Jabsco toilet pump "stuck" in the up position

[mz4wheeler]

Very odd. I just returned from a bronco ride, 20KT winds, boat smashing up/down, serious spray over the dodger. Fun for me, but for my passengers, not so much [grin].

Roughest ride I ever had. Now, the Jabsco pump is stuck. My theory is that maybe the downward pressure somehow pressurized the input through hull. Is this possible? The holding tank is virtually empty. The vent is clear.

Coincidence?

 

[Scott B]

Did you try the Wet / Dry switch. If it's not all the way over the pump handle will not go down.

 

[kloudie1]

close the valve on the water inlet and pull the inlet hose off the toilet.. if that clears it, you have a plug in the inlet somewhere.. if that doesn't help, pull the top off the pump and clear the little brass flapper valves.. Was the selector in the "WET" or "DRY" position when it locked up? If messing with the intake side doesn't fix it, then you probably have a plug in the outlet side and if there was waste in there, it will be a messy job.. but ya gonna have to pull the piston out and then the pump off the base.. ICKY

 

[Ron20324]

+1 to Scott. My Jabsco has that happing, so I make sure to tell crew do not force it. Either move the wet/dry lever a couple times, or just hold it to dry and it should go down then work as normal. That little flap valve needs to be replaced.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I doubt that your "bronco ride" had anything to do with it. Two strong possibilities: 1. Pump is in desperate need of lubrication....or 2. Jabsco manual toilets are famous for wet/dry cam failures. The so-called wet/dry "valve" is actually just a little "gate" (the cam) that the lever moves to block or allow the flow of flush water. That cam has a nasty habit of "hanging," preventing the pump from working in whatever mode it's stuck in. As others have suggested, try wiggling the wet/dry lever to free it. The real solution: replace the wet/dry cam assembly. Jabsco has been known to supply a replacement for no charge, but not always..and even if they do, you'd still have to take the pump apart to install it...so my advice: replace the pump.

 

[capta]

If your head can pump directly overboard, perhaps water forced in on your wild ride turned the joker valve inside out. That would definitely stop your pump from going down.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

If that had happened he'd have had a bowl full of water, maybe even an overflowed toilet, because the pressure would have continued to push water up the discharge line into the bowl.
Hopefully, though, he's smart enough to keep the head seacocks--both of them!--closed when underway except when the head is actually in use.

 

[mz4wheeler]

Did you try the Wet / Dry switch. If it's not all the way over the pump handle will not go down.

Yup, I tried it in both directions.

 

[mz4wheeler]

close the valve on the water inlet and pull the inlet hose off the toilet.. if that clears it, you have a plug in the inlet somewhere.. if that doesn't help, pull the top off the pump and clear the little brass flapper valves..

I was going to try that to see if the sea water intake was pressurized. It was new pump (last year), and there were no "gradual" symptoms of failure one might expect with these pumps.

 

[mz4wheeler]

I doubt that your "bronco ride" had anything to do with it. Two strong possibilities: 1. Pump is in desperate need of lubrication....or 2. Jabsco manual toilets are famous for wet/dry cam failures. ...so my advice: replace the pump.

Good advise. I'll take a look at it in a couple of days. Didn't have time to mess with it last night... Just happy to be back. Odd thing, the last time the toilet was used, it was fine... Pumped out normally, and drained (didn't want the sloshing around). Later, during the ride, the seawater filled some of the toilet (not much, but enough to notice). That is when I tried to empty it out and the pump was pressurized "up"... Weird.

 

[capta]

[QUOTE="Peggie Hall HeadMistress,
Hopefully, though, he's smart enough to keep the head seacocks--both of them!--closed when underway except when the head is actually in use.[/QUOTE]
Are you suggesting that we should all close our seacocks when sailing? In our case that would entail quite a bit of difficulty, unpacking and repacking several lockers every time someone wished to use the head.
In over 45 years of living aboard and operating numerous vessels, I can't remember EVER having had a problem with well maintained and properly installed marine toilet, serious enough to warrant closing the seacocks whenever sailing or off the vessel for a few hours.

 

[Ron20324]

Maybe someone flushed something they should not have- or an excessive amount of paper?

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Are you suggesting that we should all close our seacocks when sailing? In our case that would entail quite a bit of difficulty, unpacking and repacking several lockers every time someone wished to use the head.

You can blame that on boat builders who've allowed decor to trump safety. It wasn't THAT many years ago that ABYC and NMMA standards called for installing, not only toilet thru-hulls and seacocks, but ALL thru-hulls/seacocks in readily accessible locations, and keeping ALL seacocks closed except when in use. But seacocks aren't "decor" items...they detract from the "floating condo" decor that most of today's first time buyers want... I actually had a motoryacht owner refuse to install a vented loop in his toilet intake because his wife told him she wouldn't stand for having that ugly thing in her beautiful "bathroom." When I suggested he could build a nice teak or mahogany box to cover it that she could park a potted plant on top of, he also rejected that idea because "there's no wood on this boat now, and there's never gonna be."

As for keeping 'em closed while underway, I've been on more than one boat on which an effect known as "ram water" pushed water up an open head intake thru-hull, flooding and overflowing the bowl. While that's not likely to sink a boat unless everyone aboard is too brain dead to notice till water is over the tops of their shoes, it's still a PITA to mop up.

Since it's impractical--not to mention expensive!--to relocate every thru-hull/seacock to a location that IS readily accessible, the simplest solution is shut-off valves that are in readily accessible locations in the toilet intake line and any toilet discharge line that goes overboard. Or, you can take your chances that there'll never be a failed hose connection when you're away from the boat.

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Maybe someone flushed something they should not have- or an excessive amount of paper?

Sometimes the obvious is overlooked because it's TOO obvious...and Ron just might be onto something. I don't think an overload of TP could be the culprit...if it is, it will have dissolved by the time you get back to the boat...but is there any chance that guest could have flushed a d'd wet wipe? Although the symptoms don't indicate that, I'm not ruling anything out.

 

[RobertLangdirect]

My first thought was, "Oh 5HIT!"

 

[zeehag]

tp turns into papier mache. ask me how i know this.
pumps fail.
sounds like time to go exploring.......
use a clothespin on your nose n have at it.....
good luck.
please do not show pix of the toilet fish in your pump
oh yeah--might wanna wear some thin plastic gloves if you are squeamish.....

 

[mz4wheeler]

And the winner is...
[kloudie1] < If messing with the intake side doesn't fix it, then you probably have a plug in the outlet side and if there was waste in there, it will be a messy job
Yup... It was the outlet that was plugged. The joker valve was fine, and inlet was not pressurized as I expected (so much for the bronco theory.. Peggy was right about this). However there WAS a connection with the rough ride. Apparently, one of my guests didn't enjoy the ride as much as I did and expelled himself in the toilet. I guess this saves him the embarrassment of me taking a picture of him while he's heaving over the side. All would have been fine if he would of just pumped a few more times to clear the outlet hose. Now, he'll have to suffer years of humiliation while I re-tell the story over and over [grin].

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Be VERY thankful it wasn't a wet wipe!

 

[Yellowjeepman]

I put about a half a cup of clean cooking oil in weekly, it keeps everything operating smooth. I also noticed I purchased a holding tank additive from West Marine(not sure of brand but was small botttles with blue liquid). After putting and flushing into tank the pump was harder and I could hear the pump squeeking, like it had a damaging the rubber inside the pump. I put oil in the toilet and was a quick fix. I only use Marine Digest -It now and , no problems. It also says it will liquify any waste within 24 hours, even says you can use regular toilet paper, but I still use Rv, Marine type

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I put about a half a cup of clean cooking oil in weekly, it keeps everything operating smooth.

Half a cup ??? You're wasting all but about a tablespoon 'cuz anything thin enough to be poured down the toilet washes out in just a few flushes--which is why your toilet needs it weekly...and you're putting an oil slick on the surface in the holding tank, which suffocates the aerobic bacteria needed to prevent odor.
The practice of pouring oil down the toilet to keep it lubricated originated with the first manual toilets...the "innards" that are now rubber were all leather (and still are in the best manual bronze "thrones")...leather soaks up oil. A good dose of it lasts for months. But rubber doesn't...as I said above, it just washes in a few flushes, creating a never ending job to keep the pump lubricated. It never occurs to anyone that there's any other way to do it.

In fact, there's a MUCH easier way that lasts at least a season for most "weekend warriors." Ever notice that most brand new toilets don't need any lubrication for at least a year, sometimes even two years? That's because the pumps leave the factory slathered in thick teflon or silicon "waterproof" grease. Replacing it annually as part of spring recommissioning is easy: Buy a tube of SuperLube thick teflon grease (ONLY the thick grease in the tube...NOT any of the SupeLube liquids or sprays. Ace Hardware carries it it you can't find anywhere else. If your toilet is a jabsco, take the top off the pump...if it's a Raritan PHII/PHC, remove the pump from the base. Stick the nozzle on the tube into the pump and give it a HEALTHY squirt. Put the top back on or put the pump back on the base...pump a few times...you're good to go till next year.

And btw...That tube of SuperLube grease is also good for lubing winches, seacocks, y-valves and anything else that stays wet.