I am replacing my current motor (2 cycle, 7 HP) bracket on my 1983 23' O'Day with a heavier duty one for my Honda 9.9. I need an additional mounting block that attaches to the stern and holds the motor bracket in a vertical position. Any ideas? PS I have left a message for Rudy. Thanks for the help.
MOTOR MOUNT BLOCK FOR O'DAY 23
- Thread starter fastscot
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motor mount
I put the garelick four stroke mount on my 26 last year, and Rudy suggested slicing my current mount in half vertically, and line up the mounting holes and pour epoxy with high density filler in the gap. I made a plywood form with the holes in the right place to hold the two halves in place to pour the epoxy. A little shaping after, and it worked very well.
I put the garelick four stroke mount on my 26 last year, and Rudy suggested slicing my current mount in half vertically, and line up the mounting holes and pour epoxy with high density filler in the gap. I made a plywood form with the holes in the right place to hold the two halves in place to pour the epoxy. A little shaping after, and it worked very well.
Issues
If you are talking about that angled block of fiberglass that mounts between the transom and the actual bracket, I think you will be disappointed in what Rudy can offer. The problem is that Rudy is (or at least was a few years ago when I went through this) limited to producing reproductions of the original mounting blocks. These original mounting blocks were designed to handle the narrow outboard brackets of the time: those made to hold lightweight two stroke engines. He did not have the ability (except as a purely custom item) to make a mounting block that could accomodate the footprint of the newer, studier brackets, such as the type designed to handle four stroke outboards. When I went to replace my outboard bracket about five years ago, I found that the inside of my mounting block was a little crumbly. I went to Rudy to find out if he could make me a new one. I don't remember the exact price he quoted me, but it was way more than I wanted to spend. I wound up fixing my existing mounting block myself. There have been many posters on this site who have realized that they can't just upgrade to a four stroke outboard without also upgrading the mounting bracket (its not just the weight of the four stroke that requires a beefier bracket!), which in turn also requires them to upgrade their mounting block (the four stroke bracket footprint is generally too wide for the original Oday mounting blocks). I have seen several posters who have suggested various means of building new mounting blocks: Starboard, teak, oak and marine grade plywood can all be used.
If you are talking about that angled block of fiberglass that mounts between the transom and the actual bracket, I think you will be disappointed in what Rudy can offer. The problem is that Rudy is (or at least was a few years ago when I went through this) limited to producing reproductions of the original mounting blocks. These original mounting blocks were designed to handle the narrow outboard brackets of the time: those made to hold lightweight two stroke engines. He did not have the ability (except as a purely custom item) to make a mounting block that could accomodate the footprint of the newer, studier brackets, such as the type designed to handle four stroke outboards. When I went to replace my outboard bracket about five years ago, I found that the inside of my mounting block was a little crumbly. I went to Rudy to find out if he could make me a new one. I don't remember the exact price he quoted me, but it was way more than I wanted to spend. I wound up fixing my existing mounting block myself. There have been many posters on this site who have realized that they can't just upgrade to a four stroke outboard without also upgrading the mounting bracket (its not just the weight of the four stroke that requires a beefier bracket!), which in turn also requires them to upgrade their mounting block (the four stroke bracket footprint is generally too wide for the original Oday mounting blocks). I have seen several posters who have suggested various means of building new mounting blocks: Starboard, teak, oak and marine grade plywood can all be used.
Thanks,
Thanks for the ideas. I was hoping to simply add a second block side by side to handle the two sides of the new larger and wider bracket mount. My current block is in good shape after a fair amount of epoxy repair a couple of years ago. If necessary if will make a new block, but was trying to avoid the work.
Thanks for the ideas. I was hoping to simply add a second block side by side to handle the two sides of the new larger and wider bracket mount. My current block is in good shape after a fair amount of epoxy repair a couple of years ago. If necessary if will make a new block, but was trying to avoid the work.
No luck
I just heard back from Rudy. He can't be of any help, he doesn't have the molds the blocks were made from. To the work shop I go.
I just heard back from Rudy. He can't be of any help, he doesn't have the molds the blocks were made from. To the work shop I go.
Never thought of that!
I like your idea! Two blocks side by side. Nice. Rudy definitely had that mold for the Oday 23 block when I asked him a few years ago, but it was just way too much money for me. I don't remember exactly how much, but I believe it was several hundred dollars. Skilled fiberglass work is expensive. I avoided the whole problem by repowering with a new two stroke. The replacement bracket (from Rudy) fit my existing block and bolt hole pattern. I didn't even have to drill new holes in the transom. How weird that the entire outboard market changed so completely in three short years that you don't have the two stroke option at all anymore.
I like your idea! Two blocks side by side. Nice. Rudy definitely had that mold for the Oday 23 block when I asked him a few years ago, but it was just way too much money for me. I don't remember exactly how much, but I believe it was several hundred dollars. Skilled fiberglass work is expensive. I avoided the whole problem by repowering with a new two stroke. The replacement bracket (from Rudy) fit my existing block and bolt hole pattern. I didn't even have to drill new holes in the transom. How weird that the entire outboard market changed so completely in three short years that you don't have the two stroke option at all anymore.
Motor mount block reply
Why couldn't a motor mount block be made up of stainless steel? It wouldn't even have to be shaped like a block. It could be welded up to resemble a stand-off type of extension bracket with a plate wide enough to accept the engine bracket. I would think that a good marine metal fabricator or anyone with welding experience could make one up. The manufacturers should come up with some kind of an extension bracket for these heavy 4 strokes specifically for powerboats and sailboats. They would sell more 4 stroke outboards if they did. As it stands right now, I'm going to hold on to my old Johnson Sailmaster 8 HP 2 stroke for as long as I can. I don't want to have to go through the trouble of changing motor mount blocks and brackets. I had the same problem with my fuel compartment on my 222. It's big large enough for a 6 gal. metal gas tank, but not and 6 gal. plastic tank. The O'Day 25s, 26s and Seaward 22, have that same problem. The O'Day people didn't make the fuel compartments large enough on their boats. Fortunately, I was lucky to find a 6 gal. plastic tank made by Dura-Tank for OMC, that would fit in these fuel compartments. Joe
Why couldn't a motor mount block be made up of stainless steel? It wouldn't even have to be shaped like a block. It could be welded up to resemble a stand-off type of extension bracket with a plate wide enough to accept the engine bracket. I would think that a good marine metal fabricator or anyone with welding experience could make one up. The manufacturers should come up with some kind of an extension bracket for these heavy 4 strokes specifically for powerboats and sailboats. They would sell more 4 stroke outboards if they did. As it stands right now, I'm going to hold on to my old Johnson Sailmaster 8 HP 2 stroke for as long as I can. I don't want to have to go through the trouble of changing motor mount blocks and brackets. I had the same problem with my fuel compartment on my 222. It's big large enough for a 6 gal. metal gas tank, but not and 6 gal. plastic tank. The O'Day 25s, 26s and Seaward 22, have that same problem. The O'Day people didn't make the fuel compartments large enough on their boats. Fortunately, I was lucky to find a 6 gal. plastic tank made by Dura-Tank for OMC, that would fit in these fuel compartments. Joe
ADJUSTABLE ANGLE BRACKET
Are you talking about something like this product(see link)? I am searching for a wedge for my new 4-stroke. Not sure yet what I am going to do. I have a Garelick bracket model 71090 and a Tohatsu 9.8. I do not think these angel brakets fit.
Are you talking about something like this product(see link)? I am searching for a wedge for my new 4-stroke. Not sure yet what I am going to do. I have a Garelick bracket model 71090 and a Tohatsu 9.8. I do not think these angel brakets fit.
Thanks
Thanks for the continued input. I like to the two side by side block idea to spread out the load for the heavier motor and new heavier motor bracket. I want to attach each side of the motor bracket to a separate block centering the through holes in the blocks.
Thanks for the continued input. I like to the two side by side block idea to spread out the load for the heavier motor and new heavier motor bracket. I want to attach each side of the motor bracket to a separate block centering the through holes in the blocks.
Charles,
I was thinking of doing the same thing to my 23. What problems did/have you had with the design? Is the existing wedge substantial enough to withstand the increased weight and torque? What did you use for a backing plate? What brand / model number bracket did you use? Anyone else’s thoughts? Shine On! Don
I was thinking of doing the same thing to my 23. What problems did/have you had with the design? Is the existing wedge substantial enough to withstand the increased weight and torque? What did you use for a backing plate? What brand / model number bracket did you use? Anyone else’s thoughts? Shine On! Don
So far
Two years ago when I got my Honda 9.9, I looked at the motor bracket based on all the comments on this site. I replaced my old Garelick with an exact replacement designed for a two cycle motor, but falling within the specs for that bracket. I made a backing plate from galvanized plate to bolt to and added bolts and a safety cable for security. But, when using the motor with the bracket extended it is obvious that a lot of additional stress is being placed on the bracket. I decided this year I am not taking a chance with a $ 3,000 motor and will make the function of pulling the motor underway easier. The Garelick 71091 for 4 cycle motors I just bought was recommended by "Practical Sailor" and has a greater range of motion and lifting capacity. This bracket mount is probably twice as wide as the old bracket mount. I plan to add another block of some type, probably make my own now that I know I can't buy one. I may make a wooden form, line it with aluminum foil, and and use an epoxy to form another block. We will see.
Two years ago when I got my Honda 9.9, I looked at the motor bracket based on all the comments on this site. I replaced my old Garelick with an exact replacement designed for a two cycle motor, but falling within the specs for that bracket. I made a backing plate from galvanized plate to bolt to and added bolts and a safety cable for security. But, when using the motor with the bracket extended it is obvious that a lot of additional stress is being placed on the bracket. I decided this year I am not taking a chance with a $ 3,000 motor and will make the function of pulling the motor underway easier. The Garelick 71091 for 4 cycle motors I just bought was recommended by "Practical Sailor" and has a greater range of motion and lifting capacity. This bracket mount is probably twice as wide as the old bracket mount. I plan to add another block of some type, probably make my own now that I know I can't buy one. I may make a wooden form, line it with aluminum foil, and and use an epoxy to form another block. We will see.
Mount Problems
Don, The biggest problem I had was finding bolts long enough to extend through the upper part of the wedge. I did find bolts at Fastenal but was very close to fabricating out of threaded rod. For the backing plate I used diamond plate to spread the load. The motor mount was a Garelick 71090 although I think the 71091 has the same foot print. There has been no issue with performance and the ability to handle the torque. I have used the adapter on a 23 and currently on my 26. Charles
Don, The biggest problem I had was finding bolts long enough to extend through the upper part of the wedge. I did find bolts at Fastenal but was very close to fabricating out of threaded rod. For the backing plate I used diamond plate to spread the load. The motor mount was a Garelick 71090 although I think the 71091 has the same foot print. There has been no issue with performance and the ability to handle the torque. I have used the adapter on a 23 and currently on my 26. Charles
O'Day 2 motor mount and rudder
Last spring I widended my motor mount block and installed a "PowrTran" motorized lift for a 9.9 Honda, on my 1979 O'Day 23. I considered several ways to deal with the block. I finally chose to add a white oak extension, towards the center of the boat and epoxy it to the original block. I then covered the whole assembly with epoxy and painted it. I did this rather than split the original as less reshapening was required. I also added 1/4" x 1 1/2" aluminum straps across the upper and lower pairs of bolts as baking plates. This performed very well last summer. I had another experiance last season some O'Day 23 owners may be interested in. While sailing up wind in a nice breeze my rudder broke clean off just below the lower pintal. I made a temporary repair to finish sailing the season. While doing the repair I extended the rudders draft by 14". This resulted in super improvements in it's sailing characteristics, the boat no longer severly rounds up in a puff and the helm is much more responsive. To solve the draft problem I am building a folding rudder that will draw 3' 6" when it is down. I've owned sailed and cruised boats from 12' to 34' over the past 45 years and I love my O'Day 23. I have a trailer and will be taking it to the North Channel of Lake Huron this summer.
Last spring I widended my motor mount block and installed a "PowrTran" motorized lift for a 9.9 Honda, on my 1979 O'Day 23. I considered several ways to deal with the block. I finally chose to add a white oak extension, towards the center of the boat and epoxy it to the original block. I then covered the whole assembly with epoxy and painted it. I did this rather than split the original as less reshapening was required. I also added 1/4" x 1 1/2" aluminum straps across the upper and lower pairs of bolts as baking plates. This performed very well last summer. I had another experiance last season some O'Day 23 owners may be interested in. While sailing up wind in a nice breeze my rudder broke clean off just below the lower pintal. I made a temporary repair to finish sailing the season. While doing the repair I extended the rudders draft by 14". This resulted in super improvements in it's sailing characteristics, the boat no longer severly rounds up in a puff and the helm is much more responsive. To solve the draft problem I am building a folding rudder that will draw 3' 6" when it is down. I've owned sailed and cruised boats from 12' to 34' over the past 45 years and I love my O'Day 23. I have a trailer and will be taking it to the North Channel of Lake Huron this summer.
Thanks
Thanks for all the good ideas and especially for the photos. I will let you know the final results. Peace,
Thanks for all the good ideas and especially for the photos. I will let you know the final results. Peace,
APPLEMAN - I NEED MORE INFO
Appleman, I think I am going to adopt your split block method to enlarge my motor mount block. What epoxy materials and method did you use? I am concerned that pouring a large volumn of epoxy with generate too much heat or many small pours will have to be done preciously to ensure adhesion between the pours. Thanks,
Appleman, I think I am going to adopt your split block method to enlarge my motor mount block. What epoxy materials and method did you use? I am concerned that pouring a large volumn of epoxy with generate too much heat or many small pours will have to be done preciously to ensure adhesion between the pours. Thanks,
fastscot, sorry I missed your post. I have been rather busy.
I poured it all at once.I used West System slow hardener and worked in a cool (55 degree)room. The epoxy was thickened with West System #404 high Density filler to a consistency of between mayo and peanut butter. My wedge was filled with wood blocks, so to help with strength, I got 6, 3" stainless screws (#10) with 3/4" fender washers and screwed 3 into each side about an inch deep. They were alternated so they sort of interlaced. To hold it all together, I made frame out of some scrap 3/4" plywood. It was L shaped, and large enough to have room around the sides and bottom of the block. The short side of the L was held square with scraps screwed to the sides. I then marked which holes on the motor mount lined up with the existing holes on the split mounting block, the put he motor mount against the top of the frame and marked where to drill 5/16 holes, drilled holes in the frame and bolted the two halves to the frame, with a couple layers of wax paper so the epoxy wouldn't stick to the plywood. Then the frame should be leveled so the back side of the mounting block, which is now up, is level. If I remember right I also cheated on the amount of hardener I put in to slow the kicking process. I scooped the mixture in with a putty knife and made sure there was no air bubbles, and smoothed it and let it cure. To get a nice tight fit on the transom, I used carbon paper to mark high spots and took them down with a belt sander. I hope this makes some sense, if not, let me know.
I poured it all at once.I used West System slow hardener and worked in a cool (55 degree)room. The epoxy was thickened with West System #404 high Density filler to a consistency of between mayo and peanut butter. My wedge was filled with wood blocks, so to help with strength, I got 6, 3" stainless screws (#10) with 3/4" fender washers and screwed 3 into each side about an inch deep. They were alternated so they sort of interlaced. To hold it all together, I made frame out of some scrap 3/4" plywood. It was L shaped, and large enough to have room around the sides and bottom of the block. The short side of the L was held square with scraps screwed to the sides. I then marked which holes on the motor mount lined up with the existing holes on the split mounting block, the put he motor mount against the top of the frame and marked where to drill 5/16 holes, drilled holes in the frame and bolted the two halves to the frame, with a couple layers of wax paper so the epoxy wouldn't stick to the plywood. Then the frame should be leveled so the back side of the mounting block, which is now up, is level. If I remember right I also cheated on the amount of hardener I put in to slow the kicking process. I scooped the mixture in with a putty knife and made sure there was no air bubbles, and smoothed it and let it cure. To get a nice tight fit on the transom, I used carbon paper to mark high spots and took them down with a belt sander. I hope this makes some sense, if not, let me know.
Thanks, Appleman
Thanks for replying. You're confirming pretty much what I had planned, although I was thinking aluminum foil rather than wax paper and was thinking of making several small pours over the space of a Saturday. I was thinking about using a couple of 1" dowels spanning the new epoxy and drilled into the sides to give them rigidity. Its sounds as though we are on the same wave length. Thanks for all the help. Safe sailing!
Thanks for replying. You're confirming pretty much what I had planned, although I was thinking aluminum foil rather than wax paper and was thinking of making several small pours over the space of a Saturday. I was thinking about using a couple of 1" dowels spanning the new epoxy and drilled into the sides to give them rigidity. Its sounds as though we are on the same wave length. Thanks for all the help. Safe sailing!
plastic wrap is better than wax paper, stainless steel fabricator
When using epoxy, stuff from supermarket labeled plastic wrap is better than wax paper. It peels off epoxy with very smooth finish. Might also use spray mold release. But if you use mold release, clean wax blush off epoxy finishes. Also, see link for stainless steel custom fabricator. The guy made special stainless steel motor mount for his boat. Ed K 26
When using epoxy, stuff from supermarket labeled plastic wrap is better than wax paper. It peels off epoxy with very smooth finish. Might also use spray mold release. But if you use mold release, clean wax blush off epoxy finishes. Also, see link for stainless steel custom fabricator. The guy made special stainless steel motor mount for his boat. Ed K 26
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