Jib Sheet block opinions wanted

[Roger Long]

It's time to replace the old blocks on snap shackles I use for my jib sheets and I'm going to try to order from the SBO store. Anyone have opinions on the best ones for a 32 foot boat with a 125% Genoa?

Specific question: My sheer stripe is dinged up from the blocks flopping over the toe rail (full length aluminum with holes). I've seen becket blocks used for jib sheets with a shock cord between the becket and the lower lifeline to hold the block up. Anybody have any experience pro or con with this arrangement?

 

[Ross]

Of course the traditional way is just a small flat rope mat around the shackle. I believe that I have seen single blocks on deck plates held upright by a coil spring.

 

[Nereussailor]

Normally I would recommend the SBO store for products, but The best deals out there are from Garhauer. They're products can't be beatfor quality, and they're reasonable too. check them out at www.garhauer.com
I've replaced a bunch of blocks on my boat with them,and the remaining ones will be the same.

 

[Roger Long]

Of course the traditional way is just a small flat rope mat around the shackle.

Yes, but that mat wrapping over the aluminum toe rail with holes that my jib sheet blocks attach to would look a bit odd

 

[Stu Jackson]

Oh, no, options on a sailboat!

Roger,

SBO does sell Garhauer blocks. I've found them the best bang for the buck, ever, with a 10 year warranty. I bought Lewmar or Schaeffer blocks for my cunningham five years ago and the cheeks are shot with no recourse. It'll be Garhauer next time. I used Garhauer for my mainsheet block replacement eight years ago and they're just great. With my Catalina, Garhauer is "standard" anyway.

That said, then, with your toe rail I don't know if a stand up spring loaded block would work for you against the thin toe rail. Obviously, the size block will be based on the line size sheets you use. I dislike snap shackles with gusto, and you may to consider using captive D shackles if they work for you.

The block and becket idea works I've seen for spinnaker blocks, so the idea has some merit. The trick, as I see it, is to get the right sized and tensioned shock cord to keep the puppy upright. I fully understand the rubbing issue, since we've got it on the aft blocks (40-40 UAB) for our jib sheets that run back to our turning blocks before they go to the winches, even with the srping stand ups, because of the line angle. It's a PITA. I should have gotten two of the regular big boy low lead cars LLC-2 blocks, like the forward ones. Still, at the boat show I got all four for $130 directly from Bill. It sounds like you don't have a track. They do have a stand up block that bolts into the deck ([FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Unibody Single Block with Becket and Stand-up Deck Plate[/FONT]: 70-20-UB) if you want to go that route. Don't know how often you need to change your lead position, or if you want to consider adding a track for the fairlead blocks.

I'd call Bill or Guido at Garhauer (909-985-9993) and ask them (www.garhauer.com). Go to "catalog." They're great guys. Call Pacific time in the a.m. because they get busy in the afternoon filling orders, and may be at a boat show these days.

Then you can order from SBO if you choose.

 

[carina]

Works for me

Roger, I use the becket block hanging from the LL method and it works pretty well for the '84 Hunter 27--same rail as you it sounds like. I'm using it on the turning block guiding the sheet to the winch but not the adjusting position block. But that is only because I haven't replaced those blocks yet; I'll probably try the same when I do replace them. The turning block hanging from the lifeline certainly gets a work out because the turn pulls the block away from directly below the LL. I'd think the 'method' would work even better on the forward guide block--maybe I'll switch it around and see how it works--thanks!
BTW, I've replaced all the mainsheet blocks and added a deck organizer and used Garhauer--they look great and seemed reasonably priced too.
Hugh

 

[BobM]

Hmm...sounds like a beckett block and bungee would work okay. My sheet blocks have a composite/rubber exterior, which may be another option. But I have no stripe to get dinged up.

Another thought I have toyed with is that my old boat had an extra set of genoa tracks on board. The track was a composite material that was fairly flexible. I thought about through bolting it to toe rail to allow me to have adjustable cars without any deck drilling. The cars had a simple loop on them, so they were perhaps the original ones from that Lancer 25 and a previous owner had upgraded...and mounted the new tracks in a less than optimal locations...but that is another story.

 

[BobM]

What about using one of these.

http://www.westmarine.com/1/1/10554...-eye-dia-8400-breaking-load-from-wichard.html (didn't find on this site, but could probably order it).

In conjunction with a home made spring loaded block. Just add a spring to a block with a swivel on it to hold it vertical. That should give you enough freedom of movement. It looks like it will pivot over to 90 degrees and then stop, but I am not certain.

 

[Roger Long]

What about using one of these.
http://www.westmarine.com/1/1/10554...-eye-dia-8400-breaking-load-from-wichard.html

I shift my leads too often. I would need about six of those which I more than I want to spend or have on the rail. The snap shackle through the hole in the toe rail is about as simple as it gets. I don't shift the leads under load (except maybe in very light air) because I'm not racing. I just tack or live with the slightly poor leech configuration until I do.

Thanks for the suggestion though. There are other places those would be great for. If they fit my toe rail which has a large bulb along the edge.

 

[Joe]

jib lead systems....

I have the Garhaurer EZ glide system for the genoa, and I have the spring supported block on a slider for the spinnaker.... If you have roller furling or you like to adjust your leads as conditions change... definitely invest in the adjustable system.

After re-reading your post, however, it appears you don't have a track installed for this system, which means you're probably not the lead adjuster type of sailor. So...... consider installing a track also.

 

[95164]

I recommend using a single block with a becket, you can then bungy or loosely tie the becket to a lifeline, just enough tension to keep the block upright and not banging around.

 

[Ted]

Roger,

I use Ronstan snatch blocks for my spinnaker sheet/guy which get attached to a perforated aluminum toe rail like yours. They have a rubber or vinyl protective outer cover which prevents them from marring the deck. They have a trunion snap shackle so adjusting lead angles are possible but not under high loads of course. They can be opened to remove or add a sheet if necessary without having to feed the entire sheet through the sheave like most closed blocks. With a safe working load of about 3000 lbs. they are very robust. I don't think that SBO sells these but Defender does. There are other manufacturers which make similar products. Here is a link to the Ronstan product and specs.

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|118|103371|4089&id=90676

I also use these snatch blocks when I move my genoa sheets outboard. My median sheeting angle is handled by Harken adjustable ball bearing genoa leads which can easily be adjusted under extreme loads. I would recommend either product, however unless you want to install genoa tracks, the snatch blocks are nice pieces of hardware which work well on a toe rail. They also have a becket so that you can attach a shock cord from the block to the lower lifeline as mentioned in a previous post.

 

[RichH]

I have the Garhaurer EZ glide system for the genoa, and I have the spring supported block on a slider for the spinnaker.... If you have roller furling or you like to adjust your leads as conditions change... definitely invest in the adjustable system.
o.

Totally agree with the Garhauer EZ glide for racing AND for long distance cruising. Good value, 'built like bull'. If youve ever been in 'heavy' conditions and you need to change the fairleads because the jib's upper leach is flogging itself into ribbons, you appreciate the EZ glide (or equivalent) ... for SAFETY reasons. How far can you sail with a shredded genoa?

 

[sailingdog]

If you're going to use regular snatch blocks attached to the toe rail instead of upgrading to a line-controlled genoa car/track system, then an easy way to prevent the blocks from flopping over is to cut about a third of a tennis ball off...then cut an "X" into the center of the remaining piece and put the block through the "X" and attach it to the toe rail. The tennis ball remnant will act to hold the block upright and prevent it from flopping.

BTW, I really recommend upgrading to a line-controlled system, since that really gives you much better control over the fairlead position and as a result much better control over the head sail shape.

 

[Roger Long]

you appreciate the EZ glide (or equivalent) ... for SAFETY reasons. How far can you sail with a shredded genoa?

That's an excellent point that I hadn't considered. Performance isn't a big issue for me. I don't mind taking time to tack to shift a lead or even rolling up the jib all the way. Anything that reduces work load in heavy conditions contributes to safety.

However, I have full length toe rails with holes and no practical way to add a track due to the sheeting geometry. I saw a system that runs on full length toe rails but the E32 rails have a bulb on the top edge which looked like it precluded that set up. The PO was also in a collision which left the boat with a deformed section of toe rail in just the wrong spot.

I'll have to stick with a snatch block and handy billy if I ever get into the the situation you describe and can't tack briefly. Considering the winds I've already been in, I'll probably have the jib fully rolled by that time anyway. It's an easily driven boat that is on the tender side and she does very well under main alone in strong winds if I just let out a reef.

 

[SamLust]

More to Garhauer than meets the eye.

An addition to their extensive catalog, Garhauer is more than happy to customize or build custom. They have made up special blocks, organizers, fittings to mount the solid vang, beautiful heavy chain plates and the fittings I used for the bob-stay and stem plate when I moved my head stay out on the bow platform. That last was actualy a slight modification of the piece they make for Island Packet.

Note that their "Easy Glides" are sliders, not rollers. They ride on strips of plastic rather than recirculating balls. A bit tougher to move under load. They do make cars with balls for a bit more, but still reasonable.

I'm certain you could put a bit of track and cars on your Endeavour without much trouble at all. I did it on my Hunter 33 and the two boats are not all that different. I can adjust my genoa cars for any sail or wind while seated at the helm. If you want I can get pictures. By the way. If you use the close coupled cars with sheaves there is NO wory about blocks slamming gel coat.

As for hanging from beckets; they aren't realy necessary with Garhauer. A bit of stretch cord through the "doughnut hole" at any point on the diameter is just fine, and can even be used as a becket as I have been assured by Bill, and have done with no problems.

 

[Roger Long]

I'm certain you could put a bit of track and cars on your Endeavour without much trouble at all.

Yes, I could. But, when I get to the point where the sail would be heavily reefed and weather presumably rough, I run into a stanchion. Even with the track close to the rail, I would have to switch to a lead from the toe rail or re-reeve the sheet which is more difficult. As long as I have to do that, I might as well stick with my current simple arrangement.

As for hanging from beckets; they aren't realy necessary with Garhauer. A bit of stretch cord through the "doughnut hole" at any point on the diameter is just fine, and can even be used as a becket as I have been assured by Bill, and have done with no problems.

Now that is a really useful bit of information. Another reason to go with the Garhauer's.

 

[BobM]

What's the matter Roger...not a tennis fan? ;-) Might be tough if you bring a dog aboard too! (actually I think it is a great low-budget idea Mal).

 

[Roger Long]

What's the matter Roger...not a tennis fan? ;-)

It's a fine idea an quite consistent with the way I do a lot of other thing on a boat where there is little pretense. However, the balls would interfer with shifting the leads because they go around the snap shackles.

Garhaeur blocks with a loop of shock cord through them up around the lower lifeline sounds like the best way to go for my particular set up and wallet.

 

[BobM]

Sounds like a plan. You did a beautiful job on the stripes and they are worth protecting.