stack-pak issues

[Pat]

We are having significant issues raising our main with the Stack-pak / fully battened main. It seems to me like the battens almost always snag on the main as it is being raised....esp. when motoring into the wind, but even on nearly calm days when basically still in the water....I've considered using bungee chords to spread the sail cover so the battens are pulled apart, thereby opening up the slot...but this doesn't really work most of the time....are there any solutions or should I go back to the Neil Pryde main that came with the boat....it is in near perfect condition in my basement and I can't think of a good reason not to use it, but my wife has; i.e. thought of good reasons not to use the original mainsail.....Your thoughts and solution (s) are appreciated !
Patrick in Paradise.

 

[Parsons]

... the battens almost always snag on the main as it is being raised ...

I assume you mean that the battens snag on the lazy jacks as you raise the main. It's common that a flapping main leach will catch a lazy jack on occasion, but a little timing on when you raise the main will avoid this -- carefully watching each batten as it's going up, not just hoisting away. I've found it easier to leave the lazy jacks tight until after hoisting because if you loosen them they flog all over the place and catch the battens. I can't imaging how a design problem would create more or less snagging of the battens, so it's probably just a matter of practice.

 

[Rick D]

I was told to loosen the pack halyards about six inches before raising and leave them that way until time to zip up. Works.

 

[Bosman]

I agree with Rick D. I normally give the lazybag control line (lazy jacks) some slack when raising the main and increase tension when lowering. I looked at the photos of the Doyle stack pack....and my first thought is that why is it so big???

 

[Tally Ho]

I also ease my jacks a bit before raising the main, and generally no issues.

You could ease them all the way out and lead the jacks to the mast (at boom level) and secure them there. I tried it, but since I don’t generally have issues (I only have partial battens on my O’Day 322), wasn’t really worth the hassle of tying them up front.

Greg

 

[Pat]

How do I loosen the halyards easily...before I leave the slip to sail.?..I'm going to go to the lake in a couple hours and need to know what to look at....maybe it is obvious and I just did not think of loosening the halyards....maybe we installed it wrong at the beginning of it's life and it will be obvious.....just received a call from a friend who is head of our sailing classes and he can't see how it can work right either.....he has sewn the sail cover zipper back on the sail cover...so I'll go out there in a couple hours and see if I can see an obvious fix......because I've not noticed it to this point, and neither does our friend who fixed the zipper in the sail cover. Thanks to everyone who has tried to help me. Pat

 

[Tally Ho]

Mine has a single cleat on each side of the boom, where the halyard is tied off. If I uncleat each side, pull about 6 inches of slack in the halyard and re-cleat.

Greg

 

[Rick D]

Ditto Greg.

 

[Parsons]

How do I loosen the halyards easily...before I leave the slip to sail.?. ...he has sewn the sail cover zipper back on the sail cover...

@Pat , the lazy jack halyards that I have seen installed have some form of block or friction-less ring mounted at the mast or suspended near the top where the lazy jacks come together, and the top-most line comes down to a cleat mounted on the mast or boom, depending on where the line comes down. By loosening the line, you can loosen the lazy jacks so they do not foul the sail shape when sailing. You then need to tighten them to drop the main. Perhaps the person installing your particular lazy jacks did not rig it that way and the lines are merely attached permanently to the mast, and cannot be adjusted?

 

[Pat]

Thank you all for your suggestions...my lazy jack issue is when raising the main....the battens snag the lazy jack lines and it
makes it less than fun.....I'm going to drive to the lake in about 30 minutes and look again based on everyone's suggestions...
will report back later today if I discern something unusual as discussed above.....Patrick in Wichita

 

[Pat]

I went to the lake yesterday but was quickly forced to leave because of a severe thunderstorm with 60 - 70 mph winds...I left when they issued the warning and the storm caught up with me on the highway...I was going 60....the storm passed me
so it was honking on....I'm going back today with my camera......I did see the connection rings that control the lazy jacks...I had been putting slack in the set-up by using the topping lift but that was cumbersome. Thanks for the suggestions above..
Pat..

 

[Pat]

We were able to raise the main yesterday without an issue...but re-reading the above two replies, I cannot see how we would add slack to the lazy jacks without having a ladder on our cabin top..the lazy jack lines are connected well above the boat at the mast then the lines comedown to a connection point several / 3 to 4 feet above the boom, then they attach to the mast above that....I can raise the topping lift however and put slack in the whole system including the boom, and the lazy jacks...any thoughts are appreciated as always...by the way.. there is not a cleat on the boom..there are adjustment rings for the lazy jacks well above the boom, but that would be a bit treacherous to adjust...btw....this is the connection point I refer to abovePatrick

 

[Parsons]

Interesting problem, @Pat - you cannot slack the lazy jacks as they are not adjustable. Most lazy jacks I have seen have the top-level support run through a cheek block high on the mast to a cleat at the mast about four-feet off the deck, so you can slack off a foot or two of line. On other rigs, the top lines are fixed with blocks or rings hanging above the boom, but you can loosen the bottom lines from a cleat on the boom, usually only a single cleat which is run under the boom in various spots. This second model is not as nice as the friction of running a single line under the boom causes it to not be easy to adjust.

If you really do not have the ability to loosen the lazy jacks, they must put pressure on the lea-side of your mainsail when you are sailing. Also, quite a bit of strain on the attachment points at the boom and mast, but that's a side note.

 

[JRacer]

If you are out there this weekend, run me down and let me come look at it. I'm sure we can come up with some kind of work around. Even if it means Heather has to go up a ladder!

 

[Bosman]

The simple drawing shows how my lazy bag control line is attached. The control is led aft to cockpit for adjustment when required.

 

[Pat]

Thanks Shane.....Heather is good on ladders....ha.....actually, I'm not certain I have seen her on a ladder...I'll bring my camera......we did get the main to go up yesterday without snagging the
battens on the lazy jacks....my only mechanism for raising the boom to provide slack in the lazy jacks is the topping lift and I noticed yesterday mine is about shot....I've replaced it once but it is internal in the mast so I've got to use some electrical tape or pin of some sort, or something to attach a new line to the end of the current one and send it up, then down and out on the starboard side of the boom...might be easier to sell the boat....or shall I say more prudent...
Patrick

 

[Justin_NSA]

Thanks Shane.....Heather is good on ladders....ha.....actually, I'm not certain I have seen her on a ladder...I'll bring my camera......we did get the main to go up yesterday without snagging the
battens on the lazy jacks....my only mechanism for raising the boom to provide slack in the lazy jacks is the topping lift and I noticed yesterday mine is about shot....I've replaced it once but it is internal in the mast so I've got to use some electrical tape or pin of some sort, or something to attach a new line to the end of the current one and send it up, then down and out on the starboard side of the boom...might be easier to sell the boat....or shall I say more prudent...
Patrick

Are you still thinking of taking up croquet Patrick?
My somewhat brief experience with lazy jacks is if you can't ease them so they open up, you have to be dead into the wind with enough blow to keep the main straight back.
Both sides of your 'jacks are attached at the mast. You may be able to do what I did: attach blocks on the mast for them to pass thru, join the two lines and run a single line back to the cockpit or cleated on the mast.

 

[Bosman]

Pat,
We do have a member at the marina with 272LE and lazybag - he is out on the water all the time and to the best of my knowledge has no issues with his lazybag system. I'd say your setup needs some 'tweaking'... please note how the lazyjack lines are run on this boat.

 

[Rick D]

That control lineslneed to be re run so that you can easily adjust them from the deck.

 

[Pat]

It's interesting looking at the photo above...the 272 was always equipped with a single-line reefing system that worked very well as well as being easy to reef...when I ordered the Doyle Stack Pak, I was not so much purchasing it to be easy to reef because the boat was already easy to reef....I was more interested in the fully battened main...I'm going out again this afternoon and I'm going to take photos of both port and starboard sides of the main because to me, the photo above is set up exactly like our is currently.....more later, Pat