Marine " Rip Offs "

[Maine Sail]

One area that

One area that really gets me going is marine diesel engines. I have a Westerbeke 44B Four which is a marinized Mitsubishi S4L2. It took me hours of research to finally figure this out. Great, so now I know exactly what the base engine Westerbeke uses for my motor is, so lets get a schematic and parts numbers.......... WRONG!! Westerbeke has a license with Mitsubishi that prohibits them from selling parts or even discussing the parts or part numbers for these engines.

I did manage to find other equipment that uses this block and finally found a fresh water pump for $139.00. Westerbeke wants $379.28. It was identical in every way and made by Mitsubishi. Some manufacturers actually try and PREVENT you from finding the best deal on IDENTICAL parts...Now that is frustrating...

 

[kendall]

Marine engines are generally run much less than commercial diesels which is why we need a much better filtering system. Commercial diesels "turn over" their fuel in hours. Our fuel sits for months.

I do buy all my compatible engine parts at the local Kubota dealer.

Just because WM carries something doesn't mean it is a quality part. Their zincs that are made in China are useless. I rarely buy anything from WM anymore. The quality has suffered in the last year from the zincs right up to management.

Simple fix for the fuel turnover is to install a decent filter/separator in the line along with a return line and valve.
unlike gasoline, diesel doesn't go bad, does get water and crud in the fuel but installing a small polishing unit can be done cheaply, run it for a short while every time you're on the boat and you'll be in great shape. (set up the same system on my fuel oil tank when I heated with oil, completely eliminated fall start up problems, fuel oil prices dropped every spring, but filling it then often caused water and crud problems in the fall when I fired it back up)

I've done some serious comparison shopping, If I build/rebuild something I prefer to use quality products. In my comparisons, I've found that many Quality US products are made in china, many 'clones' are made on the same line to the same standards.
Most often the way it works is 'QUALITY' product puts in an order for 1000 parts, when the 1000 parts are run they simply keep running the line to make parts for 'brand X'
So, in most cases you get the same product, you just don't get the name. I'm not a 'name freak' so I simply don't see a 'name' being worth $100 or more for the same product.

Ken.

 

[Moody Buccaneer]

I've done some serious comparison shopping, If I build/rebuild something I prefer to use quality products. In my comparisons, I've found that many Quality US products are made in china, many 'clones' are made on the same line to the same standards.
Most often the way it works is 'QUALITY' product puts in an order for 1000 parts, when the 1000 parts are run they simply keep running the line to make parts for 'brand X'
So, in most cases you get the same product, you just don't get the name. I'm not a 'name freak' so I simply don't see a 'name' being worth $100 or more for the same product.

Ken.

100% correct. If you can verify this is the case for the part you are trying to use.

We know that many factories build OEM parts for more than one brand. In some cases the same tooling can be used with lower quality components ... so the OEM part and the NoName part may get built on the same line using the same tools but NOT have the same performance. I've cut apart filters and found the NoName filter with lower quality material inside in some cases and no difference in others. I have never found an OEM branded part to be lower quality than the generic replacement.

Schaefer SS cleats used to be nosebleed expensive, they moved their production to Asia and the price was actually lower than their Aluminum cleats. I expressed concern to my Schaefer rep and got the story about Schaefer retaining control over QC for the Asian products. I happened to find what looked to be a NoName SS cleat that came out of the same or very similar tooling that had failed. I had the same sized "Made in China" Schaefer cleat on hand so I took the band saw to it and looked inside. It was no small wonder that the NoName cleat had failed. I kept the two parts at the counter when people balked at the price of the real deal, when they saw the quality of what was under the shiny outside part, they bought the good part.

Compare a Wichard or Ronstan shackle to a NoName shackle. Look at Harken, Ronstan and Garhauer blocks, look for sharp edges and chafe points. Decide for yourself if the quality is equal. Take a magnet when you shop for "SS" hardware ... how many screws should your magnet lift out of the bin?

Certainly money can be saved. Just be sure that you are really getting equal quality. Money spent on a part that fails or gives short service is false economy. There is no doubt that that the "Name Brand" is usually more expensive to purchase, but if it lasts twice as long or does not chafe lines etc. it is the more economic choice.

 

[Tim R.]

Thanks Ken. I clean my tank every Spring and use only known good fuel when possible. I have never had a fuel issue in the 4 years I have owned this boat. I see no need for a polishing system at this point.

I have heard of a 2 tank system with a polisher installed in between. Only polished fuel goes into the tank before the engine.

And BTW, I am still using the same filters that I installed in 2006. I have spares on board but never a need to change them. How is that for saving money?

 

[Steve Dion]

Moody B: I could not agree more. Just because something "looks" the same it does not indicate that it is the same.

I have no problem purchasing a tire mfg in China from Michelin Tires, but I will be damned if I will puchase a Chineese brand (no-name) tire. We all know that even the best of brands can have failures and problems (Firestone), but hopefully you will have someone to stand behind their products if/when they do fail.

 

[zeehag]

the only difference between alleged marine stuff and normal regular landlubber stuff , in many cases, is the word marine. -- hermit--is true---having many friends in the industry i have seen the realism of that-----our engines are tractor engines---the marinization is mainly the wiring LOL-----doesnt mean the starter HAS to cost 580 dollars..LOL....or the alternator HAS to cost 600 dollars-----same exact one is 70 dollars elsewhere--LOL-----examine the item inside and out and see how much difference there is...worst marines chinese crap is exactly same as rei's chinese crap only 400 times more spensive..>LOL---i donot fall for that either.....is a big difference between being smart and thrifty and being duped and thinking you are thrifty...LOL......wiring is different and so is some bronze stuff--i wont buy thru hulls in home depot but i also wont buy them from worst...LOL....i especially lover it when a purely plastic pos has word marine on it and is 400 times more spensive than the same identical pos plastic thing elsewhere LOL..oh yes--and i know all about ss made in china--i own a formosa--never never never buy chinese stainless steel----is not up to snuff...LOL....i have some nice cracked ss chainplates for sale cheeeep.....LOL

 

[KandD]

Weather Station

I have a wireless unit from wally-world. $50, range is 300'. It doesn't give wind direction (it's the next up for that and a rain gauge at $80), but gives temp, pressure, wind speed, humidity, windchill, high temp low temp, gusts, and a little Sun partly cloudy or cloudy Icon.

 

[bffatcat]

marine supplies my 2c

I buy very little at WM There are two independent marine supply stores close by that sell the same or similar stuff for less. Unfortunately for marine supply outfits in northern climates the season is short. They have 1/2 a year to do a years business. If I was young and starting out It wouldnt be my first pick for a career choice. Im not so sure they are doing that well, in northern latitudes anyway.

 

[Patrick17430]

West Marine..... It is what it is. And it aint cheep. Did you ever go to 7-11 to buy milk ?

 

[sailingdog]

While there are some things that don't make sense to purchase the marine version of, some things have a marine version for a reason.

For instance, fuel lines... IIRC, USCG standards require marine fuel lines be fire resistant, where automotive fuel lines do not have that requirement. Of course, one reason for this is that if your car catches fire, you can just get out and walk away...which is usually not an option on a boat.

There are many things where the source doesn't matter, since they are essentially the exact same part.... however, it pays to know the difference. Carrying a magnet helps... since austenitic marine grade stainless steel is non-magnetic, and the less expensive martenistic terrestrial grade stainless is magnetic.

 

[Dan Johnson]

Easy...

I built my fuel polisher with a pump and filter parts from Tractor Supply like the ones you found. They have a lot of other good stuff at the one I shop at, which is located in the heart of Amish country--very resourceful people in their own right.