Race Report: WYC Frostbite Cup

Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
WYC final official race of the year, held last weekend in 40F degree air temps and 12-16 knots of breeze, gusts mostly around 18. BlueJ has a history of winning this race, but this year was going to be hard because we would going to missing our pit person (Jean), a key player in a buoy race in breeze. So our plan was to have Jodi do upwind main trim, and then take over pit when we approach the windward mark. Matthew (new guy) would do main during the downwinds. That plan worked (mostly).

Here's it working fine... 5.9 knots upwind in perfect trim and balance. Due to the breeze we brought an extra crewmember (Keith) along as ballast technician and wind caller. I love everything about this picture. We're on our polar speed, Optimal heel, active trimming, people calling breeze (puff on its way), and we're lifted 10 degrees. Normally the RaceGeek tracks that, but our Pit person manages the device to get that to happen. As she was missing, I went old school, and we wrote our mean wind angles on Etape on each side of the hatch. You can see the 220 vs 230 in the picture.

frost upwind1.jpg



Here is it not working so well. PHRF 1 sailed an OM (Olympic Modified) course, so the first downwind had a tight reach over to a gybe mark. All of that went well, but after the gybe Matthew didn't ease the mainsail to the run course, and an ensuing puff overpowered us when he failed to react in time and we rounded up. Decent recovery however.


One more incident later... on our 2nd spin hoist the spin halyard shackle popped when the kite's head when over the lifeline on the hoist. Never happened to us before. It took 2 minutes to get that sorted. Next year, Tylaska shackles! So we ended up with 2nd. Not bad all figured. Plus a nice easy reach home!

homeward frostbite.jpg
 
Aug 2, 2010
502
J-Boat J/88 Cobourg
I love the mean wind angles as notes there. We have been trying to get the whole crew into some of the higher order functions like looking for pressure and observing the rest of the fleet and I am sure this would get their head into lifts and knocks and higher order strategy. We have not previously had instruments on the mast or where anyone but those behind the binnacle could see them but this looks ideal.
Having been in sports with team strategic input I know this can be a difficult element. Even worse, I have seen some videos with tacticians (formal or self-appointed) screaming at the driver, but I think we can manage as I enjoy input and discussion but you would only yell at me once!
I am curious how, or if, you communicate the polar targets to the team? Do you have them posted or do you discuss them?
Thanks, Dan
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
I love the mean wind angles as notes there. We have been trying to get the whole crew into some of the higher order functions like looking for pressure and observing the rest of the fleet and I am sure this would get their head into lifts and knocks and higher order strategy. We have not previously had instruments on the mast or where anyone but those behind the binnacle could see them but this looks ideal.
Having been in sports with team strategic input I know this can be a difficult element. Even worse, I have seen some videos with tacticians (formal or self-appointed) screaming at the driver, but I think we can manage as I enjoy input and discussion but you would only yell at me once!
I am curious how, or if, you communicate the polar targets to the team? Do you have them posted or do you discuss them?
Thanks, Dan
Re mean wind angles.... normally the RaceGeek can help sort them out, remember them, and display deltas between current heading and that angle for each board. But that takes coordination between me and the person (in our case pit) pressing buttons on the device. On the Geek that's rather easy once you get the hang of it, but with Jean gone and with the breeze etc, I just went old school. The angle I figure by watching our upwind readings in practice, and also listening to the RC as they take readings while setting up the course.

Having them on the mast for all to see is a game changer. Everyone can see them from anywhere on the boat, day or night (red). On the RaceGeek, the numbers are so big that the crew calls it the Jumbotron. Top line is ALWAYS boat-speed, middle line is countdown timer in the pre-start, switching automatically to compass while racing. Bottom line is lift-knock indicator upwind, automatically switching to true wind angle/speed downwind. The device has it own GPS, but we use a NMEA interface to get speed and wind data from the boat. When cruising we often set the bottom line to depth (number + historical graph) to stay off the rocks!

If you look at the full size picture by the bulkhead instruments, you can see a printed sheet with out polars. Upwind I track boat-speed vs TWS, and downwind I track TWA vs TWS. Those are the key optimizations. Upwind if you are faster than your polars you are footing, no other way that happens! Downwind with a sym boat it's key to sail your angle vs TWS. On an asym boat you usually put the AWA on the beam and sail with zero heel. The Geek will show that as well on line 3. The paper chart shows the corresponding value for True Wind Speed every 2 (then 4) knots. I pretty much have it memorized.

Hope that helps, let me know if you have more questions, or want a deeper explanation!
 
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Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Thanks for sharing, looks like the race is aptly named counting all the touques aboard. :)
Interesting video - not really race related but I’m curious how you mounted the camera to get that angle without jitter?
 
Aug 2, 2010
502
J-Boat J/88 Cobourg
I certainly can see the wide range of True and apparent depending on TWS so I will need to be aware of my angles particularly downwind. It looks like until 15 knts when she will want to get up and plane you can sail pretty deep. Dan
 

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Apex

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Jun 19, 2013
1,197
C&C 30 Elk Rapids
congrats on a good race. Even if it turned to be a lessons learned for crew, it is still a win in that regard. The results are something to be proud of.
 
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Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
I certainly can see the wide range of True and apparent depending on TWS so I will need to be aware of my angles particularly downwind. It looks like until 15 knts when she will want to get up and plane you can sail pretty deep. Dan

Hmmm. Those ORC polars are interesting. Compared to BlueJ (24.5 feet, 4800 lbs), I'm surprised how similar the polars are, and how close the speeds are in the 10-16 knot range. With a hull speed of say 7.2 knots, it shows the 88 not planing on it's polars until past 16 knots of breeze. After 20 the 260 starts to plane, and the j88 takes off. But I would have expected it to be faster for a 29 foot sportboat. And I think it is! Remember these are built based on the particular boat owners sails.

combined polars.png


No matter what you find, its good to know your 'curve'. That is, wide when the wind is light, deeper as it builds, and then back out when the boat takes off and you can make much better VMG despite the wider angle. Zoom!
 
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Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Thanks for sharing, looks like the race is aptly named counting all the touques aboard. :)
Interesting video - not really race related but I’m curious how you mounted the camera to get that angle without jitter?
Its a GoPro 6 with stabilization on. Being shot so wide angle helps too. I just clamped the camera to the flag standard. It was wiggling the whole way!..
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Its a GoPro 6 with stabilization on. Being shot so wide angle helps too. I just clamped the camera to the flag standard. It was wiggling the whole way!..
Wow - I thought for sure it was gimballed somehow. Guess I need to upgrade from my Hero2
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Wow - I thought for sure it was gimballed somehow. Guess I need to upgrade from my Hero2
Normally I use a Horizon True gimbal, but I used to mount that to a rigid VHF antenna on the transom. I swapped that beast out for a whip, and forgot I lost my mounting! Will have to sort that out sometime.
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Thanks for sharing, looks like the race is aptly named counting all the touques aboard. :)
Yes indeed. But not me. I'll give a Mt Gay hat to anyone that can produce a picture of me wearing a lid. 'cause I don't!
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
You have the option of not wearing a lid. Those of us that now have less natural sunblock don’t ;)

I’ve been trying to cypher out what this little bag thing is for and all I can think of is a emergency throw bag???

43FBB999-11D6-44CB-B24A-64182891427D.jpeg


Also just read the review of the new GoPro 8, maybe Santa will be extra nice this year. $100 off for any trade in.
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
You have the option of not wearing a lid. Those of us that now have less natural sunblock don’t ;)

I’ve been trying to cypher out what this little bag thing is for and all I can think of is a emergency throw bag???

View attachment 171460

Also just read the review of the new GoPro 8, maybe Santa will be extra nice this year. $100 off for any trade in.
Ah. Back when APS was actually in the sailboat racing business, they sold a great protest flag that was stored in a UV safe bag on your backstay. To deploy it, you simply pull on that small lanyard (mine with a clip) and it pops out. No looking for it, which would probably get your protest invalidated due to a rule 61(a) violation. Every PC has its own idea of what 'reasonable opportunity' is.
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
To deploy it, you simply pull on that small lanyard (mine with a clip) and it pops out.
AH got it thanks.
My second guess was a parachute like on a dragster in the event you have TOO much boat speed! ;)

The 360 view on the Hero 8 sounds interesting, would add a whole new perspective about where other boats were during the race. Is using a follow me drone legal while racing?
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Is using a follow me drone legal while racing?
Once something leaves the boat, it is 'outside'.

While racing you cannot have outside help that is not freely available to all boats.

So while it is currently technically legal (unless the NOR or SI say otherwise) to fly a drone, using it in any way to gain advantage (say by looking for breeze) would be a violation of RRS 41.
 
Mar 26, 2011
3,415
Corsair F-24 MK I Deale, MD
I noticed most of the sailors were wearing gloves with at least 2 fingers out. Of course, it was not that cold and racing keeps you moving.

What do you like when it gets colder and for less aggressive sailing? Lots of things will work for steering and more relaxed sailing, including ski gloves and sailing variants of ski gloves. I like thick neoprene when it is wet and near freezing. But what about something more agile for 40-50F and good winds? I have pair I really liked, but they are worn through and out of production.
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
I noticed most of the sailors were wearing gloves with at least 2 fingers out. Of course, it was not that cold and racing keeps you moving.

What do you like when it gets colder and for less aggressive sailing? Lots of things will work for steering and more relaxed sailing, including ski gloves and sailing variants of ski gloves. I like thick neoprene when it is wet and near freezing. But what about something more agile for 40-50F and good winds? I have pair I really liked, but they are worn through and out of production.
Well that was 40-50 and good winds! For that in Minnesota we use the full or full-1 finger leather gloves.

For colder or wetter you have to go to neoprene, there really in no other answer. The trick (as you note) is that palms have to right... tacky enough to hold the line, but strong enough to not wear through. My go-to for now is the Henri-Lloyd 3mm Winter Glove, its perfect for me. I say 'for now' because sadly they no longer make them, but thats the idea. Maybe yours were the same? I have one new pair left before I need to search again.

NEOPRENE_WINTER_GLOVES_BACK_1024x1024@2x.jpg