"Northers" in the eastern Gulf of Mexico

richk · Aug 1, 2015

Sorry I don't have a lot of time to respond right now. Did a quick search of the online literature and didn't uncover much of use to you. Suggestions
obtain pilot charts covering the gulf (download from http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62&pubCode=0003)
learn how to read them (time consuming but useful for long term voyage planning)

for short term planning learn how to read a surface weather chart then look for winds associated with eastern side of high pressure cell in fall or spring. If you want to avoid them, plan accordingly. Isobar spacing directly proportional to wind.

start at NWS.gov

sorry...got to go...
Rich

BigEasy · Aug 2, 2015

I have never heard of the term "northers"; the term "noreaster" pertains to low pressure systems on the atlantic coast that affect areas primarily north of South Carolina. I may stand corrected; however, I don't believe that the west coast of Florida is impacted by these storms.
What you can expect during the months from mid November thru the end of March are cold fronts of varying intensity that are a weekly occurrence. The fronts move from West or Northwest to East or Southeast. Winds on the Gulf Coast are predominantly South to Southeast. As a cold front approaches, the winds veer to Northwest with gusty winds and a day of rain depending on how fast the front pushes thru. After the front moves out, the skies clear with colder temps and the winds remain gusty out of the Northwest to North for another day and then subside. Seas in the Gulf will remain confused for another day or so. Of course the duration of bad weather is dependent on the intensity of the front and how fast it moves thru the area. So, with a typical cold front there will be 3 to 4 days of higer winds and seas followed by a warming trend with light winds returning to South to Southeast. Obviously you will need to closely monitor the weather as it constantly changes; however, there is somewhat of a pattern that should allow roughly 3 to 4 good days per week for sailing. Occasionally the fronts will follow one another in rapid succession and you could have bad weather for a week or more with no break inbetween. Generally speaking, the temperatures from St Pete and South remain mild throughout the winter; however, when strong fronts move thru, temperatures can dip into the 30's. The USPS online weather course presented by the University of Northwest Florida in Pensacola is a great way to learn about these frontal systems and the manner in which they develop and their life cycle. And, of course, you will have to closely monitor the National Weather Service forecasts and local weather station's interpretation for local features.

Sandy Stone · Aug 2, 2015

A norther is nothing but the arrival of a cold front in the vicinity where you are sailing. On the northern gulf coast, where I live, they can mean up to 35 knots from the NNW for 12 hours or so - generally a quick onset and gradual decline, with the wind clocking around to the NE and E and diminishing as the front passes. Often preceded by strong winds from the SW before the front arrives. Waves in the open Gulf could easily exceed 6-8 feet, closely spaced. IOW, you don't want to be on the water when a strong front comes through.
If you watch any TV weather shows at all, you will see the front coming for days ahead of time, and as it gets closer its arrival time can be predicted pretty accurately. Just keep an eye on things, and don't get caught out in a small boat.

Kings Gambit · Aug 2, 2015

Gene Neill said:
I hear if you're lucky enough to follow right behind one, you get the best weather possible?

We'd like to gunkhole the coast on one leg of the trip, and hopefully sail straight through on the other. Where our destination in the Keys will be, and what we'll do while there, is all weather dependent. So while it's weather knowledge I'm seeking most of all, any other info will be welcome also. Thanks in advance ...

These cold fronts can be on the nasty side especially if rain is in the mixture; AND they are COLD. Close to shore, as mentioned above, the waters of the Gulf can be very lumpy and "confused", taking a couple of days to settle down. Seasickness is a definite possibility if you're susceptible to it. If you don't know, assume that you are. You certainly would not want to go "back" [i.e., northwest to Naples from the Keys] in one; much better to wait for the SE wind to return. Would this be your first experience sailing the eastern Gulf of Mexico?

kloudie1 · Aug 2, 2015

I agree with above posters.. The problem is the fetch (wave build-up space) when the wind is west through west-northwest.. The wind from the front will push up some big waves and when they get close to the wast coast of FL, the shallow water makes em get really steep and nasty.. If you time the departure correctly (wind veering toward east AFTER going south) you could have a real sleigh ride.. No place to hide if you or the forecasters miss the mark.. Not saying don't go just saying that you may have to plan for some wait time ..

EDIT: the good thing is that the crossing would be 20 hours or thereabouts.. so if ya left mid morning or so .. you'd be there in the next morning.. Not a big weather window necessary

Anonymous 121765 · Aug 2, 2015

Gene,

It's rather simple pal, during winter months, the bigger fronts move further south. If you REALLY want to have an enjoyable trip, wait until at least the last 2 weeks in March up until the end of May. That's the magical time for cruising on the left coast.

Strong fronts are done, low humidity & fair winds abound. This is when I plan my trips & it's been working great for twenty years.

CR

John Nantz · Aug 2, 2015

Gene Neill said:
…. Neither of us is prone to seasickness, but the Admiral keeps meds for it on board anyway. (She's in charge of all sunscreen/bug repellant/feminine hygiene/medications/first aid-type provisions.)

Ummm…. and just noticing the bottle she’s holding, …. just wondering, and what does that cure??? ;-)

Kings Gambit · Aug 2, 2015

Gene Neill said:
We're not new to the eastern Gulf, but this will be our longest and most "adventurous" cruise to date, by far. Neither of us is prone to seasickness, but the Admiral keeps meds for it on board anyway. (She's in charge of all sunscreen/bug repellant/feminine hygiene/medications/first aid-type provisions.)

Meds won't do you much good in real time after feeling the effects. One typically has to take 'em in advance; normally the night b/f and the morning of departure, etc. It's a preventative measure, not a "treatment of symptoms measure." My wife has dealt with this over many years of sailing, so we know the routine. In any event, people are sometimes surprised by seasickness if not accustomed to bouncing around for several hours, etc.--seen it happen many times.

Terry in Naples · Aug 2, 2015

Living in Naples i have sailed to the keys and down the coast many times. Usually you have ample warning of a cold front and the weather to come. I have on, more than one occasion, left the boat in Key West and other locations during a blow that lasts for days and came home and returned for it later. Once for the whole month of December in key west when a cold front stalled and we had big waves and strong northerly winds for 4 weeks.
As for stops along the way. I Have stopped and anchored off panther key, the entrance to,e everglades city, and little shark river inlet. Not anything at any of the stops. Then the jump across from cape sabel,to Marathon area is shallow and bumpy at times. Just pick a good time to go.
A direct sail from Naples to Marathon or key west or the dry tortugas are all about 100 miles. We leave in the afternoon and hope to arrive mid morning when the sun is up and visibility in the water is good. If you are aware and have good sailing sense it is no,problem.
Terry

richk · Aug 2, 2015

example of a "norther" early this year

Attached is an example of a norther moving over the Gulf in late January of this year. The document shows the evolution of the norther over the region as a cold front move offshore.

As others have stated in this forum, one concern, if you are out there is fetch, or distance over the water that the wind blows and generates waves. (The other considerations are duration of the wind and its speed.)

Terry in Naples · Aug 3, 2015

Crab traps are a problem at times but usually they are not too far offshore. Sometimes between Naples and Marco they start a mile or so offshore and are in rows about 50 to 100 yards apart they may go,out 20 or more rows. And rows say 5 miles long. Once you get past them it is not so bad but sailing at night it could be trouble if you sail through a field of them.
There really is no limit where a crabber might set up though. However, i have not snagged one in years. Not saying i have not run them over they just did not hang up.
Do you have a centerboard?. If so you could slant it. I never see posts or talk to people who have been hung up and had problems they could not easily fix underway.

Stu Jackson · Aug 3, 2015

Traps

Gene Neill said:
...the boundary coincides roughly with the 3-mile line, is that about right?

Often the traps are set along depth contours which may or may not correlate to distance off.

MrBill_FLL · Aug 3, 2015

Be aware some of those park boundary markers have been broken off at (just) below sea level. plot them all, and don't be surprised if you miss a few.

BigEasy had a good summary.

I'll add: the wind will clock, from the typical East, to south, to west (and building), and by the time it goes WNW, its hitting, rain and cool/cold. then winds tend to move to N then east and begin to lighten up. (and warm up).

You can use that 'clocking wind' to get different places downwind.

The only issue is if you have a few fronts close together. Then you miss the lower/warmer/ drier East- ESE winds.

ps: you gotta go to Stans in Goodland on a Sunday. quite an experience...

Also, there are plenty of places to hole up in the 10k. white horse, jack daniels, new turkey. and in the keys. The run from flamingo to marathon is 1 good days run.

you'll want to get high resolution charts for that area.

Are you going to try for Dry Tortuga's?

MrBill_FLL · Aug 3, 2015

Stu Jackson said:
Often the traps are set along depth contours which may or may not correlate to distance off.

AFAIK, Crabbing is not allowed in the park boundary.

MrBill_FLL · Aug 3, 2015

you can start watching the winds rotating, change the pulldown to 'wind speed and direction and click play'. normally its like a 5-7 day cycle, warms up on east and south winds, usually takes a day or 2 from south to WNW. so mby 3 nice days to move before you need to think about protection...

http://graphical.weather.gov/sectors/southeastLoop.php#tabs

Active captain has lots of info on the 10k.
-huge number of birds migrate to the everglades during winter. impressive numbers of dolphins too. I love that area in the winter.

I would Not recommend dry Tortuga's, in a C22 in winter.

I've also launched at calusa island marina in goodland.. pretty good ramp.

"Northers" in the eastern Gulf of Mexico

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