Standing Rigging Extensions

[MacMikey]

I am in the process of working on a new project boat. It is a 27 Fairwinds by Luger. My problem is that the PO has raised the deck to provide standing room in the cabin and the OEM standing rigging is going to come up short in reaching the chain plates, foreplate, and backstay attachment now by maybe 1 foot (12 inches).

My question is this: Is there an excepted method of extending the rigging to reach these points short of a complete rerigging.

All the hardware is in like new condition and has only seen maybe 5 trips to sea. Got any idea's .... Let me in on your vast knowledge.

Mike

 

[Ross]

SS Chain is a good option.

 

[kendall]

I've seen chain used in that case also, and while it just plain seems 'wrong' I really can't think of a reason it wouldn't work.
Only criteria I can think of would be to make sure it's at least as strong as the rigging, and try to size the links so you still have adjustment in the turnbuckles.

Ken.

 

[Ross]

The good thing about chain is you can use as many or as few links as you need. Turnbuckles usually take-up the equivilent of 2 or 3 links. I would start with a long piece of chain and not cut until I was satisfied with the look of things.

I wonder how they got to be called ''chain plates"?

edited to remove the deity.

 

[Ross]

To answer my own question:
chain-plates, strips of iron or bronze with their lower ends bolted to the ship's side under the chain-wales (see chains (2) ) of sailing vessels. They carry the deadeyes or rigging screws to which the standing rigging is secured. In the older sailing ships these deadeyes were attached to short lengths of chain secured to the ship's side, and the name remained when chains were superseded by a plate.


chains.
1. A small platform on either side of a ship from which the leadsman took soundings to ascertain the depth of water. They were so called because originally, in the early days of sail, the leadsman cast his lead standing between the shrouds, which were attached to the chain-plates or, earlier still, to lengths of chain attached to the ship's side. The name was retained, and was still apposite while soundings were taken in this way, as a small chain was later threaded through stanchions at waist height rigged round the platform to prevent the leadsman from falling overboard as he made a cast. See also lead line.

2. The wooden projections from the sides of square-rigged ships, abreast each mast, which carry the chain-plates clear of the gunwale capping to prevent chafe, and to give the shrouds a wider base and spread from which to support the masts. They are secured to the ship's side by knees and bolts, each mast having its pair, one on each side of the ship. The name originated from the lengths of chain which preceded chain-plates as the fitting to which the deadeyes of shrouds were secured. They are also known as chain-wales (spelt and pronounced channels in the US Navy).
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[MacMikey]

I am surprised. "Chain"...sounds almost to simple but I agree that it should work just fine.

I was thinking more along the line of having the rigger make me up the needed splice out of the same size wire (1x19) with a new threaded end to go into the turnbuckle and the other end with the chain plate attachment. This would place the turnbuckle higher from the chain plate and on the backstay put in a "back stay adjuster" which the rig doesn't have at this time.

Does anyone have chain tensel strength numbers and loads required for such an applacation? I have a 28' fractional rig.

 

[sailingdog]

why jury rig something using chain??? Why not just replace the standing rigging properly??? The costs of a failure are far greater than that of all new standing rigging. Each weld in the chain becomes a possible failure point for crevice corrosion to strike at.

 

[Steve Dion]

Yes! What is your life worth? If the damn thing comes down YOU CAN DIE!

How much can this possibly cost? All of the rigging on my Hunter 31 was only $1100 for the entire boat.

Call a local rigger and ask them what it will cost. Seco South can also make it up for you.

 

[Ron20324]

My new B323 uses back-to-back turnbuckles in the rigging- should work for your application, too.

 

[SamLust]

How about rigging extension link tangs? They are pairs of matched stainless plates with holes punched in them for the pins. Search West Marine for "link tangs" for a picture. They are made by Schaefer. I think I got mine from Rigging only for a lot less than West shows. When I moved my head stay forward onto the anchor platform/bow sprit the stay was short by about 6 inches. The link plate was a simple and perfectly acceptable solution. If you come up with reasonably accurate measurements you can have Garhauer make them up custom at a reasonable price.

 

[RichH]

Why not simply get longer T-bolt rigging screws? Most rigging supply houses / sources have them in various lengths.

Chain links flex too much - bad for metal fatigue.

 

[Ross]

Why not simply get longer T-bolt rigging screws? Most rigging supply houses / sources have them in various lengths.

Chain links flex too much - bad for metal fatigue.

Isn't a chain just a multiple piece toggle?
At 20 dollars per foot there are many choices.
This product matches all of your selections.

Part Number: 33645T521-24 Ft. $20.00 per Ft.
25 or more $17.96 per Ft.
Type
Straight Link Chain
Construction
Welded Chain
Material Type
Stainless Steel
Stainless Steel Type
316L Stainless Steel
Finish
Polished
Grade
Grade 50
Application
For Lifting
Trade Size
9/32", 7 mm
Link Type
Round
Material Diameter
.28"
Inside Link Width
.38"
Inside Link Length
.83"
Work Load Limit
2,200 lbs.
Approximate Links Per Foot
14
Specifications Met
Not Rated
Weight
.74 lbs./ft.
Maximum Temperature
750° F
Available Lengths
2, 5, 10, 25, 50, and 100 feet
Note
When using fittings on the chain, be sure to match the grade and trade size.
WARNING
Never exceed work load limits.

From McMaster-Carr

 

[Timo42]

Sell the Mac rigging, it should be standard length, have new rigging made, with a bigger, heavier boat you may need to go up in diameter anyway, time to talk to a rigger imho. Tim

 

[Joe]

Regardless of Ross' stating his case for using chain, I think it would look ridiculous and you still won't be sure of its performance. This isn't an 18th century vessel, it's the age of fiberglass and stainless steel. It's just my opinion, so no amount of dictionary quoting is going to change my mind.
I agree with other posters who recommend simply replacing with properly sized rigging is the best answer in the long run. You can use the same fittings, just replace the wire and the cost will be minimal. Most of the cost of standing rigging is in the connecting hardware. The wire itself is relatively inexpensive.

 

[Ross]

I guess that I am too much concerned with Mike's question regarding rigging extensions. I agree that a dozen links of chain between the cable ends and the chain plates is rather different from the "look" we have all come to expect with modern boats. I wouldn't hesitate to use lifting grade chain as an extension for 1x19 wire rope with the same dimensions. We don't after all load the standing rigging rigging to anything approaching its safe working loads. Chain approved for lifting meets standards that are more stringent than the standards for standing rigging for boats.
Joe presents the only valid objection here and that is the aesthetics.

 

[kendall]

Agree, appearance is the only valid arguement against using chain that I've heard.
But it may just add a bit of character to the boat that makes it truly unique.

Ken.

 

[RichH]

Isn't a chain just a multiple piece toggle?

Similar but definitely not the same. When a chain link takes up stress it has a tendancy to flex - the overall individual link gets skinnier and longer, more easily than a staight pure tension member. This lowers the fatigue endurance and results in lower ultimate service life before failure.
Of course you can always 'oversize' the chain cross section, etc.

 

[Ross]

Similar but definitely not the same. When a chain link takes up stress it has a tendancy to flex - the overall individual link gets skinnier and longer, more easily than a staight pure tension member. This lowers the fatigue endurance and results in lower ultimate service life before failure.
Of course you can always 'oversize' the chain cross section, etc.

The effects you describe will never happen within the safe work load limits of the chain. The stress on the entire system is shared by all of the components. Elastic deformation is never harmful. When one considers the number and type of components in the rigging system, many points of potential failure can be found. Chain certified for lifting and made from the same dimension stock as the 1x19 rigging wire will not present the problems you discribe.

 

[RichH]

Sorry but what you state is simply wrong.
A straight (pure) tensile member is ultimately stronger versus fatigue endurance limit (~30Ksi for 300 series SS) than a complex quasi-toroidal BEAM structure such as a chain link .... all at the same cross-section.
:0)

 

[Ross]

I did some research for cable assemblies that had the same safe working load limits as the chain I proposed. A cable assembly approved for lifting 2200 pounds is constructed using 3/8 wire rope. Therefore inspite of your effort to baffle with BS, a chain of the some diameter material as the wire rope will out last the wire and fatigue will not be a factor that needs to be considered.

Edit to add: the last time I looked a half inch chain link had twice the cross sectional area of a half inch cable.