She runs like a scalded dog with the wind up! ;-)
That looks like the Deep Keel version. Is there one for the Short Keel?
Racing a Beneteau 311 w/Fin Keel and Centerboard
- Thread starter Dennis Thomas
- Start date
That looks like the Deep Keel version. Is there one for the Short Keel?
I was kinda surprised that no shoal boats were in the database. But you're right, if they are being seriously raced, the deep keel is the only way to go. Points better, and is lighter.
CapitalistSailor, have you ever used your asymmetrical spinnaker as a gennaker? If so, how tight to the wind have you been comfortable with?
I have considered doing this several times although as yet I haven't done it. I want to believe that it can be done and done effectively.
I have considered doing this several times although as yet I haven't done it. I want to believe that it can be done and done effectively.
Dennis, my asymmetrical is sort of a custom design, an A1.5, between an A1 and an A2. I wanted it for cruising around on lighter wind days without resorting to motorsailing so often. The sailmaker advises me that going downwind, anything more than 140 deg apparent is too low (110 deg in light air), and I’ll lose all power from the sail. But in heavy air, I can go as high as 60-70 deg apparent, and as high as 35 deg apparent in light air, almost like a code zero, but with less area. So it’s a reaching sail. This advice has proven to be about right. I also tighten the tackline going upwind and loosen it going downwind.
As I don’t have another downwind sail, I find that going wing and wing with the spinnaker in light winds gives a dramatically faster VMG than doing gybing angles. Keeping it filled however is challenging, and I have to sail a little by the lee.
I use outside gybes and no spinnaker sock. It’s a little bit of a handful single- or doublehanded, but I pull the sail in under the boom and behind the main, and stuff it down the companionway. I have also been forced to tack at an upwind mark and just drop it on deck, with no problems so far.
What PHRF ratings did you end up after your appeal?
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Jackdaw,
Thanks for posting these polar diagrams. I have two questions: 1) It appears the 311 diagram is done for an asymmetrical spinnaker of some unknown design, and not a symmetrical spinnaker. Am I reading that correctly? 2) How did you determine that above 12 kn on the First 310 diagram the spinnaker should be taken down? Is it because the listed gybing angles, and presumably the best VMG, are at 180 deg?
Hey there,
1) Nope, for sure its drawn for an optimal downwind sail configuration, and that will be symmetrical. Why do you think asym?
2) The term 'down the hatch' means that you turn straight DDW (dead down wind). You can see the best downwind VMG is pretty much 180 on the 310, almost the same at the 311.
Jackdaw,
Where the certificate shows the sail areas, it says “asym. spinnaker”.
Are the numbers for true wind speed and true wind angle? I might put together a table for apparent wind speed and angle (my knotmeter impeller is frequently jammed with zebra mussels). Also, what are the numbers just above the table, such as GPH, OSN, and inshore and offshore TN?
Thanks!
That's AWESOME I didn't see that. ;^) Yes indeed the ORC certificate will be done with the rated boats supplied sail plan. That boat used an ASYM. If you want I can look for a SYM boat.
Polars are always in TRUE wind unless it says otherwise.
Those GPH (General Purpose Handicap) number is a time/on/distance handicap that can be used for general racing. The 'T' numbers are time-on-time handicap for inshore (windward/leeward) or offshore (all points) courses.
PS - a common conversion between ORC and PHRF is GPH - 550 = PHRF
How have you fared when racing the 311? Where did you finish and what size fleets? Just curious
I’ve done four races in my boat (I mostly race on other peopke’s boats). In 2016, I did two club 10-15 nm races in little to no breeze with a rookie crew and got crushed. In 2017, I did two bigger deal regional races. In the first race, about 25 miles, I got a second in my JAM class against pretty good competition and with an experienced but pickup crew. I did the second race, an overnight, big deal regional race, in the doublehanded class, and got 4th out of 5 in my class, ten minutes out of 3rd after 40-50 miles. It was the first time my crew had raced in the boat, but we often race doublehanded on long races in his boat. We started in 25-30 kn and thunderstorms at dusk, but after midnight the wind died during a dead downwind leg and the two nearest competitors overtook us. The wind came back for a final upwind leg but we didn’t overtake anyone in our class. We did manage to pass a few 35-40 footers while short tacking between islands up the final leg, so it was a moral victory. We finished somewhere in the middle overall.
With the 18 second better PHRF rating you mentioned I would have picked up some places in that last race.
I’d like to do better this year, but the 2017 results were a big improvement over 2016. I’m sort of working towards some 200+ mile races on Lakes Huron and Michigan in 2 years, but I don't want to put serious racing money into what is mostly a cruising boat.
Do you have the 311’s manual and the original sail trim guides from Neil Pryde?
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If you don't mind posting them it would be appreciated. I do have the original manual but nothing from Pryde.
Holy CRAP!!! 198? I'd have to beat you on the water, and you have 6 feet of water line on me! Thats a great rating.
Wow, 198, that’s 45 sec slower than my rating. Does your certificate have a restriction on the jib size, or perhaps it is for lighter winds?
Dennis,
Attached are the original Neil Pryde original sail trim guides. Sorry for the delay in posting them. I have been traveling so did not have access to the documents. I may have found these documents on this site some years ago.
I suggest using your judgement on using these exact settings, especially if your sails are not OEM., but it's a start. With my new jib, I found I had to move the jib lead 3-4 holes more forward than recommenced, for example. I also found that the boat likes to foot rather than point higher, especially in lighter wind. The keel doesn't really have enough lateral surface area. If you have sailed a dinghy to windward with the daggerboard partially up you will know what I mean.
If you or the forum have your own suggestions on how to more efficiently sail the 311, please being them up for discussion.
Also have the Charleston Spar manual on the mast and boom if you are interested.