Seadance...
- Thread starter Brian D
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re: Seadance
Well boys, here's the scoop. The boat had lots of new goodies but it needed work. Lots of it and for the price they were asking for it they were out of their !@#$%^&* minds. Can I say that? I've learned a very valuable lesson....pictures can be very decieving. After that almost another whoops...I did try to play it smart and brought all of the other boat listings in that area and because hubby was disappointed (not to mention it was his Birthday!!)I believe that they saw and knew how long we drove and would not dream of us walking away. I also overheard the dealer say that if the sale would not go thru it would not be because of my husband but because of "that one"...me. We looked at 7 more from Tampa to Clearwater to Tarpon Springs to Madeira Beach. We were scammed with everyonne single one of them. We were told oh yes this ones ready to sail, ready to go. Engines cut off several times during sea trial on one of them, bilge pumps were a mess, electrical wiring needed replacing, hatches broken..sails not matching to the boat and lied to our faces that they were just made for the boat when it said J29 on it for a 30' Hunter. I kept hearing "project boat" once we got there, not before when we called about it and did I meet some slimy boat dealers. Some of them could not even answer a simple question off of my list and some of them raised an eyebrow at me. I'm thinking your a boat sales men and you can't even locate items? The only positive thing I can say was at least we got to sea trial them. I am still rocking and I miss the water, terribly.I talked hubby into going back to our original offer on a boat in Pensacola that the owner refused to budge on and I am not giving that one away because I don't want it snagged
So we are countering once again. I am Very disappointed. Hubby asked me if I am ever going to agree to a boat or am I going to keep finding stuff wrong with them I don't know if I am being too careful..just trying to get our monies worth and a solid boat,one that he can get on and sail and not sink. I keep telling him your boat is out there you just have to be patient and keep looking and most of all not get discouraged.
Well boys, here's the scoop. The boat had lots of new goodies but it needed work. Lots of it and for the price they were asking for it they were out of their !@#$%^&* minds. Can I say that? I've learned a very valuable lesson....pictures can be very decieving. After that almost another whoops...I did try to play it smart and brought all of the other boat listings in that area and because hubby was disappointed (not to mention it was his Birthday!!)I believe that they saw and knew how long we drove and would not dream of us walking away. I also overheard the dealer say that if the sale would not go thru it would not be because of my husband but because of "that one"...me. We looked at 7 more from Tampa to Clearwater to Tarpon Springs to Madeira Beach. We were scammed with everyonne single one of them. We were told oh yes this ones ready to sail, ready to go. Engines cut off several times during sea trial on one of them, bilge pumps were a mess, electrical wiring needed replacing, hatches broken..sails not matching to the boat and lied to our faces that they were just made for the boat when it said J29 on it for a 30' Hunter. I kept hearing "project boat" once we got there, not before when we called about it and did I meet some slimy boat dealers. Some of them could not even answer a simple question off of my list and some of them raised an eyebrow at me. I'm thinking your a boat sales men and you can't even locate items? The only positive thing I can say was at least we got to sea trial them. I am still rocking and I miss the water, terribly.I talked hubby into going back to our original offer on a boat in Pensacola that the owner refused to budge on and I am not giving that one away because I don't want it snagged
So we are countering once again. I am Very disappointed. Hubby asked me if I am ever going to agree to a boat or am I going to keep finding stuff wrong with them I don't know if I am being too careful..just trying to get our monies worth and a solid boat,one that he can get on and sail and not sink. I keep telling him your boat is out there you just have to be patient and keep looking and most of all not get discouraged.
Ever so true...
Seadance speaks... "I keep telling him your boat is out there you just have to be patient and keep looking and most of all not get discouraged." Sheer profundity! Well done. These vultures will try and milk you for what they can. Interesting when you walk in prepared to conduct business. The looks on their collective faces when you know more about the boat than they do. Priceless. Thanks for the update.
Seadance speaks... "I keep telling him your boat is out there you just have to be patient and keep looking and most of all not get discouraged." Sheer profundity! Well done. These vultures will try and milk you for what they can. Interesting when you walk in prepared to conduct business. The looks on their collective faces when you know more about the boat than they do. Priceless. Thanks for the update.
You go girl!
I for one am impressed that you held your ground and stood up to the snake oil salesmen. That you knew enough of the right questions is also an indication that you have done your homework. You are talking about making a significant investment and should make sure that everything works to your satisfaction before shelling out your hard earned money. These 'salesmen' can sense the enthusiasm you both have and are probably hoping for a quick commission - do not be rushed. While you were gone there was a discussion about the way some owners maintain their boats with sloppy wiring, dirty bilges, and sloppy work in general being the pet peeves. Good for you for noticing the sails for a different model boat being passed off on you. Now if you could just find one of MainSail's old boats ... Do not give up and definitely do not settle for less than you want. It is a buyers market after all.
I for one am impressed that you held your ground and stood up to the snake oil salesmen. That you knew enough of the right questions is also an indication that you have done your homework. You are talking about making a significant investment and should make sure that everything works to your satisfaction before shelling out your hard earned money. These 'salesmen' can sense the enthusiasm you both have and are probably hoping for a quick commission - do not be rushed. While you were gone there was a discussion about the way some owners maintain their boats with sloppy wiring, dirty bilges, and sloppy work in general being the pet peeves. Good for you for noticing the sails for a different model boat being passed off on you. Now if you could just find one of MainSail's old boats ... Do not give up and definitely do not settle for less than you want. It is a buyers market after all.
What Are You Looking For?
I will keep my eye and ears open out here. I mentioned Govert with MidSouth Sailing once before. You probably will not be able to dicker much with him but he is no slippery used car salesman in boat shoes. If I remember right his number is 863-6969 give him a call and tell him what you are looking for he'll do you right.
I will keep my eye and ears open out here. I mentioned Govert with MidSouth Sailing once before. You probably will not be able to dicker much with him but he is no slippery used car salesman in boat shoes. If I remember right his number is 863-6969 give him a call and tell him what you are looking for he'll do you right.
Consider a road trip?
I am not sure what your expectations are, but could they be too high? From your examples it does not sound like you are expecting too much and it certainly sounds like you are running into some less that reputable brokers. This is not like buying a used car where the dealer will have it looking and running perfect. When a boat sits for a year or so, even a well cared for vessel starts looking pretty rough and will get a musty smell inside. Outside teak usually goes grey or peels varnish, the hull and deck become dull with dirt. Usually the interior of a stored boat is a mess with crap everywhere. One thing you can count on is having to do work and put money into most any used boat. I spent quite a few years poking around boat yards around Lake Michigan and maybe a trip up there might be worth your while. While that area has its share of junkers, it also seemed to have plenty of good used boats and brokers with decent reputations. I can recommend several that seem to have good reputations. Fresh water boats are considered to be more desirable than salt water boats. If I may ask, what is your price range?
I am not sure what your expectations are, but could they be too high? From your examples it does not sound like you are expecting too much and it certainly sounds like you are running into some less that reputable brokers. This is not like buying a used car where the dealer will have it looking and running perfect. When a boat sits for a year or so, even a well cared for vessel starts looking pretty rough and will get a musty smell inside. Outside teak usually goes grey or peels varnish, the hull and deck become dull with dirt. Usually the interior of a stored boat is a mess with crap everywhere. One thing you can count on is having to do work and put money into most any used boat. I spent quite a few years poking around boat yards around Lake Michigan and maybe a trip up there might be worth your while. While that area has its share of junkers, it also seemed to have plenty of good used boats and brokers with decent reputations. I can recommend several that seem to have good reputations. Fresh water boats are considered to be more desirable than salt water boats. If I may ask, what is your price range?
Good for you Seadance
Boat buying can be described as either an experience or an adventure, but more than likely never be called easy. I spent right at six months looking before I pulled the trigger on the 37, and even longer than that several years ago when I bought the 28. Every boat you look at will give you a little more insight into what you want, and what you can get for X number of dollars. Your right about the sleeze bags, and they seem to be a little more prevelant in our area. Of the people I know who bought boats after Katrina, only one bought a boat in New Orleans, and he bought a new one. And still had a rough time getting the dealer to do what he was suppose to do. So keep looking and stick by your guns, your boat is out there.
Boat buying can be described as either an experience or an adventure, but more than likely never be called easy. I spent right at six months looking before I pulled the trigger on the 37, and even longer than that several years ago when I bought the 28. Every boat you look at will give you a little more insight into what you want, and what you can get for X number of dollars. Your right about the sleeze bags, and they seem to be a little more prevelant in our area. Of the people I know who bought boats after Katrina, only one bought a boat in New Orleans, and he bought a new one. And still had a rough time getting the dealer to do what he was suppose to do. So keep looking and stick by your guns, your boat is out there.
Well used better than never used
I subscribe to the theory that a well used boat is better than a never used boat. Used boats seem to fall into three categories. 1. Extra clean hardly used, never abused but never "tested". You never know if these have hidden faults. The sparkle like new but are priced that way too. 2. Rode hard put up wet. Someone used all the "good" out of this boat and never fixed anything-just patche and put up. aka Project boats. 3. Sweet-thang. Boat that someone loved and used a lot. They rode it hard but gave her good feed and care. They are being sold due to a life change event (kids, divorce, loss of spouse, big job change) or the owner is moving up. I think #3s are the best to buy IMHO.
I subscribe to the theory that a well used boat is better than a never used boat. Used boats seem to fall into three categories. 1. Extra clean hardly used, never abused but never "tested". You never know if these have hidden faults. The sparkle like new but are priced that way too. 2. Rode hard put up wet. Someone used all the "good" out of this boat and never fixed anything-just patche and put up. aka Project boats. 3. Sweet-thang. Boat that someone loved and used a lot. They rode it hard but gave her good feed and care. They are being sold due to a life change event (kids, divorce, loss of spouse, big job change) or the owner is moving up. I think #3s are the best to buy IMHO.
Kudos to Seadance
It sounds like you did the right thing in holding your ground and asking questions. Boat brokers are a lot more like real estate brokers than car salesmen, because every boat is individual, and in many cases -- especially the boats that are at the more moderate end of the price range -- they are really quite unfamiliar with the boat. I once looked at a house and the broker did not know it had a third floor! Keep looking and you will find what you want for the right price -- there are always lots of boats for sale out there. Your experience does highlight one ting, though. Aren't you glad you did not lock yourself too heavily around the idea of sailing the boat back? I think you always want to do some considerable shakedown on a new boat before you take a long trip, if for no other reason than getting to know the ropes and idiosyncrasies of the particular boat, but also so you are not surprised by something breaking badly.
It sounds like you did the right thing in holding your ground and asking questions. Boat brokers are a lot more like real estate brokers than car salesmen, because every boat is individual, and in many cases -- especially the boats that are at the more moderate end of the price range -- they are really quite unfamiliar with the boat. I once looked at a house and the broker did not know it had a third floor! Keep looking and you will find what you want for the right price -- there are always lots of boats for sale out there. Your experience does highlight one ting, though. Aren't you glad you did not lock yourself too heavily around the idea of sailing the boat back? I think you always want to do some considerable shakedown on a new boat before you take a long trip, if for no other reason than getting to know the ropes and idiosyncrasies of the particular boat, but also so you are not surprised by something breaking badly.
Doing The Wright Thing
We all know it is not easy buying a used boat,it's hard making the right choice of which one is the one. Don't fall in love with the boat and rush into buying and than find out it's going to cost double to fix. I have been there and it's easy to jump in say OK this the one. My first time of looking to buy was like that we kept looking at different boats and falling in love,I would say yes that's the one for me but wife would say I think you should look at more boats before we decide. It was easier for us we were looking newer but there was so many and what make and what size. So good luck with your search and you will find the one for you just don't rush in too fast. Nick
We all know it is not easy buying a used boat,it's hard making the right choice of which one is the one. Don't fall in love with the boat and rush into buying and than find out it's going to cost double to fix. I have been there and it's easy to jump in say OK this the one. My first time of looking to buy was like that we kept looking at different boats and falling in love,I would say yes that's the one for me but wife would say I think you should look at more boats before we decide. It was easier for us we were looking newer but there was so many and what make and what size. So good luck with your search and you will find the one for you just don't rush in too fast. Nick
re: what are you looking for?
Hi Guys! and thank you... I did talk to Govert several times and he has even called to check up on us He is such a nice guy, very helpful. His boats are out of our price range(for now). He did give me a 101 on diesel engines on Hunters. Our price range right now is $16,000 max. Some of the things we are looking for are: I would love number 3 that Andy listed!! it has to have a shower, marine plumbing, bimini cover would be nice, sails that go with the boat , its draft has got to be no more than 5 because the waters around our slip are shallow waters. Yes we are paying for a slip just now($80 with all hookups). We have been on a waiting list for over a year. After Katrina there are still no slips available anywhere and if they are, they are outrageously priced. Auto pilot would be nice tho I know we would end purchasing one right away and I would like ac because it gets so hot down here but thats purchasable too. Cushion conditions are not a biggy to me because I can sew them, patch them up or if I end up throwing may hands in the air after trying, we will have them made. The kids are small so sleeping space.. I know they would all end up in the vberth. We would like to do a couple over nighters by the islands here and overall the boat to be in good condition. The engine has to be in good shape or at least reliable. No major projects. I don't mind a little bit of elbow grease and hard work to clean it up. Painting it is not a concern right now because we want to sail this summer and we'll do the other in the Fall/Winter since we have no winters here. I know now things like bilge pumps are replacable, batteries. We have a dinghy. I would love for the hatches and ports to be in good condition. I saw gaps everywhere and they tried to tell me the dry rot on the floor was from rain coming from the windows. I begged to differ I told him I believed it was from the bilge pump overflowing. You guys would have died at the one bilge pump I saw. The latch on it was busted. The boat dealer told me it was just an extra "storage area". I was tickled pink by that comment. I asked him for his keys and lifted it open. Rusty Water and when I asked him to run the pump, he didn't know where it was located,so I did it. It barely drained but the bolts were all rusted and when I laced my finger around them one of them were pretty loose.When hubby came down after settling the kids in their vests in the cockpit he saw the floorboard and asked who opened it and the dealer said that I did as if I was in trouble or something. I got a wink. So many other stories. We have looked at all of the layouts on several different 30' boats and we keep coming back to the Hunter. I love the Catalina's but the one boat I do not like and for only one reason and its the Pearson (sorry!). I don't like where its head is located right next to the vberth. My husband thinks this is funny. I am so glad I came to this site. I found a library in Newport Richey on Saturday afternoon with the intention of asking you guys some questions but Internet was down and our relatives had a dinosour of a computer. So I roughed it. But kept thinking I wish I could log on and ask you guys for some advice because I knew it to be good and sound!
Hi Guys! and thank you... I did talk to Govert several times and he has even called to check up on us
He is such a nice guy, very helpful. His boats are out of our price range(for now). He did give me a 101 on diesel engines on Hunters. Our price range right now is $16,000 max. Some of the things we are looking for are: I would love number 3 that Andy listed!! it has to have a shower, marine plumbing, bimini cover would be nice, sails that go with the boat , its draft has got to be no more than 5 because the waters around our slip are shallow waters. Yes we are paying for a slip just now($80 with all hookups). We have been on a waiting list for over a year. After Katrina there are still no slips available anywhere and if they are, they are outrageously priced. Auto pilot would be nice tho I know we would end purchasing one right away and I would like ac because it gets so hot down here but thats purchasable too. Cushion conditions are not a biggy to me because I can sew them, patch them up or if I end up throwing may hands in the air after trying, we will have them made. The kids are small so sleeping space.. I know they would all end up in the vberth. We would like to do a couple over nighters by the islands here and overall the boat to be in good condition. The engine has to be in good shape or at least reliable. No major projects. I don't mind a little bit of elbow grease and hard work to clean it up. Painting it is not a concern right now because we want to sail this summer and we'll do the other in the Fall/Winter since we have no winters here. I know now things like bilge pumps are replacable, batteries. We have a dinghy. I would love for the hatches and ports to be in good condition. I saw gaps everywhere and they tried to tell me the dry rot on the floor was from rain coming from the windows. I begged to differ I told him I believed it was from the bilge pump overflowing. You guys would have died at the one bilge pump I saw. The latch on it was busted. The boat dealer told me it was just an extra "storage area". I was tickled pink by that comment. I asked him for his keys and lifted it open. Rusty Water and when I asked him to run the pump, he didn't know where it was located,so I did it. It barely drained but the bolts were all rusted and when I laced my finger around them one of them were pretty loose.When hubby came down after settling the kids in their vests in the cockpit he saw the floorboard and asked who opened it and the dealer said that I did as if I was in trouble or something. I got a wink. So many other stories. We have looked at all of the layouts on several different 30' boats and we keep coming back to the Hunter. I love the Catalina's but the one boat I do not like and for only one reason and its the Pearson (sorry!). I don't like where its head is located right next to the vberth. My husband thinks this is funny. I am so glad I came to this site. I found a library in Newport Richey on Saturday afternoon with the intention of asking you guys some questions but Internet was down and our relatives had a dinosour of a computer. So I roughed it. But kept thinking I wish I could log on and ask you guys for some advice because I knew it to be good and sound!
Considering budget and needs expressed
you may want to look at Capri 26's & 30's. I've included a link here to one I just found on YW in Florida. Heads are generously sized, interior of cabin is basically wide open.
you may want to look at Capri 26's & 30's. I've included a link here to one I just found on YW in Florida. Heads are generously sized, interior of cabin is basically wide open.
Nice N Easy
Still looking for back up boats Nice N Easy this is in your neck of the sea. Do you know her? I still have the main worry about katrina boats in our area Don't know if it would be a waste to even consider it? http://www.sailingtexas.com/scal31b.html my thanks, B/Seadance
Still looking for back up boats Nice N Easy this is in your neck of the sea. Do you know her? I still have the main worry about katrina boats in our area Don't know if it would be a waste to even consider it? http://www.sailingtexas.com/scal31b.html my thanks, B/Seadance
Seadance
I do not know that boat, but I did call the numbers listed. Left a message and if he returns my csll, I will drop by and take a look at it. Pics look pretty good but the rub rail damage isn't shown and that could be a concern. If it's just the rub rail it's no real big deal, but the rub rail covers the hull to deck joint and that could be a big deal. But I will give it a look if he calls me back.
I do not know that boat, but I did call the numbers listed. Left a message and if he returns my csll, I will drop by and take a look at it. Pics look pretty good but the rub rail damage isn't shown and that could be a concern. If it's just the rub rail it's no real big deal, but the rub rail covers the hull to deck joint and that could be a big deal. But I will give it a look if he calls me back.
Nice N Easy(love this name by the way too)
Hi Nice and Easy and thank you. Hold off on looking at her just yet, I just countered on that other boat and am waiting for a call back tonight or tomorrow morning. Cross your fingers. Looks like this fish might bite. If he doesn't I'll pass your info back to hubby. Thank you again. your great! B/Seadance
Hi Nice and Easy and thank you. Hold off on looking at her just yet, I just countered on that other boat and am waiting for a call back tonight or tomorrow morning. Cross your fingers. Looks like this fish might bite. If he doesn't I'll pass your info back to hubby. Thank you again. your great! B/Seadance
Have You Looked at the Hunter 26 or 260
It is a lot more boat than it seems and it is real nice to be able to pull it out of the water when a storm is on the way. It would be fun to hook it up and drag it down to Florida to visit as well. Just a thought.
It is a lot more boat than it seems and it is real nice to be able to pull it out of the water when a storm is on the way. It would be fun to hook it up and drag it down to Florida to visit as well. Just a thought.
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