Lighting protection

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Sep 16, 2011
346
Venture 17 Hollywood,FL
Thanks for the info. The tip idea came from that study done by the university in Florida. There is a link on this thread. I thought it was supposed to have this " air terminal". The boat will not be in a marina. Do you think it will be wiser to remove?

Also have a question about bonding down below. Do you know if it is a good idea to connect the metal items inside the boat? That study implied that bonding was needed. Thanks for your time. Kevin.
 
Jan 19, 2010
12,754
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
Kevin

Do you have Don Casey's Sailboat Maintenance Bible?

http://www.amazon.com/Caseys-Complete-Illustrated-Sailboat-Maintenance/dp/0071462848

There is an entire section on lightning protection there. It is pretty well written and easy to follow.

From the limited amount that I know (I've read Don's book and a lot of forum posts), I'd take the collector OFF of the top of your mast. If it serves any purpose at all, it would be to increase the risk of a lightning strike (probably not by much). The goal is to control and/or direct the electricity in the event of a strike but you don't want to encourage one. What you don't want is for the electricity to build up at the base of your mast and then go jumping to ground through a person or through your hull below the water line. The electricity will take the least path of resistance so... you want to provide it with a path that is acceptable to you.

On the bonding issue.... you can also imagine the shrouds getting energized and then that juice goes looking for a route to ground. If you happen to be sitting close to the chain plate... and your feet are in a damp bilge... then you might become the least path of resistance. If the chain plate is bonded to ground through a copper cable, then (in theory) you reduce the likely hood of becoming the conductor to ground since the electricity can escape to ground through the wire.. I have not bonded my chain plates yet. It is something I still need to do. I'm not that motivated right now because I'm restoring another boat... so mod. ideas are going into this new boat and not my MacGregor.

I'm not as exposed where I sail and the only time I'm really at risk of a lightning strike are the few times each year I take a longer cruise off of the NC shore. At the least, I'd run some kind of heavy gauge wire (or copper pipe) from the mast step to the keel bolt. And a lazy way of bonding the shrouds and stays would be to keep a length of chain with a snap hook for each in a bucket. If the storm blows in, snap the chains to the stays and drop them over the side. If you are unfortunate enough to take a strike, hopefully it will pass through the mast step to the keel or down a shroud to the chains that are overboard... either way you avoid having the electricity jump around in your boat.

... and I hope we never find out if this stuff really works.

:)
 

walt

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Jun 1, 2007
3,546
Macgregor 26S Hobie TI Ridgway Colorado
You can read this on "Air Terminals" http://www.marinelightning.com/AirTerminals.htm - same guy as the University of Florida Study.

He uses blunt air terminals because they work the best and if I were putting an air terminal on a power boat where you dont have the protection of a mast, I would want it to be the very best. But.. I will refer again to the crazy thought about all the masts in a marina - maybe it’s better if what you have is slightly inferior.

Bonding inside the boat - I would guess (and could be completely wrong) that its probably better to bond and even if it doesn’t improve anything, I’m guessing it won’t make things worse. But I just like the idea of taking the charge over the sides of the boat outside the cabin in the first place.
 
Jan 22, 2008
423
Catalina 30 Mandeville, La.
Hollyweirdos said:
Thanks for the info. The tip idea came from that study done by the university in Florida. There is a link on this thread. I thought it was supposed to have this " air terminal". The boat will not be in a marina. Do you think it will be wiser to remove?

Also have a question about bonding down below. Do you know if it is a good idea to connect the metal items inside the boat? That study implied that bonding was needed. Thanks for your time. Kevin.
I can only speak to what is common in land based communications towers and facilities, but one school of thought here is to have a lightning rod attached to the top of the tower and ensure that it is the highest point on the tower. I thought it was some fancy kind of rod, but turned out it's just a standard copper clad steel ground rod just like the one's at Home Depot. Rarely do we have antennas higher that that rod. I really don't have any specific observations on how effective it is.

In the equipment buildings at the tower sites, it is vitally important that every "significant" metal object be grounded. This includes metal doors and frames, electrical conduit, air conditioner vents, cable racks, light fixtures, etc. The purpose is, in the event of a surge, to have all metallic objects at the same electrical potential. In an ideal situation, you would bond everything onboard your boat on a similar manner. This would include bonding the mast to the shrouds, lifelines to each stanchion, and than bonding all to a single ground point. By bonding, I'm referring to attaching a heavy wire, such as #2 to the mast in a manner that makes an excellent electrical connection and then to each shroud. In the buildings, we put jumpers like that across each mechanical joint where two electrical conduits are attached end to end or from the conduit to the metal outlet box.

Ideally, that would be the best thing to do, but without a good single point ground, like a metal keel, it could be over kill to ground every major metallic object below the point where you actually make your earth connection. For example, on a water ballast boat, with wires at the base of the mast and routed over the side. Major surge energy will not readily flow upwards and any surge protection ideally, should be routed in a downward fashion. So if the surge is below the mast, it isn't going to be easily redirected upwards to your absorber at the mast base.

One method common in radio installations is to run what is commonly called a halo ground around the radio room with several attachments to the earth ground around the room, typically in the corners. All of the significant metal onthe building is attached to that ring. The theory is that the halo will create a Faraday Shield which would help protect from induced voltage caused by the EMP of a nearby strike. In a metal keel boat, this might be effective protection for sensitive electronics.
 

walt

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Jun 1, 2007
3,546
Macgregor 26S Hobie TI Ridgway Colorado
regarding chains... I tried to measure the inductance of a chain one time.. Not sure how successful I was (this is not all that easy) but what I did measure was very high - not good. I think a cable is much better than a chain for competing with ionized air. Tubing has low inductance per weight (important if you’re trying to save cost or weight) but you don’t know where it will melt and there could be a lot of heat in a small volume.

In this paper http://www.kp44.org/ftp/A_CriticalAssessment_of_the_US_Code_forLightningProtection_of_Boats_IEEE.pdf
around figure 3, is described temperature rise in wires. It basically integrates the power delivered to the wire over the time frame and assumes the energy remains in the cable as heat. 4 gauge is the smallest that won’t melt the copper for the worst case energy delivered. So you have to consider both the inductance and surface area but also mass because of melting. The melting of the tube is an unkown (but you could calculate it if you have the mass, specific heat, etc.).
 
Sep 16, 2011
346
Venture 17 Hollywood,FL
That link has a lot of goof stuff in it. I think I get the bonding idea now. It is a loop of cable on the outside of the boat at deck level that is connected to the major metal parts. This would be easy to make as well. They say that #8 cable would work. I am thinking to run a loop of this wire around the deck with attachment points for the mast down cables, the shroud cables and the foresay. Maybe connect the engine as well. Connections could be with heavy alligator clips like on jumper cables. All of this stuff stores below in a bin and would be broken out if a storm was threatening.
 
Jan 19, 2010
12,754
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
It is a loop of cable on the outside of the boat at deck level that is connected to the major metal parts.
I think you want it on the inside. Think about your chain plate. It has a bolt that runs through the hull. Take a copper wire and a terminal connector and just attach it to the bolt and secure it with the nut that is already there. Then run that copper wire to the next chain plate and put a terminal connector there as well... put it over the bolt and secure it. Go all the way around your boat that way...and then run one last cable to the keel bolt. Now you have a bonded set of shrouds and stays.

Walt! Thanks for the info on the conductance of chain. I was wondering how good a connection you would have just from two pieces of metal touching. I guess the jumper cable idea is better?

... and on the idea of a faraday's cage. I once read a post of a guy who put all of his electronics in his grounded galley stove. His boat took a strike but all of his electronics were fine. :dance: Kindofcool.
 

walt

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Jun 1, 2007
3,546
Macgregor 26S Hobie TI Ridgway Colorado
Also sort of interesting..

http://www.kp44.org/ftp/A_CriticalAssessment_of_the_US_Code_forLightningProtection_of_Boats_IEEE.pdf
This link also has a discussion on magnetic fields (around IV discussion on page 133). A Farady cage by definition has no electric field inside (term is often not used correctly in sailboat forums) but note that a faraday cage made of aluminum could have no electric field inside - but not attenuate at all a magnetic field. Maybe a year ago our forum moderator (Mainesail) had a hand held GPS damaged in a lightning event that was wrapped in aluminum foil. The AL foil probably did a good job attenuating any electric fields but did nothing for the magnetic field. The magnetic field can generate potentials on circuit traces which are not at all designed to handle anything out of the normal circuit operation. Best shield for our case is something that a magnet sticks to and is either very conductive or thick (lunch box or an oven - aluminum alone is not good).
 

Sumner

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Jan 31, 2009
5,254
Macgregor & Endeavour 26S and 37 Utah's Canyon Country
These are battery terminal connectors and wire... probably autozone etc would have them.

Of course you should probably use black wire to follow convention for ground.
If you wanted tinned cable and terminals this place has good pricing...

http://genuinedealz.com/

I've been getting almost all electrical wire and such from them. Good pricing, reasonable shipping costs and fast delivery.

Here is how I crimped...




.. my large connectors...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor2/inside-30.html

If you have a WM close I think they let you use a real crimp tool at the store.

Are you going to run a plate on the wires that attach to the shrouds?

Sum

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Sep 16, 2011
346
Venture 17 Hollywood,FL
in the water will be 6" x 24" aluminum plates. it is about a 1/16" thick. I will run 1 plate on each side and one more on the bow. I may float them somehow.
 
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