O'day sailing without a swing keel

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Aug 16, 2012
7
Oday 23 Saratoga
I have a 23 which I haven't sailed yet ( new to sailing):confused: and my swing keel is gone. If I didn't replace and was just going to cruise around a few lakes nothing serious what would be the worst case? I know the older 22's didn't have a swing keel,
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
You have what is called a keel/centerboard sloop. Swing keels are an all together different animal. The older Catalina and and the older Venture MacGregors had swing keels.

If you have an older O'Day 23 built before 1974 you're going to have quite a challenge to get the centerboard to work. These boats had issues with the keels. O'Day built them with cast iron keels. They would rust up and constrict the centerboard. With that said, they're still nice boats when you fix them up so take heart and don't worry about it.

As far as sailing this boat without the centerboard goes. It will sail well enough without the centerboard but it could sail a lot better with it down. In other words, your boat will go to weather a whole lot better with the centerboard down. I think that you can still have some fun with this boat. I would go ahead and splash it and get used to it. Later on you can decide how you want to tackle the centerboard issue.

A friend of mine had one of these older O'Days with the same issue and he loved the boat. I love the interior of these boats and the way the galley is set up.
I'm sure that you'll love this boat after you've used it for a while.
Good luck!
Joe
 
Oct 16, 2008
512
MacGregor/Venture 25 Mesa AZ
If you sail without a weighted keel. . .

you'll end up UPSIDE down without any self righting and the mast pointed toward the bottom of the lake - not really a fun experience

On edit - just saw what was stated above. So the Keel is NOT weighted?
 
Aug 16, 2012
7
Oday 23 Saratoga
Correction of my 1st post

I have a 1979 23 which I haven't sailed yet ( new to sailing):confused: and my swing center board in the keel pocket is gone. If I didn't replace and was just going to cruise around a few lakes nothing serious what would be the worst case? I know the older 22's didn't have a swing keel, I corrected my post .
 
Oct 10, 2009
1,045
Catalina 27 3657 Lake Monroe
Bob McL said:
you'll end up UPSIDE down without any self righting and the mast pointed toward the bottom of the lake - not really a fun experience

On edit - just saw what was stated above. So the Keel is NOT weighted?
CB swings from a slot in the shoal keel and weighs about 60lbs. Righting is from the weighted keel. The boat will sail fine and will be safe, but just not as well to windward.
 
Mar 2, 2011
489
Compac 14 Charleston, SC
We have an O'day 26 which is a similar shoal keel/centerboard boat. It sails just fine with the board up except as others have said won't get as close into the wind (pointing).

Here is a great resource for O'day specific parts, Rudy is a terrific resource for us O'day owners.

http://www.drmarine.com/products.asp?cat=168

Go out and have some fun!
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
The keel on your O'Day 23 weighs 1250 lbs. You're not going to tip it over that easy. You just won't be able to point up as high and go to weather without the board down. Also, if you're on a run in excess wind and wave conditions, you're boat will have a tendency to yaw more without the centerboard down.

You need to check the under side of your keel to find out what is missing besides the centerboard. There should be two stainless steel plates, four 1/4" Phillips head bolts, two wood screws, and a fiber centerboard pivot pin. Outside of that, you need the centerboard braid pendant line with the shackle. Rudy at D&R Marine carries all this stuff.
http://www.drmarine.com/
Email me at sailtrinkka1986@verizon.net and I'll send you some pictures of this stuff and how it's configured in the keel slot.

There's really no worse case scenario except if you were trying to claw your way out to windward against a stiff foul current. In fact, this happened to me years ago off the coast of Martha's Vineyard near Menemsha. We had anchored near there over night during a fierce storm and in the morning when it was time to up anchor and sail out of there, I forgot to lower my centerboard and I was trying to claw my way out and head over to Cuttyhunk Island. My boat kept on losing ground and I couldn't figure out what was going on. After I realized that my board was up, I lowered it all the way down and she pulled right out of there without losing any ground.

Years ago, my late friend Chuck in Ohio discovered a piece broken off the centerboard on his O'Day 222. He had his boat lifted and he removed it. Then he had his boat lowered back into the water of Lake Erie again and used his boat the rest of the season without it.
I don't think you're going to find rougher waters than the Great Lakes. Chuck had no problems and you won't either. So go ahead and splash your boat and have fun with it.
 
Oct 16, 2008
512
MacGregor/Venture 25 Mesa AZ
CB swings from a slot in the shoal keel and weighs about 60lbs. Righting is from the weighted keel. The boat will sail fine and will be safe, but just not as well to windward.
Thanks, I was thinking it may be the weighted swing keel - not a center board.
 

rs8684

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Jul 6, 2011
32
Oday 23 Lake Nockamixon
I have a '79 Oday 23' as well. My centerboard is stuck inside the keel cavity. I have been sailing it with the centerboard up, and Yes, she definetly slips to leeward. I keep saying to myself, "Can't wait to get this centerboard fixed!" (I sail on a very narrow lake, and have to tack very often) I have heard that the attachment pins to the line sieze up, and get caught inside. Joe, I think I am going to ask you for pictures of you 222. Probably the repair job for my boat would be easy - the hard part would be getting to it! I am not to crazy about blocking up my boat in my yard, and crawling underneath there. Probably will just pay a boat yard to lift it up and fix it.
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
I have a '79 Oday 23' as well. My centerboard is stuck inside the keel cavity. I have been sailing it with the centerboard up, and Yes, she definitely slips to leeward. I keep saying to myself, "Can't wait to get this centerboard fixed!" (I sail on a very narrow lake, and have to tack very often) I have heard that the attachment pins to the line seize up, and get caught inside. Joe, I think I am going to ask you for pictures of you 222. Probably the repair job for my boat would be easy - the hard part would be getting to it! I am not to crazy about blocking up my boat in my yard, and crawling underneath there. Probably will just pay a boat yard to lift it up and fix it.
That would probably be the safest way to do it. I'm assuming that the later model O'Day 23 is set up similar to my O'Day 222 with the exception of the single sheave for the pendant line to ride through. Your boat doesn't have this as far as I know. The O'Day 26 does though.

The fifth pic shows the slots where the wedges fit in place. The centerboard pivots on that round fiber pin and the wedges are held in place with a regular polysulfide adhesive caulking. 3-M 4200 would work for this.
The sixth pic shows a rough sketch of how the wedges support the fiber pin. The plates are bolted to the keel against the wedges a screw holds the wedge in place until the caulking sets up.
They need to be careful when removing the four 1/4" Phillips head bolts. Probably the best tool for removing these bolts is good impact cordless drill with a Phillips bit in the chuck.
There's a bronze plate embedded in the lead on both sides of the slot according to what I've been told by Rudy of D&R Marine. If you should break a bolt you could re drill and tap for threads if you had to. I just took my time and removed the two stubborn bolts that were giving me trouble. I used an impact tool with a hammer, but I think a good cordless Makita with a bit in the chuck is the way to go.

To remove these wedges I used my fish fillet knife to cut the caulking. I heated the blade with a torch and worked it through the caulking. Then I used a putty knife with the blade heated.
If you damage the wedges you could reconstruct them with fiberglass.
Once the plates and wedges are removed and the slots are cleaned of all caulking, the board and pin will slide right down out of the slot.
The board is probably about 12" wide. The bottom of the keel needs to be about 18" off the ground. Good luck!
Joe
 

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rs8684

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Jul 6, 2011
32
Oday 23 Lake Nockamixon
Joe, thanks for the pics. Actually, what I was able to do was to get a stiff piece of metal, about 4 feet long and 1/4 inch wide, and stick it down the tube where the line went. It actually made it with a few inches to spare, and wouldn't you know it, I pushed and the keel swung downward! It seems that the board is a bit warped, and when you tighten it, it gets wedged into position. So now I know what to do after I take her off the trialer! When I am at the dock in the summer, I just won't pull the board up all the way!
 
Oct 10, 2009
1,045
Catalina 27 3657 Lake Monroe
dreamboat23 said:
I have a 23 which I haven't sailed yet ( new to sailing):confused: and my swing keel is gone. If I didn't replace and was just going to cruise around a few lakes nothing serious what would be the worst case? I know the older 22's didn't have a swing keel,
You just won't sail as well to windward. The centerboard helps the boat point and does not affect stability. Go sail!
 
Jan 24, 2005
4,881
Oday 222 Dighton, Ma.
Joe, thanks for the pics. Actually, what I was able to do was to get a stiff piece of metal, about 4 feet long and 1/4 inch wide, and stick it down the tube where the line went. It actually made it with a few inches to spare, and wouldn't you know it, I pushed and the keel swung downward! It seems that the board is a bit warped, and when you tighten it, it gets wedged into position. So now I know what to do after I take her off the trialer! When I am at the dock in the summer, I just won't pull the board up all the way!
I think that what I would do is get the boat off the trailer and remove the board. You may be able to do something to correct that problem. You could even build a new centerboard out of plywood and fiberglass. A guy in Providence RI had to do this to his 1973 O'Day 23 several years ago. The boat had some serious keel issues and he wound up breaking the board in half trying to get it out. You could always buy a new centerboard. They're big bucks but the boat is worth it. Rudy at D&R Marine has them in stock or can get them. http://www.drmarine.com/
I don't think it comes predrilled for the pin though. You would need to drill the hole yourself.
You may be able to do something with your centerboard though.
 
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