Odor from cockpit lazarette

RichH · Jan 4, 2015

Leprecaun said:
<SNIP> Also, I never thought of the shower drain, which does run to the bilge. Should I pour something down it?
I appreciate your advice.

A shower should NEVER be drained into the bilge. The zillions of dead skin cells that are released and ultimately wind up in the bilge will 'putrify' and give off a horrendous 'stink' (putrenes - the chemicals formed from 'rotting', decomposing, dead mammalian cells). Either pump the shower sump overboard directly or install a 'grey water tank' which then can be pumped overboard or into a 'pumpout'. (In many EU countries its becoming illegal to pump such 'grey water' overboard - must be pumped to a 'sewer', just like 'black/sewage water'.

To clean the bilge of putrified skin cells, use a heavily caustic based detergent (Sodium silicate based such as Tuff-eNuff, Roll-on, etc. or LYE based detergent to DISSOLVE and 'liquify' the 'rotting' cells, then scrub, repeat, and rinse/flush and repeat as needed.

Jackdaw · Jan 4, 2015

RichH said:
A shower should NEVER be drained into the bilge. The zillions of dead skin cells that are released and ultimately wind up in the bilge will 'putrify' and give off a horrendous 'stink' (putrenes - the chemicals formed from 'rotting', decomposing, dead mammalian cells).

Agreed, one of the dumbest things a builder can do inside a sailboat. Whenever I see this, I KNOW the 'designer' never had any intention of ever really sailing on this boat. The builder just said, 'draw it with a cheap shower in it so it will sell', and he rolled over.

woodster · Jan 4, 2015

my 9.2 came with a direct drain to the bilge and it smelled like a morgue with the AC and cooler broke down ...i built a sump box with a float switch and drain fitting, removable SS water screen and 6" clear clean out port along with a vent fitting so as to keep this under control i have a diaphragm pump jabsco pumping it dry ...that was a weak point in the plumbing of this boat but is now gone

gldndrm · Jan 5, 2015

Odors

I was mostly an electrical/electronics tech for many years but like everyone in a boatyard operation I had to do many "plumbing" jobs too. In the yuck factor category - number one was black water with floaties, number two was black water without floaties, number three was shower sumps. They can be amazing biological cultures from hair, skin cells, etc. as noted above. One other yuck factor was getting on any boat which stunk too much. Many of these were used just a few times a year and buttoned up off season without any ventilation or cleaning. So here are some thoughts, most of which have already been noted above.

(a) In zero cases should anyone drain a shower or any sink into a bilge because all that stuff will grow and stink there. I have cleaned out shower sumps which were only slightly damp and almost solid. Makes me want to gag just remembering.
(b) Ice boxes can be severe odor generators. If they drain into the bilge see (a). Better that they don't drain and keep them dry/clean by hand. The drains almost always plug up. Ditto on reefers (if that was not included in anyone's definition of ice box).
(c) Salt water is not just salt water - it also includes critters, plant stuff, and other organics, all of which will rot and smell. So if salt water is in the boat it will smell over time. It can't be avoided with a shaft seal lubricated by salt water so where it accumulates it must be dealt with.
(d) Lots of good advice in the other posts, but I would be leery of using chlorine in the bilge. I have done it myself but stopped and won't use it again. OK to use for fresh water tanks. It will kill anything in the bilge but it will also corrode things you might not want to corrode. It will also not get rid of dead organics easily although it will change them chemically - basically by oxidation - a potent corrosive process.
(e) The products recommended by Peggy noted above are excellent. They will not work if any chlorine or other harsh chemicals (like lye or acids some use to clean hoses with) are present. So you have to have a chemically clean place for them to work.
(f) Holding tank vent lines are critical in keeping holding tank odors under control. The "good" bacteria (don't stink and eat stuff that does stink) need oxygen. The stinky (anaerobic) bacteria only live where there isn't any oxygen. So vent lines need to be clear and they need to be as big as possible - which is usually much, much larger than what manufacturers put in, and, they have to run uphill all the way under any angle of heel. I am in the process of changing mine from 5/8" to 1". Mine was also plumbed from the hull side just below the top of the tank - guaranteed to plug when the boat heeled to that side every time. It also ran downhill a big part of the way so anything that got in there stayed there. My new vent is vented on the inboard top of the tank. Vent lines are not just for keeping the tanks from being over pressurized under use or sucked in when pumped. And the tank should never, ever, be overfilled. There are some good threads on this blog as well as on others.
(g) Anywhere on a boat which remains closed up will stink over time. Best to keep all clean and airy as much as possible. Lazerettes come to mind.
(h) Kudos to all the good suggestions in the other posts.

mitiempo · Jan 6, 2015

Chlorine will cause rapid corrosion of stainless keel bolts and should be avoided in the bilge.
A good bilge cleaner would be my choice.

RichH · Jan 6, 2015

Chlorine (Sodium HypoChlorite -Clorox, etc) is used for killing microorganisms, it doesnt 'remove' them. If you dont remove them they will eventually 'moulder' and stink (and eventually provide the nutrients for other successive microorganisms to feed upon).

Caustic or 'alkali' based detergents ... dissolve the cellular material. Every dairy, pharmaceutical plant, brewery, winery, food plant, etc. etc. use 'caustics' such a LYE based or Sodium Silicate, TriSodiumPhosphate, etc. or other 'caustic' based detergents for cleaning.
Hand soaps are mild 'caustics'. ... That slimy feeling you get from hand soaps - the soap is 'gently' dissolving the top layer of dead skin, along with 'the dirt'.
Chlorine etc. is used for 'sanitizing' - killing, etc., ... not for getting rid of the 'dead bodies'.

Gunni · Jan 7, 2015

Until you get that shower drain overboard, killing stuff with bleach or antibacterials will just favor stinky sulfide-producing anaerobic bacteria colonization. They are way tougher than the good aerobic bacteria you want. That KO stuff is a nitrate compound and not for overboard discharge to waterways. Aim for a dry bilge, or one that drains overboard, just not the engine bilge.

gldndrm · Jan 7, 2015

"What would you suggest as a non- chlorine remedy to add to shower drain, and stuffing box area that drips and leads salt water to bilge? I used a 50/50 chlorine/water solution, but it sounds like that should be discouraged."

Glad to hear you have had success with the odors. It is a constant process. Unfortunately, the only way to keep odors down really is to clean with soap, rags, sponges, water. Even the soap should be washed off. The bilge will always be accumulating "stuff" - salt water, dead and live stuff, dirt, not to mention oil/diesel that isn't caught 100% by sorbs, etc. - even on a relatively clean boat. Check out the Peggy Hall book. It doesn't have anything earth shattering in there, and not a ton of scientific anything, and even a bit underwhelming, but what it does have is good and solid. At least it isn't very expensive.

But ditch the bleach from your cleaning kit. Like several have said before, it doesn't really take care of the fundamental problem. It will kill germs that might be hazardous if ingested or in a cut but the best way to deal with that is just soap and water (except minor treatments on occasion in your water tanks). If you clean your toilet on the outside or the inside with bleach containing products you will kill the germs OK but it will also get in the holding tank and in the bilge unless completely wiped off and kill the "good" germs.

As noted above nitrates may not be the best thing to discharge overboard. Not all products for this contain nitrates so you have to do your own research. The KO products are really for the holding tank which is pumped out to onshore facilities. Any minor amounts used in a spray is not a big deal IMHO but it does all add up. I personally try to limit anything that goes in the water that wouldn't normally be there. Please write to the City of Victoria, BC, Canada and please ask them to quit pumping 100% of this big city's untreated sewage out in to the Straits of Juan de Fuca. We sail by there pretty often.