heel angle (usually 30 degs or more), simply let out the main sheet and the boat will right itself up. But it takes a LOT of wind to do that. Look up on youtube "sailboat knockdown" if you want to learn about it.

The 21 could be considered a keel boat IF the keel is properly locked down, If it is not then there are conditions which could cause it to go Turtle. ie a condition when it is in an extreme heel and something causes the keel to bounce up into the boat.

However I have had my 21 since 1970. I have never felt it going negative, and I have had it so that I was walking on the side of the cockpit. Again this is assuming that the keel is fully down, and on some what protected waters.