License to sail

[Ernie]

Less government involvement...HOWEVER

I've never been one to advocate the government's involvement with our personal lives, however, this is one topic where I must contradict myself. There are so many owners out there who don't know the first thing about such simple matters as "right of way" I feel something has to be done.Here in Connecticut you must take a two day course and then pass a basic knowledge test to obtain a permit. This is for anyone over the age of 16 who operates a powered craft of any size. This law has been in effect for several years and I have definately noticed a differance out on the water. Of course you're still going to have the occaisional owner who subscribes to the philosophy "I can afford a big boat, so I can drive a big boat", but at least the averages will skew in our (the safe owners) favor.I'm not suggesting that everyone go through totally comprehensive training as I did to obtain my Coast Guard License, but you should have some training and a way to prove it."Let's be carefull out there!"

 

[Steve Hornberger]

Limited Licensing

As both a pleasure boater and a commercial maritime boat operator, I have seen some very "interesting" stuff on the water over the years. Madatory and voluntary Safety Courses are nice to have, and for the most part until now have done a very good job of maintaining an acceptable level of safety from a statistical point of view. But there is a growing need for something more substantial concerning the maritime Rules of the Road.Boaters need more extensive training in the maritime Rules of the Road, and must know the responsibilities and liabilities that they create for themselves and others when they get behind the helm of any kind of boat.So, I would suggest that an eight hour course specifically addressing the Rules of the Road be put together by the Boating Safety organizations that is standard around the country, just like everyone does for automobiles. Once done, then a once and done testing procedure could easily be designed and implemented on the same premise as those for land based driver's licenses and could easily use the already existing Coast Guard licensing test questions on the subject thru existing driver's license systems around the country. Fees for licensing could easily be structured to be both affordable and to pay for more maritime safety and rescue resources.Anyone who has piloted a boat in a crowded harbor or narrow channel on any given Saturday or Sunday knows that the adherence to the Rules of the Road by the general boating public leaves a lot to be desired, and with ever increasing numbers of boaters, the time has come to address this most important matter.Statistically, there are not very many deaths or reported injuries in the boating world, but how many of us have had injuries and near misses from ignorant boaters of all kinds that go unreported all the time.

 

[Malcolm Young]

Licence vs License

Patrick - can't resist addressing this important question. In British English there are two words - the verb is 'to license' and the noun is the 'licence'. The same goes for practice and to practise. In the US you use the verbal form for the noun as well. Does it really matter - I have never misunderstood anyone as a result so I guess it doesn't but I figure that since the English originated the language that they must be right and besides my grade 4 teacher was a stickler for correct spelling - I have to admit I would disspoint Mrs. Parker constantly.

 

[Rich]

Education, supervision not good enough

At least a couple of us responding so far are from a state (Connecticut) that has instituted licensing and training regimes for boating that mirror what happens with automobiles. Unfortunately, I find that this program has many weaknesses in common with the automobile program and a few of its own. There is no required road-test with minimum training hours, so new boaters are woefully unprepared to face the water navigation environment even when they pass their test. The number of hours of classroom time is small and not tailored to the type of boating, emphasizing mostly the do's and don'ts of PWC's at the expense of other vessel types. Basic seamanship, such as docking with lines and fenders or using an anchor, is not discussed. For operators who want to get better at what they do, the free courses offered by CG auxiliary and others is not always easy to find. And unlike the road, where the presence of police keeps some semblance of order, the complete absence of Coast Guard patrols in busy waterways (at least on Long Island Sound)makes for a wild west show where everyone can listen to drunks prattle away on the vhf without fear of being pulled over.The water is a dangerous and unfamiliar environment for each year's crop of new recreational boaters and we would all be better off if the waterways were given the same attention as the roadways, but I suppose numbers and jurisdiction problems make that too much to hope for. Still, we need to have at least that minimum level of licensing training for everyone who goes out there...

 

[Andy598]

Can you tell me how to get to Kelley's Island?

It was a very hazy day on Lake Erie, between a half a mile and a mile visability. Powerboat full of people pulls up next to me and asks, "How do I get to Kelley's Island." "Do you have a compass?" says I. He thinks, then looks around. "Yeah, here it is!" "Steer 3-2-5 and it will get you in sight and then turn left and follow the shore to the harbor." "Hey, thanks. Uh, 3-2-5. Which way is that?" My wife says something not nice in a low voice. I point. "In that direction." "You know, I just bought this boat today." He admits. "I would of never guessed." Says I. From the back of the boat a young attractive woman says, "I really like YOUR boat." I think that was followed with, "Please take me with you." Yet, it was drowned out in engine noise as he headed into the haze throttle all the way open.  So, safe boating instruction or let Darwin rule?Andy"Baroque"

 

[Chet Bigelow]

Absolutely yes to licensing

Several sailing friends and I have formewd a study group to prepare to pass the coast guard master licensing exam. We are doing this for several reasons among which is our belief that the vast majority of boaters, both power and sail, are woefully ignorant of the rudiments of navigation, regulation, rules of the road and safety. We would advocate strongly for a licensing requirement for all boaters so that there would be an assurance of basic knowledge, and a mechanism to meet out discipline to wayward violators.

 

[Lloyd Montgomery]

Education not just a fee

In Canada we will all soon be required to obtain the Pleasure Craft Operator Card.I have been sailing for many many years and this weekend decided it was time to take the test. At the same time my wife and brother in law took the test. My wife is a competent sailor, the brother in law is not involved in boating.The questions on the test were very very general, and only one question had anything to do with "right of way" and there were no questions on how to handle approach to a harbour or marina.There were no questions relating to required lighting and how it affects the rules of right away. In general, to pass this test, you need not know anything about boating except for some very basic knowledge. The brother in law, with no training and very little hands on knowlege, passed with no problem.This leads to the question:Is the government really interested in boating saftey or is it just wanting to get the fee out of the boaters pocket?I think it is a fee grab.

 

[Scott]

New Jersey requires a license for boaters

You have to be at least 16 years old and have a Boat Operator classification on your driver's license to operate any boat with greater than 10 h.p. Older people like me or my wife only had to request the classification (we were "grandfathered" - there is a cutoff year somewhere). Younger people, like my kids, had to take a Power Squadron course to get a safe boating certificate which they had to present to DMV to put the classification on their driver's license. Since you can't get a driver's license in this state until you are 17, the certificate will suffice if you are 16. So anybody who gets pulled over by the State Police (who patrol our waters) has to present a driver's license with a Boat Operator classification, or be ticketed, and possibly have their boat impounded. ALL PWC users must have a license that can only be obtained by taking the Power Squadron course for PWC, so my kids can drive a jet ski, but I can't (but I have, and they are a blast! *x).This is a reasonable licensing policy and it provides a mechanism for enforcement of boating rules and regulations. For those that think All boating should require licensing, let's not get stupid! In almost all cases, boating is taught to kids by their parents and clubs, otherwise they wouldn't be involved in it. If I teach my 8-year olds how to paddle a kayak or canoe, or if they are out fishing in a rowboat or sailing a sunfish and they always have their PFD on as required, the last thing I want is to have a State Trooper swooping down on them to check for their license. Do we really need to regulate kids messing around in small boats (other than enforcing life jackets)? Listening to some, it makes me wonder how our species survives without being licensed to breath.In general, I think that most of the recklessness we see comes from young adults that were never exposed to boating by their parents. It makes sense that a 25-year young stud should at least have to take a Power Squadron course before tuning himself loose in his 400 hp cigarette boat that he names Ba-da-Bing!Sailors are little trickier to figure out. What should the licensing requirements be for sailboats? If you sail a daysailer with a small outboard, why should you need to be licensed? Furthermore, I've never once seen a State Trooper pull over a single sailer on our lake. On the weekends, they pull over powerboats routinely just for a safety check, and to write those revenue generating tickets for ANY minor infraction. Licensing is going to happen in all states, eventually, I'll bet. I hope it can be done reasonably.

 

[Terrence Pangburn]

Enough with government regulations

We as a people are being inundated with regulations that are beginning to sufficate. Between the insurance companies, and the governments (local, state, federal) insatiable appetite for money, soon we will have to get a license for a license.The desire to control human activity by the few is geared for just that, CONTROL.If some knucklehead has no more sense than to hit bluewater with only a set of water wings, regulation is not going to change that.The more we as a people get government involved in our lives, no matter what facet, the more freedom we as a free people will lose.Laws take away freedoms. They (laws) are always intended for good, but the politicans will exploit that for funds.In the state of Maine, they are now going to require a permit for canoes and kyaks. What is next? More regulation?

 

[Stu Jackson]

Readers

Regardless of how many times this thread comes up, one way or another, there are always people who mistakenly believe that another piece of paper in someone's wallet will make things better, easier, safer, etc. for others.It just doesn't work that way, and more gov't intrusion is only bound to make things worse.An example: a good percentage of the questions asked on this and many other forums (whether about sailing or other subjects) are either of the "what's the best?" or "has anyone ever?" variety.The people who ask these questions ought to haul themselves down to a library or a bookstore, or use Google and DO SOME READING. That's why they invented BOOKS.And that's why even if people are forced to take courses, they probably wouldn't read what they need to. Doing someone else's work for them by repeatedly answering basic and global questions, never helped anyone, and the kinds of folks who ask them sure could help themselves, instead of having other people do their work for them, by doing some reading on their own.POINT IS: all that these proposed mandatory course things do IS ATTEMPT TO FORCE THE IDIOTS TO READ WHAT THEY ALREADY HAVE AVAILABLE TO THEM IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!Sorry for yelling, but to those who propose these courses and licenses: dontcha get it??? They should be able to read it in the first place, it's ALL THERE.Why not save everybody a lot of grief and money and hassle.And simply have read-ins at West Marines' and other nautical bookstores??? Could even do some Davis nautical rules of the road flip cards!!!

 

[jmcclain]

Hate More Gov. Involvement but...

Sunday was a typical spring weekend on Clear Lake/Galveston Bay. The 20 min.(no wake zone) trip to the Bay from our marina slip was a nightmare.It started with a near grounding due to a large power cruiser who hogged the narrow channel from the marina. We then idled in place for a while as a young man (sitting abeam in the middle of the narrow channel) pulled on and cussed at his outboard. Upon reaching the primary channel we were rocked by two cigar boats, both overshooting the NO WAKE ZONE by 100yds or so. The boats were lined up as as far as eye could see. A disgruntled sailor in a 40'sloop decided that he had had enough and passed everyone without once signalling his intentions, narrowly missing a PWC crossing the channel. To add to all this confusion, the local sheriffs patrol was pulling boats over for NO STATE REGISTRATION one after another. One of the cigar boats decided to make U turn. A quick shift to reverse kept me from hitting him boardside. The young lady in a bikini and untied top on the bow (w/no life jacket) managed to grab the windshield as her feet dangled overboard. With a sheepish grin he pushed the throttle forward to make another pass by several restaurants/bars along the channel. In the mile+ channel to the open Bay, we were rocked 3 times by passing speed boats that were at near full throttle.In all this traffic, not once did I hear signal horn. Later, on the way back to the slip, we laughingly counted the vessels with and without current state registration. Our unscientific survey showed that 6 out of 10 had no current registration.Maybe it is time for more involvement, better enforcement and mandatory safety education.

 

[Eric Oswood]

Knowledge and Common Sense

I believe there are two problems on the water. The first is that many boaters, sail and motor, don't know the rules. The second is that some boaters are just plain reckless on the water whether they know the rules or not. I think there should be a manditory boating safety class requirement to at least ensure that people understand the rules on the water. If there was a document to show completion of a boater safety course, fine. A boater safety course would at least help ensure boaters possess a knowledge of basic expectations. It's the second problem that seems to get boaters in trouble. Requiring a license will not prevent reckless behavior on the water and there are not enough officers (coast guard, DNR, etc.) to monitor this. When you mix boating and excessive alcohol, someone is going to get hurt. I don't think a license will correct this. I was traversing my marina one day and a power boat came out of a fairway at full throttle and nearly collided with me. I think what boater needs is common sense.

 

[Bob]

Licence?

I have to agree that more knowledge in boating is necessary, but license to sail is questionable. It hasn't helped much on the highways. We have laws that should be enforced already but are ignored. BWI,careless operation, speeding in no wake zones, etc. If you could enforce a law against stupidity, I'd be all for it. Lake George NY is a classic example. There are five law enforcement agencies patroling and enforcing all sorts of laws on a lake 30 miles long and have no problem finding watercraft operators ignoring them. Guess we don't have a real answer.

 

[Glenn]

Better enforcement of existing laws

I agree with Jon, more enforcement of our existing laws would help. Going out and in the channel between Clear Lake and Galveston Bay is extremely crowded. We have more trouble with other boats when entering or leaving the bay. Some boaters use common sense and slow down way before they are near sailboats so their wake doesn't create a problem. Our marina enters the channel in the no wake zone so we really don't have a problem there, more so in the bay.We have several law enforcement agencies in the area since Clear Lake is the dividing line between Harris and Galveston counties and the channel runs through Kemah, Seabrook and Clear Lake Shores. Then there is also USCG and Texas Parks and Wild Life. No shortage of police.

 

[Jack]

License

The new boaters certificate seemed to be a money grab, at first. But if you sail around Montreal, Qc, on crowded Lake St-Louis, Lake of Two Mountains and the Seaway, you soon discover that it is good to know the basics. The one-time fee is very low in a boating budget (the money will buy two cans of ani-fouling paint). It won't teach people how to sail, only how to avoid collisions and accidents - a big step ahead in waters swarming with large motorboats and fast personal watercraft.

 

[jamie]

Boater instruction

The only thing that I think might be helpful is if the marina might hand a helpful slip of paper to all new tenants. All it would need is a couple of nice helpfull items:1. A detailed diagram on how to tie a cleat hitch.2. A list of local folks who can give docking lessons.Our present neighbor is the FIRST in a long line of boaters that have occupied the slip next to us. He sucked it up and hired a fellow to teach him how to drive his very expensive boat so that he could give the dock a rest. My wife and I both have congratulated him on a job well done. Should we have another useless law to feed with our tax dollars? NO.

 

[Pete]

Another Way

One possibility is to have substantial insurance surcharges for inexperienced/untrained boaters. This could also result in substantial insurance discounts for those with experience and training appropriate for their vessel. Lets have the high risk operators pay the cost of their ways. This would keep government's hands off of what would otherwise become a revenue stream first and a safety program a distant second.

 

[michaeld]

Boating Safety and Licensing

When I was a young boy boating and fishing with my father, courtesy and safety were part of the mix. For me it has been nothing less than a natural part of boating. I now live in south Florida where the ICW and bridges are part of the mix.In general, each time I am out on the water I am overtaken by cruisers and other large sport fishing boats quickly making their way (can you say huge wake) to the next bridge where they must come to a halt and judiciously manuever their positions until the next bridge opening.Once the bridge opens, it then becomes something like a free for all as boats from both directions make their way under the span. Few skippers have any regard to the tidal conditions and the inbound/outbound currents and the manueverability the running tide has. It often seems that the bigger/fancier the boat is, the less regard the skipper has for others.Basic "rules of the road" would probably help, but we all know that a jerk is a jerk is a jerk. No amount of education will change the behavior of those that are determined to do it their way. Besides, what have they got to loose? The chance of the marine patrol being nearby to intervene is at best minimal.My daily commute to/from work bears an example where I witness at least one person running a traffic signal, reaching excessive speeds, weaving in and out of traffic, etc. For that matter, the local authorities (sheriff and police patrols) are just as bad. It's a poor example they set for the general public.Back to the Marine Patrol.... I don't see them practicing courtesy nor setting examples for other skippers to emulate either. While inbound through the inlet aboard my sailboat, I was buzzed by the US Coast Guard. They offered no horn to signal their intention to pass on either port or starboard as they passed me (no lights/siren) at roughly 20 kts and generating a huge wake in the NO WAKE ZONE. I have also witnessed local marine patrol boats doing the same along the ICW here in south Florida.This is just my observation...

 

[Ernest F. Brodie, Sr.]

The Best Friend on the water is a educated boater

The best friend a sailor can have is an educated boater; especially an educated power boater. In the course that I took, I was the only sailor in the group. The instructor made it very clear to these power boaters what the limitations of a sail boat are. Many expressed suprise at these limitations. After learning these issues, to many power boaters, sailing seemed very complicated. They learned to have a higher degree respect for sail boaters.

 

[Bert Neville]

I hate more regs...

...but if some fool collided with me because he or she didn't know the rules, it would reinforce my feelings that, like driving a car requires a base of knowledge before you can legally drive, so should boating have some method of making sure ignoramuses or just uninformed masses don't do harm to people. That should be accomplished in the least painful (to the boat owners) way possible. I grew up around boats and learned the rules as I went so it is hard to imagine not knowing that "No Wake" means NO WAKE!!!! But evidently there are a lot of people out there who don't understand. So I say, teach 'em, test 'em, and license 'em. May save my life and/or property someday.