Lifeline Project

dLj

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Mar 23, 2017
3,425
Belliure 41 Sailing back to the Chesapeake
Maine Sale - where did you get the tubing polished? I used to use a guy that would polish the whole lenght of SS tubing, the during assembly ya just had to do some spot polishing. But he is no longer in business and was too far away anyway from where I am now.

dj
 
Nov 26, 2008
1,966
Endeavour 42 Cruisin
If the bolt at the stern rail attachment stays put and the stanchion stays in place, I can't see how the rails could come out even if there were no set screws. Those 2" sleeves would require a turn of about 45d to remove the tube.
 

capta

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Jun 4, 2009
4,774
Pearson 530 Admiralty Bay, Bequia SVG
I do agree with adding in a through bolt rather than relying solely on set screws. dj
Please explain what you think would be gained by through bolting this arrangement. Even w/o setscrews, if this connection is as described in the explanation, it would be impossible for the stanchion/railing connection to separate w/o putting a pretty hefty bend in the railing, at which time I would think there would be other, much more critical concerns. Adding through bolts, IMO, would just be putting holes in the railing through which water (salt or fresh) could enter and perhaps, in time, cause problems.
 

dLj

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Mar 23, 2017
3,425
Belliure 41 Sailing back to the Chesapeake
Adding through bolts, IMO, would just be putting holes in the railing through which water (salt or fresh) could enter and perhaps, in time, cause problems.
All the above water related concerns already exist with the construction as made given the fact the sockets are not welded to the rails. My first choice would have been to weld the socket to rail connections as that geometry is perfect for welding. However, I understand that there is a cost issue with doing that. We all have our cost constraints. I would also add in a couple of airation/weep holes on the bottom side of the rail so any possible water infiltration could easily drain out - even, or perhaps more importantly, if the joints were welded. I don't think the set screws really do much of anything except aid in keeping the rails from rotating and possibly rattling, both not desirable so therefore needed in that set-up. With either welded or through bolted fastening, there would be multi-axial structural benefits. By using either welded or through bolted connections, that entire rear pulpit becomes one very solid structure.

The above being said, I hadn't realized the sockets were 2" long so I don't feel there is anything to be concerned with in this case.

dj
 
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Jan 30, 2012
1,123
Nor'Sea 27 "Kiwanda" Portland/ Anacortes
The design and the bulid Maine Sail did is dead solid.

Doubts raised by ocean/other rule devotees plainly lack substance. I cannot find any rule that provides standards - that is you meet the standards on the list or you do not. Instead rule makers give you the rule and when you say my design is equal or better the answer always is comply or perish. One is entitled to expect more than that.

Maine's builid is right good from an engineering perspective - moreover I do not doubt for a minute that it gets inspected regularly. Inspections are the key to any build whether rule compliant or not. And - so far as rule compliant installs are concerned there are plenty of examples of failures about 95% of which are due to lack of inspection.

Charles
 
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Oct 10, 2011
619
Tartan 34C Toms River, New Jersey
Anyone have a good source for Stainless tubing?
TACO METALS, just make sure it is 16GA. I believe they still have a warehouse in New Bedford, at least I think they had one there about 15 years ago. Buy the way all of there SS tube is polished.
 
Jan 22, 2008
8,050
Beneteau 323 Annapolis MD
The lighter duty one-inch tube wall is .049 thick. The heavier duty is .065. The .049 is ID large enough to accept 7/8 tube if you want to splice the 1.00 inch. If you have a local canvas shop, they may have scraps of the length you need.
 
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Feb 6, 1998
11,674
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Would-be DIYs also need to understand that a stanchion and a railing are not structurally similar; set screws in a stanchion base need to keep the post from just falling out,
I would not have installed these unspotted, just a force of habit.

Spotting is fairly deep dimples in the SS tube to accept the set screw head. Your point however is a good one for all.

The only reason I did not go all the way through was because I had one bit and 8 holes to spot. Going through the SS, all the way, often snaps the drill bit especially when you're drilling in awkward positions. At some point I will likely go all the way through. The set screws also have blue LocTite on them so I am not at all worried...

while a lifeline (and that is what this is)
The definition by ISAF is: "Lifeline - Rope or wire line rigged as guardrail / guardline around the deck."

This is neither rope nor wire line.

must withstand 4500 pounds in tension.
Having been involved in the inspection process, for an off-shore race, I dug out my 2012-2013 season ISAF Offshore Special Regulations. If I had followed the "rules" during those inspections, and was the final arbiter, none of the boats I inspected qualified yet every boat I inspected or helped inspect still raced. I was just a grunt/helper set of eyes for this but found oodles more than the ISAF sanctioned "inspector".. Scary really.



Our boat is 36' and I would never use 4mm or 5/32" lifelines but this is all that was "required" under the ISAF regulations as of 2012-2013 seasons. There are a number of 30-42' race boats around here who do use 5/32"... There is no mention in the regulations document of the braid of the wire required eg: 7X7, 7X19 or 1X19 just that 316SS is "recommended". I don't know where the 4500 pound requirement comes from unless the rules have been changed...???

If I were go by the actual rules above, an 1860 pound breaking strength actually meets the rules under the 2012-2013 document.
 
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Oct 1, 2007
1,858
Boston Whaler Super Sport Pt. Judith
Trying to think of a pun involving "wench base" and "wife acceptance factor".

BTW nice work on the railings!
Is "wench base" like a first wife?
"Wife acceptance factor" sounds like something a man might list on his eHarmony sales pitch.
Just sayin'...
 
Jan 11, 2014
11,441
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
Anyone have a good source for Stainless tubing?
Try a local canvas shop that makes biminis an dodgers. They order the tubing in 20 ft sections and will probably sell you a piece.
 
Jan 7, 2011
4,789
Oday 322 East Chicago, IN
Is "wench base" like a first wife?
"Wife acceptance factor" sounds like something a man might list on his eHarmony sales pitch.
Just sayin'...
I think first wife would be “ base wench”.
Just don’t tell my Mrs.

Greg
 
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dLj

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Mar 23, 2017
3,425
Belliure 41 Sailing back to the Chesapeake
I think first wife would be “ base wench”.
Just don’t tell my Mrs.

Greg
Sure works for me, my first wife is decades gone in my history...:kick:

dj
 
Feb 14, 2014
7,425
Hunter 430 Waveland, MS
I don't know where the 4500 pound requirement comes
This is probably an OSHA standard for holding a person from falling [5000 pound tension load].
That rating needs a known span between between the hold downs, in normal sailing case, the Stanchions.
The fact that it not a wire or cable, doesn't not relieve the safety factor of using a "Safety tether" hooked to the bar or life line cable.

Why so high a number, since normally who weighs 4500 lb?

It is designed to stop a "fall" of a normal person hooked to it and sometimes 2 people depending on the fall distance.
Scenario: Heavy seas, waves over the bow, hook your tethered safety harness to the line or tubing.
Then a Big waves hits you and knocks you overboard.;)

Why does the LOA table show different specifications of load?

I suspect this set by the distance between stanchions for smaller LOA boats.

Last safety note on Life lines...

In load spreading calculation, you would assume each stanchion base hold down would need to support at least half of the load. In industrial safety world, each stanchion should hold down 4500 in worst case on a free fall [this is a dynamic load].
Since freeboard, on a normal sailing vessel, is not much a free fall to water, I would suspect your stanchion hold downs should be at least half the life line loading.
_____
@Maine Sail your tubing is more than adequate to hold > 4500 lbs:biggrin:

Jim...
 
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