PSS Dripless and new shaft

[chrisings]

Greetings fellow sailors.

With the winter approaching the list of things to doing while on the hard is on my mind. The top runner for this off season is installing a PSS dripless. I’ve searched the forums and found some good info but was looking for some firsthand input from anyone who has done this on one of our beloved Catalina 30s.

Mine is an ’83 with a M-25XP diesel. Just a little info about me. I have a fair amount of mechanical knowledge having worked in the service department at a car dealership for the first 25 years of my working career. The difference between WD 40 and PB buster is old news J Last year I attempted to service the stuffing box and it is rusted solid. Tried every trick I know, heat, hitting it with a hammer, more heat, lots of PB buster, no go. Therefore I expect the answer is going to be cutting the propeller shaft with an angle grinder and replacing everything, shaft, coupling, etc.
Questions:
Where does one buy a new shaft and coupling?
Can the shaft be removed without dropping the rudder?
I’ve read about facing the replacement coupling and don’t understand the need. I would think a new coupling would be true.
So, is this not a DYI project?
Thanks for any and all pointers, links, books to read etc.
Chris on Trinity.

 

[hvbaker]

Replaced mine over a year ago when stuffing box disintegrated when changing stuffing. The shaft can slide back far enough to get box off and dripless on. If you do it in water like we did make sure your pumps work.

 

[chrisings]

View attachment 81679

Replaced mine over a year ago when stuffing box disintegrated when changing stuffing. The shaft can slide back far enough to get box off and dripless on. If you do it in water like we did make sure your pumps work.

Thanks HV, after a quick google search of Catalina 30 images I think I know the answer to the prop shaft/rudder question. Looks like there's plenty of room to completely remove the shaft without worrying about the rudder.

 

[Meriachee]

Unless there is a facility close to you, the next best thing is a shaft from CD. The new shafts are stainless, which the originals are not, and a new, faced coupler makes it a breeze to install. Better done on the ground, it's a very good suggestion to do the cutlass bushing at the same time. (That's the pita part of the deal)
Ours has been in for 2 years, and we have to keep testing the bilge pump the hard way now. Dry as a bone.
Cheers
Gary

 

[dziedzicmj]

I +1 meriachee's comment (buy from Catalina Direct). When you are at it, I strongly suggest adding $30 to the mix and getting a retention collar from the makers of the PSS.

 

[chrisings]

Thanks folks,

I see on the CD website they offer 2 couplers. One is the original OEM for $213 the other is an "aftermarket" for $92. Anyone have experience with the aftermarket? Clearly this is a rather important part so I'm thinking it's worth the extra $118?? Thoughts?

 

[Meriachee]

If you don't have access to qualified assistance, get the original. The couple of extra bucks is worth the peace of mind.
Thanks Marek, I forgot to mention the retention collar. I've heard that they are including it in the kit now?
The thing that may not have been stated in the installation docs, is put some anti-seize compound on the shaft ONLY where it goes into the coupler, ie, AFTER you've fed it through everything else. You DO NOT want to get that stuff on the carbon ring. Applying that will help when you have to disassemble it sometime in the future.

And the last "learned" point is to put some paper towels against the sides of the fibgreglass beside the carbon ring for the first hour or so as you are breaking it in. It tends to shed carbon, and the stuff is a bear to get off the glass. Ask me how I know this......
Hope it helps
Gary

 

[JK_Boston_Catalina310]

I did this project on our Catalina 310 last year.

According to what I found out from Maine Sail, a big part of this is finding a good marine machine shop. Machine shops that aren't familiar with this type of project could mess it up on you. I went with Rose's Marine in Gloucester, MA. I know some other C310 owners have used them and had parts shipped as far as New Jersey and they were still competitive. But you might be able to find a good shop in CT.

To start the project, I just cut the old shaft near the hull with an angle grinder. I then disconnected the coupling from the transmission and brought the two parts to Rose's (I think the guys who were not local just measured the shaft and and told Rose's the measurements). I had them machine a stainless shaft, fit and face it to a new split coupling (if you have the original you probably have a solid coupling that is not worth reusing) and lap fit the propeller and line cutter. In hindsight I could have done the lap fitting myself and saved a little money. All in this cost me about $400 from Rose's.

Since you will have your shaft out, plan on doing your cutlass bearing. Very easy following Maine Sail's directions.

The most difficult part of the whole project was aligning the coupling and the transmission. It was hard work just very tedious and you have to check it again when your boat has been in the water for a little while.

Good luck and fair winds,

Jesse

 

[jimmcgee]

The PSS is one of the best things I've done on our boat. Clean dry bilge and it eliminates a lot of boat smells which is good for the wife.

I re-used our shaft as it was in good shape. The wear from the old stuffing box is usually in a different place on the shaft from where the PSS will mount. The toughest part if you're re-using the shaft is getting the old coupling off. I had to cut ours off with a Dremel (couldn't get a grinder in there).

+1 on the retainer. Check with the vender when you order, I'm pretty sure it's included now. I'd also stick with the real PSS rather than a knock off. If it fails it can sink your boat. Do your really want a cheap Chinese knock off here? :naughty:

Also +1 on the cutlass bearing. I would do this job on the hard, wouldn't even think about doing it in the water.

Take a good look at YOUR boat before starting the job. I was surprised how much difference there was in the distance from the transmission to the stern tube between my '95 and a friends 2000. I had to remove part of the lip for the access panel in the sole to tighten the screws on mine. His sat back about an inch farther and made the job a lot easier.

 

[chrisings]

Thanks everyone!!

While contemplating this job and looking at options something occurred to me. My boat is re-powered from it's original Atomic 4. I've read that the propeller from the A4 is not optimized for a diesel but there is a clearance issue when looking to replace it with a 3 blade prop. Is now a good time, if I'm going to replace the propeller shaft anyway, to make the shaft longer in order to accommodate a larger 3 blade prop?

 

[Meriachee]

I'm confused. What do you mean by clearance? You should not extend the shaft past the end of the cutlass bearing by more than an inch or so, the vibration will tear the thing out.

 

[chrisings]

I'm confused. What do you mean by clearance? You should not extend the shaft past the end of the cutlass bearing by more than an inch or so, the vibration will tear the thing out.

That's why boards like this are such a great resource. I have never considered the distance from the cutlass. Thanks!

 

[Stu Jackson]

Thanks everyone!!

While contemplating this job and looking at options something occurred to me. My boat is re-powered from it's original Atomic 4. I've read that the propeller from the A4 is not optimized for a diesel but there is a clearance issue when looking to replace it with a 3 blade prop. Is now a good time, if I'm going to replace the propeller shaft anyway, to make the shaft longer in order to accommodate a larger 3 blade prop?

Chris, not only what was said in the last back and forth, but are you suggesting you still have the A4 prop on your boat after changing the engine? That sounds quite odd, because the transmissions are quite different, and one would have expected a re-power to change props, too.

 

[chrisings]

Chris, not only what was said in the last back and forth, but are you suggesting you still have the A4 prop on your boat after changing the engine? That sounds quite odd, because the transmissions are quite different, and one would have expected a re-power to change props, too.

No, I have a 13x12 2 blade. I was thinking about the possibility of a larger 3 blade. We are strictly lazy cruisers just looking to motor more efficiently. Perhaps I'm chasing rainbows.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Right. There are two things at work here. As meriachee said in #11, the length of the prop back from the strut is one. The other is the diameter and how close the upper tip can get to the hull. This is written up in most detailed boat design books.

 

[chrisings]

Right. There are two things at work here. As meriachee said in #11, the length of the prop back from the strut is one. The other is the diameter and how close the upper tip can get to the hull. This is written up in most detailed boat design books.

Yup, it was just a crazy thought, clearly not practical. Again, it's why these boards are such a great resource, especially when it comes to keeping expectations reasonable. I'll be lucky if I can just get the old prop shaft out

 

[Meriachee]

That's very likely the good news. The original shafts are soft soft bronzy stuff. I went with a full pack of 4" disks and my angle grinder when I did mine, and that sliced it without taking the lettering off the first disk. Screwing with the old rusty coupler wasn't worth the effort. I added 1/2" to the overall length measurement and one call to CD fixed it. Some few weeks later a nice package arrived with everything. Being this far north, we have to be our own boat supplier....

If you're going to replace the prop, collect all the relevant data, and tell the prop store what you're looking for, which is not that different from, I suspect, most people.
Zero drag, huge thrust, and of course, 7.7kts true hull speed at 250 rpm. Your results may differ. :naughty:

Cheers
Gary

 

[dziedzicmj]

When you cut through the shaft, cover the areas around with paper towels or other dropsheet stuff. Getting the filings out of the bilge would be unnecessary fun.


And as Meriachee said, use some paper towels when you in stall the PSS to collect the fine carbon dust for the first few runs.

 

[Alan Gomes]

Before you cut through the shaft, use a permanent marker to place two dots 1" apart on the shaft and then cut the shaft in between those dots. This will allow you to get an exact measurement of the old shaft when you lay out the pieces to measure them on your work bench.

 

[chrisings]

Before you cut through the shaft, use a permanent marker to place two dots 1" apart on the shaft and then cut the shaft in between those dots. This will allow you to get an exact measurement of the old shaft when you lay out the pieces to measure them on your work bench.

Great tip, thanks!