Racing a Beneteau 311 w/Fin Keel and Centerboard
- Thread starter Dennis Thomas
- Start date
I spent some time with a sailmaker in Detroit and he worked out a way to cut and fit a 142% genoa to my 311. My boat has a genoa track that goes most of the way to the cockpit, so there's a place to run the lead. The sail just makes it around the spreaders if the lead is back about as far as it can go.
Interesting. Probably can't point for crap with that up, but you'll for sure be faster in light airs. And downwind.
One more point about PHRF ratings. Here are all the areas that report PHRF numbers for the 311. Remember that PHRF allows for up to a 150% headsail. These are base numbers. Even if you (or the boat!) choose smaller headsail, most clubs will give the the base (no allowances), but some will. Normally that will be 6-9 seconds. 198 adjusted rating seems way big. A huge allowance is bad for the fleet, it hurts all other boats, instead of one with a slight hard number.
Jackdaw,
With my genoa track arrangement, it looks like the sheet lead angles would be about the same for the standard 116% jib and the proposed 142% genoa, 14-15 degrees or so, so equally bad with both sails. In light winds the larger sail might actually do a little better because the faster speed would help reduce leeway for this boat with a smaller keel surface area. That polar diagram you posted shows pretty tight tacking angles for a cruising boat, but I can't see how it's possible with such a wide sheeting angle. The tacking angles at 10-12 knots works out to about 30 deg apparent, which I think are fairly standard on boats with 8 deg sheeting angles. The speeds and angles otherwise look plausible.
Jackdaw,
In the B311 PHRF table, what do the numbers in the three columns to the right indicate?
In the B311 PHRF table, what do the numbers in the three columns to the right indicate?
A-B-C = Years of experience with the boat/handicap combo A=initial rating, B=one year, C=multi-year
xx is the last year the rating was updated by the club/phrf reporting distinct
X is the number of boats reported last year.
Remember that if your sail must go around your shrouds, THAT shroud point determines your headsails AOA. Your jib track is several feet inboard. That makes for a tighter AOA and better pointing. I agree (by a quick look) that your tracks give about a 13 degree sheeting angle. Remember that polars do NOT factor where the tracks are, and they assume optimal trim. As a general rule for boats with non-overlapping rigs, if the tracks are BELOW the cabin windows, you need inhaulers to hit your angles.
The opposite is also true; if the tracks are ABOVE the window (like on BlueJ) we point fine but need out-haulers the second we crack off more than 10 degrees.
Jackdaw,
Thanks for the explanation. If suppose I'm the one on Lake Erie with the 150 base rating. I have a 3-second roller furling credit to give my boat a 153 PHRF rating. I used to have a 3-blade fixed prop and a credit for that but I switched out to a 2-blade Flexofold a few years ago.
Where can this PHRF data be found? You seem to have a consolidated data base.
It's available to US Sailing members online. PHRF National Handicap book. I just took a screen-shot of the 311 data.
Jackdaw,
You make some good points with respect to getting around the spreader.
I have tried sheeting in more closely, including using jury-rigged inhaulers, but the boat just dies from pinching and drifts off to leeward. I have theorized that with more keel area I could head up more, but so far I keep up with the fleet more effectively if I foot off. I do need to try more ideas, however, especially when I'm out competing with other boats. So far the best I can do is sheet in until the jib leech is about a quarter or a third of a way in from the spreader tip to the mast.
I also find that as soon as I head off the wind to a close reach I need to move the jib lead out and forward. I move the sheet to a snatch block on the rail pretty early, sometimes using both leads in the transition.
In more vigorous winds I seem to be able to sheet in harder and point a little higher, but more things are changing so it's hard to be quantitative. Lake Erie is fairly shallow in the west end so the waves tend to be very steep and close together. The locals refer to them as square waves (as compared to sine waves). The sharp chop complicates evaluations of how high the boat can point when it's more windy. This year I should have a J-29, an S-2, a Tartan 3800 shoal draft, Jeanneau 36, and a J-24 fleet to sail against in my club, so I should get some more comparisons. The Jeanneau and Tartan have shallow keels, similar to mine; the others have deep, racing keels. I can usually keep up with or pass the Jeanneau and Tartan even though though they are rated about 20 seconds per mile faster.
Last edited:
Thanks. I have been looking for a reason to join USSailing, but they seem to have zero presence in my area. It would just be a fee. Perhaps this data is a reason.
Join if you can. Many regattas require it, and the money helps the US sailing team, and events county-wide. We're hosting the USSailing Adult Championships this September. Should be a blast.
Sounds like you are looking at all the right things. You're right, if you try and trim too tight an AOA with the headsail, it will trim fine but the boat's foils will stall and you'll just slip slowly sideways.