recommended temperatures for fridge/freezer

Status
Not open for further replies.
May 16, 2007
1,509
Boatless ! 26 Ottawa, Ontario
we have a fridge and freezer with separate temperature controls. I am wondering what others are using for the temperature settings to balance electrical use and how long food will last ? We have two remote readout thermometers to keep an eye on what we are doing as we play with the knobs. We are in a slip now so have them turned right down as battery life is not an issue.
Bob
 
Feb 10, 2004
4,096
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
We have separate Adler-Barbour refrigeration units and run the refrigerator at about 37 F. It regulates from 33-40 at that setting. Food keeps about the same length of time as at home. I have a circulation fan that runs 100% to keep the cold air even in the box. The unit uses about 60Ah/day.

We rarely run the freezer because the total power draw in addition to the refrigerator is about 120AH/day. So we only run the freezer on extended cruises. We have it set to about 15F and it regulates to 11-20. I would like it colder but the power draw goes up even more. We also have a circulating fan in the freezer and we put an insulating blanket on top of the food.
 
Feb 26, 2009
716
Oday 30 Anchor Yacht Club, Bristol PA
typically, fridge side should be around 38-42 and the freezer around -15
 
Feb 10, 2004
4,096
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
typically, fridge side should be around 38-42 and the freezer around -15
You are correct, Denise. But if I increase my refrigerator temp setting then the highest temp excursion in the fridge goes too high for my liking and as for the freezer, I don't really know if I can pull it down to -15F but if I could the power draw would be huge.

At 15F in my freezer, I can keep meat for longer than a month and that meets my cruise requirements.

I can't keep ice cream at 15F so we have to eat that immediately! :D
 
Sep 25, 2008
7,340
Alden 50 Sarasota, Florida
For what it's worth, most refrigerator mfgs recommend the refrigerator temp be set at 38-40 deg F and the freezer at -2deg F.

Rich - in our 40.5 the freezer cold plate is twice the size of the one in the refrigerator which makes it somewhat easier and less energy demanding to run it at cold temperature. I'm surprised all 40.5s were not designed similarly.
 
Dec 2, 1997
8,915
- - LIttle Rock
Refrigerator mfrs recommend 38F for the fridge because bacteria becomes dormant at 40, so fresh foods keep much longer... and -2 F for the freezer. Keeping the freezer lower than that only increases your electric bill.

Full freezers and fridges are MUCH more efficient than empty....less "empty" air to keep cold, and also because the frozen foods chill each other and newly added food.

I found that the fridge on my boat consumed far less power if I kept drinks in a cooler and reserved the fridge for food, 'cuz the less often the fridge is opened, the less the compressor has to run to bring the temp back down. When away from the dock I also turned it off at the breaker last thing before turning in for the night, 'cuz nothing thaws overnight if the door isn't opened, not even ice or ice cream.
 
Apr 8, 2010
2,090
Ericson Yachts Olson 34 28400 Portland OR
Let me add another vote for "40 or less". A friend who ran a successful restaurant for many decades told me that 40 deg. F was as warm as the food should get in the fridge - a practical and a legal requirement.

We have a little cheapie digital readout for our boat fridge and keep it at about 37 to 39.
I used to try to fine-tune the little dial to about 33.... and then one summer on a cruise all the food and pop froze. We had wads of frozen pop stuck to the sides like some sort of alien lava!
I replaced that thermostat and decided to be a bit less picky about getting down to the last few degrees of cold!
:)
 
Feb 10, 2004
4,096
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
Rich - in our 40.5 the freezer cold plate is twice the size of the one in the refrigerator which makes it somewhat easier and less energy demanding to run it at cold temperature. I'm surprised all 40.5s were not designed similarly.
Our cold plate in the freezer is a bit smaller than the one in the fridge. However, the volume of the freezer is about 1/3 of the fridge. Both are "Powerplates"- 3/4" thick. They are not the thin metal with the tubes visible in them- I don't know if that makes a difference.
 

Ross

.
Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
At home I have three refrigerators. The newest one is dual compressor and I keep the fridge at 34 and the freezer at -6. Another I keep the fridge at 32 and milk will keep for a month past the sell by date but fresh fruit will freeze. At minus 10 my freezer will keep meat for two years without loss of quality. I have an Ice box on my boat.
 

Tim R.

.
May 27, 2004
3,626
Caliber 40 Long Range Cruiser Portland, Maine
Freezer at 10°F and spillover circulation fan into Fridge at 34°F. Ice cream stays solid, meats last for months and milk is ice cold. All thanks to the sun(during the summer)
 
Feb 26, 2009
716
Oday 30 Anchor Yacht Club, Bristol PA
So many varied answers.. almost as many answers as there are variations in temps! :D
Ice cream is best kept VERY COLD for storage. For dipping, it should be around 5 degrees, (just leave it out a few minutes)
Fridges need to be under 40 to keep mold from growing. (not likely in a boat unit unless your using it 365 24/7)

More "stuff" in the freezer and fridge will help keep the temps stable once reached; the down side is if it breaks down...:eek: A unit designed to freeze will do -15 as easily as -5 if not, something's wrong. The hard "work" a compressor does is related to heat infiltration way more then mechanics of the R134 or R12

I set boxes at 35 to 38 domestic side by side 38 and -5 to -15 very few call backs except "the ice cream is too hard" Lid type boxes, like on boats can get and stay much colder since the cold stays in the box when opened.

Systems on boats are incredibly efficient and if they are pulling too many amp hours Insulation is the most likely cause. Also, the lid is often neglected and leaks air into the box almost as if it were left off!
 
Feb 26, 2009
716
Oday 30 Anchor Yacht Club, Bristol PA
One more thing I'd like to add, Thermostats like used on boat systems are terrible at maintaining temps they can "swing" 3-6 degrees from above and below the settings. Frost build up is an energy waster also; but don't use an ice pick to clean it off the evaporator!
 
Jan 2, 2007
131
Morgan 461 St. Thomas
Late to this party, I can't imagine keeping our freezer at anything under zero. The energy costs (look up BTU losses; it's NOT true that lower temps aren't more expensive; freezer vs reefer insulation calculations show that very dramatically) to do so would be more than I care to use.

We have two Carel digital thermostats in our keel-cooled Frigoboat evaporative system. Hysteresis is 2° which means that our 8 and 32 targets usually float within a couple of degrees of that. Our 32 in the reefer has never frozen stuff we don't want frozen, but the drinks are always very refreshingly cold. If I put my water gallon in front of the spillover fan, I can start with 1/2 ice (put the jug nearly on its side in the freezer to start), and refresh water that I use with room temp, shake it well before putting it back in (so the warmer water is now cold from all the ice), and have that remain mostly ice for a month or so, with daily water use of a gallon.

We have movement fans in both boxes, which helps, and we put the more sensitive stuff the furthest away from the freezer. In our 8° freezer, ice cream would be a bit soft, but we don't do that aboard. OTOH, in the times we have done so, 6° keeps it at ideal dipping temps. From when I had a home freezer, I can tell you that zero is VERY hard ice cream. I routinely accidentally break bolts, and occasionally tools, as I'm stronger than the typical cruiser, but I can tell you that even with a liquid-center-handled scoop, getting zero degree ice cream out of the box is no fun, and if you're not in the tropics, it won't be edible (other than by crunching!) for a long time once it's in the bowl.

Of course, everyone's got their own preferences. I built our box out of 6" of extruded polystyrene (layers of 2" board, with staircased joints to further stymie air or heat intrusion), encased in epoxy, with reflective and air gaps as well for rejection, and double (inner and outer) door seals, so perhaps ours is better performing than most. Certainly nearly any production boat won't have that level of heat rejection - and it's heat removal which makes for a cold box. An evaporative (vs holdover plates) system will give you much better "fine" control over your temps, of course, and, as noted elsewhere, full boxes are much more efficient, once you get the temps pulled down...

My 2 cents, and YMMV :{))

L8R

Skip


Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog
and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog



When a man comes to like a sea life, he is not fit to live on land.
- Dr. Samuel Johnson
 

Ross

.
Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
Simply maintaining considerable thermal mass in the boxes will stabilize the temperature. Air weighs only .076 pounds per cubic foot where as water comes in at about 63 pounds per cu.ft.. Ice has a latent heat of 145 btu's per pound and every little bit helps.
 

Sumner

.
Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
....We have movement fans in both boxes, which helps...
Whose or what fans do you use? I've seen some that say they will run up to a month on a C or D battery I believe and I've considered some computer fans on 12 volts, but don't know if they would like that enviornment.

I'm just starting work on a new frig/freeze in a day or so and regarding insulation it will have 4 inches on the side walls and 6 on the end walls and bottom with 3 inches for the top. Do you have 6 on all sides? Also I found one picture on your site, do you have more there?

We also have the oval evaporator (about 1/2 cu. ft.) that is a freezer and also cools the box. Anyone know what temps they have in the freezer section of one of these while keeping the box about 38?

Bob, congrats on getting on the new boat and getting on it :). We keep our frig on the Mac at 37-38, but if the batteries are in good shape (good solar day on the panels) we will run it down to 33-35 before night fall and we turn it off over night and it is usually 42-44 in the morning. We never had any food go bad on the 7 week trip doing this. I'll try and PM you about Ruth and when we will be down there and the other questions you asked,

Sum

Thanks,

Sum

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Our Endeavour 37 [/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Our MacGregor S Pages[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Mac-Venture Links
[/FONT]
 
Feb 10, 2004
4,096
Hunter 40.5 Warwick, RI
Whose or what fans do you use? I've seen some that say they will run up to a month on a C or D battery I believe and I've considered some computer fans on 12 volts, but don't know if they would like that enviornment.[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor/macgregor-links-1.html[/FONT]
I once borrowed one of the small square fans that run on 2 D-cells from a RVer friend. I was encouraged by the result of helping to keep the temperature even across the box. But the box fan has the disadvantage of getting buried in the box and the air doesn't circulate. This doesn't happen in a conventional refrigerator with shelves like in a RV. You also need to turn off and on when you leave and return for battery life.

So I designed, built, and installed a fan system that runs from the ship's 12 power and will pick up cold air from the bottom of the box and blow it across the top of the food to the opposite corner. This design always works and requires no action when arriving or leaving. The fan is a small 12V computer fan that I selected to fit into the end of a 1.5" PVC elbow. The power wires were routed along the refrigeration lines back to the compressor and then connected at the compressor. The fan runs continuously.

I have a second fan in my freezer compartment and that is wired to the fan in the refrigerator. Both fans can run when the refrigerator has power so I put a small toggle switch on the freezer fan so I can turn it on only when we actually run the freezer. These connections eliminated the need to run the freezer fan wires to the freezer compressor.

I have had this fan system installed for 10 years with no problems or maintenance issues.

Bottom line- go ahead and install a computer fan solution. I think you will be happy with it.
 

Attachments

Sumner

.
Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
....So I designed, built, and.....



... installed a fan system that runs from the ship's 12 power and will pick up cold air from the bottom of the box and blow it across the top of the food to the opposite corner..
Thanks, that is exactly what I needed to know and I like that installation. I'll copy that for sure :),

Sum

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Our Endeavour 37 [/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida
[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Our MacGregor S Pages
[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Mac-Venture Links
[/FONT]
 
Jan 2, 2007
131
Morgan 461 St. Thomas
Whose or what fans do you use? I've seen some that say they will run up to a month on a C or D battery I believe and I've considered some computer fans on 12 volts, but don't know if they would like that enviornment.

I'm just starting work on a new frig/freeze in a day or so and regarding insulation it will have 4 inches on the side walls and 6 on the end walls and bottom with 3 inches for the top. Do you have 6 on all sides? Also I found one picture on your site, do you have more there?

We also have the oval evaporator (about 1/2 cu. ft.) that is a freezer and also cools the box. Anyone know what temps they have in the freezer section of one of these while keeping the box about 38?

Bob, congrats on getting on the new boat and getting on it :). We keep our frig on the Mac at 37-38, but if the batteries are in good shape (good solar day on the panels) we will run it down to 33-35 before night fall and we turn it off over night and it is usually 42-44 in the morning. We never had any food go bad on the 7 week trip doing this. I'll try and PM you about Ruth and when we will be down there and the other questions you asked,

Sum

Thanks,

Sum

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Our Endeavour 37 [/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Our MacGregor S Pages[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
Mac-Venture Links
[/FONT]
I used lifetime warranty computer box fans - the spillover is a 6", and the others are 1.5" - next to no draw. These should like this environment considerably, as heat is the enemy of computer parts. There should be less humidity in the boxes than outside, unless you're in Arizona or the like, too, typically no dust (look inside a computer, even at sea!). Very cheap on the internet. Because I'm a geek, I had some leftovers, so when one of the buck-fifty fans wasn't running (got submerged in the reefer during a leak in the gas at a connection - since rectified!), I just swapped it out for one of my spares. There are self-contained fans which run on 2 C or D cells, and they run for many months. They have the advantage of your moving them wherever you want. Mine are wired in; my doors have single-pole double-throw reed magnetic switches which turn off the fans, and turn on the lights, when a door is opened. So, when I open a door (or, as I see from what you've said, you would have just the single door), the cold air I'm trying to keep in the box isn't circulating.

I used 6" insulation everywhere, except at the hull. There, since it was an odd shaped space and I didn't want to have to build the box that way, I filled that with commercial 2-part foam, put in a bit at a time with a gun. The top level is 13" of expanded polystyrene. If there had been a notable return on investment, BTU transfer wise, I'd have made it even thicker than the 6" I stopped at in the rest of the box. Look up tables put out on the internet by Richard Kollmann to get the impact of having more R value. The only way to do better, and because of ingassining with a finite life (if you'll have the boat less than 10 years, it will be someone else' problem), you'd do well for making it somehow replaceable, are vacuum panel$$. They WILL get you a larger R value, and if combined with (encased in, with proper guards against possible puncture during manufacture of your box) your foam, you could do well above 30. Unfortunately, 30 is about the effective end of just foam. You have to get WAAY more space loss (by virtue of how much space the foam takes) to gain any significant R value.

Make sure there are no paths for air or moisture or heat to enter the box when it's closed, and do your very best to make sure as much possible heat is rejected. You can go to my gallery, and click on the very earliest refit pictures http://justpickone.org/skip/gallery...r_Alterations_Work/00-2004-TheBeginning/12-04 - clicking any picture will either open a new gallery or enlarge a picture - to see what all I dealt with in my case. I was taking pictures of literally everything which was happening, but in the December 2004 pictures, while you'll have to wade through a lot of other stuff which was happening at the same time, you'll be able to see literally everything I did in the construction of our box, beginning with the removal of the old, and starting from the outside, building it in.

If this is a project in which you want to get long term value, I can't stress enough how important it is that you have 6" in all directions - INCLUDING the doors (which as you'll see in my pix if you go there, I had to engineer to make allowance for the swing) - and the doors should be double gasketed. Keeping heat out is the deal, and without as much help as you can give it, a lot will make it in. Every BTU you don't have to remove is amps in your batteries.

Good luck on your project, and keep us posted...

L8R

Skip
 

Ross

.
Jun 15, 2004
14,693
Islander/Wayfairer 30 sail number 25 Perryville,Md.
I have been running salvaged computer fans from a solar panel for twelve years summer and winter to ventilate my boat. I had to clean the spider eggs out of one today. That is the first instance of trouble I have had with them.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.