Tachometer Trouble On Shore Power?

Jan 11, 2014
12,722
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
Rick, I have no reason to believe that there's any issue with running the engine while plugged in. Perhaps you are suffering from fear of the unknown? Can you point to a single owner's manual that say not to do this? That said, the only "connection" of note is at the battery, the shore power charger and the alternator connection, and this is no different than leaving your solar panels connected when you're plugged in - they just don't care. I am happy to learn something, though, if you can tell me why this is a problem, other than fear, uncertainty, and doubt.
Why don't you just turn the battery charger off instead of wearing out the plugs on your shore power cord?
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
7,089
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
Why don't you just turn the battery charger off instead of wearing out the plugs on your shore power cord?
I honestly don't understand what you are saying. What is wearing out the pugs on the shore power cord, the current?

BTW, turning off the charger on a Freedom 10 would require that I turn the whole thing off, I think, and it's a pain to access in the cockpit locker. (The battery charger breaker on the AC panel does nothing.). Besides, who cares? :)
 

jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
7,089
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
This is not good. It should be connected to a breaker on the AC panel.
I will have to look into it. There's a galvanic isolator and a Freedom 10 thing in the cockpit locker, and some kind of patch panel behind the breaker panel, and a Link 2000R inverter controller and dual battery monitor.

Ah, found the Freedom 10 manual. It is circuit-breaker protected:

Circuit Breaker Protection
The Freedom Inverter/Charger is circuit
breaker protected. The INV/CHG breaker on
the front of the unit protects against sustained
inverter/charger over current conditions.

(table omitted due to whacky formatting issues)

The 30 Amp INPUT circuit breaker on the
Freedom unit protects the incoming AC circuit.
The incoming AC circuit provides power to the
battery charger and transfers power to the
loads connected to the inverter AC output.
The breakers are reset by pushing the button
back in.
I guess the battery charger breaker on the AC panel is for conventional shore power chargers.
 
Sep 11, 2022
67
Catalina 34 mk 1.5 Rockland ME
Could it be that the shore power charger is keeping the battery voltage high enough that the alternator regulator isn't pumping any field current and the alternator isn't 'generating,' hence no pulses to the tach?
This seems entirely plausible. I design power supplies for a living, and this sort of things happens often when you have two supplies sharing the same load.

Due to magnetic hysteresis, there may be some residual magnetic flux in the field that makes voltage even if the current is zero, but it might not be enough to trigger the tach and/or might also be "referenced" to V- or V+ or floating somewhere in between. If you had an oscilloscope you could look at the voltage going into your tach.
 
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Likes: Leeward Rail
Mar 20, 2015
3,199
C&C 30 Mk1 Winnipeg
The VDO Vision Series 333-163 ( which I used as a replacement for the original Yanmar tach) can use anything
Nice unit and not surprised with VDO.

I was curious if any older boats had hall effect tachs from factory.. oem.
The limited budget of me and my cohorts means old boats are all I see.
 
Sep 11, 2022
67
Catalina 34 mk 1.5 Rockland ME
I am already jealous of @Davidasailor26 for posting a photo of his scope.
On my wish list.
While not exactly pocket change, they’re a lot more affordable than they used to be. For a basic scope, I’ve personally been impressed by the value and quality in the Rigol DS1000Z series that was pictured.
 

dLj

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Mar 23, 2017
4,251
Belliure 41 Back in the Chesapeake
I've been wishing to have the $'s to buy a fluke 120B handheld oscilloscope... Talk about perfect for having on a boat... At least seems to me... I don't know anything about the Rigol you mention but I do see it runs on house current. The Fluke runs on batteries. Makes for a nice portable unit...


But chump change it is not...

dj
 
Mar 20, 2015
3,199
C&C 30 Mk1 Winnipeg
But chump change it is not
it is made by fluke. :biggrin:

For simple diagnostic work some Chinese ones work well. A tech I know has a 3 channel unit for automotive diag.
 
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jviss

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Feb 5, 2004
7,089
Tartan 3800 20 Westport, MA
it is made by fluke. :biggrin:

For simple diagnostic work some Chinese ones work well. A tech I know has a 3 channel unit for automotive diag.
Ha, ha, I have an old-school "portable" 'scope, a Tektronix 2465B, 450Mhz CRT scope, no storage. It was my favorite when I was doing circuits work decades ago, so I picked one up on eBay maybe 15 years ago for short change. A modern, digital storage 'scope would be nice, though! My probes cost more than those 'scopes!
 
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Likes: kloudie1
May 17, 2004
5,548
Beneteau Oceanis 37 Havre de Grace
For portability there are also options now that have Bluetooth probes that connect to an iPhone app to do the data storage and display. https://www.pokitinnovations.com/pokit-pro/ is one such option, but I think there are others. They might not have the sampling rate and sensitivity of professional bench equipment but the price isn’t bad and maybe it’s good enough for on-the-go usage.
 
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Likes: Leeward Rail
Feb 10, 2004
4,096
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
<snip> Could it be that the shore power charger is keeping the battery voltage high enough that the alternator regulator isn't pumping any field current and the alternator isn't 'generating,' hence no pulses to the tach? Just my current theory (no pun intended). I'll unplug and try it today.
That is exactly the case. I did the same thing today right after launch without thinking about it. In the past I have had this same issue if I run the aux and the generator with the charger energized. Today it was shore power to the charger with the aux running. Same situation, same result.

If the alternator controller (either internal or external) sees a high battery voltage, it shuts down the alternator. No field current means no output and no pulses to the tach.