IPad mini and GPS

Ward H · Jul 23, 2014

The Amazon product info for the Bad Elf GPS Puck shows a photo of it locking into 8 of 13 sats. In theory that should be more accurate than the iPad which, from my reading only picks up 3 sats.
My old Garmin MapGPS 196C will acquire up to 12 satellites. When I have the two side by side the dedicated Garmin unit seems to update quicker than the iPad by a few seconds but accuracy seems about the same.
I would be worried about an external puck, powered by the iPad draining the battery much faster.

I wouldn't buy an iPad without cellular. You don't have to add the plan if you don't want to but if you change your mind later and got WiFi only, your stuck. The savings of going WiFi only will be eaten up by the GPS puck.
But then, that is just me. I only day sail in a bay where I don't really need any GPS to find my way around. If I was going to navigate some tricky waters and needed the best accuracy and fastest update, I think I would go with a dedicated GPS first and iPad with GPS Puck second.

If you haven't done so, try the Navionics app. Maps are be bit more but it is a sweet app.

Mark Maulden · Jul 23, 2014

I went down this path last spring. Ended up buying the biggest and baddest iPad Aire available. Have not activated cell but I'm glad I went this route as I use the iPad as a planning tool and quick reference for tides etc. I also use it for other purposes such as photography. I would spend the "Elf" money on the iPad.

Stu Jackson · Jul 23, 2014

This is, as you can imagine, a recurring question - iPads for navigation, do they have built in GPS?, are they waterproof (nope - but they do make cases for them).

In many cases, even for boating Google can be your friend, since there has been soooo much written about these devices, and their pros and cons.

Also check out these resources:

www.activecaptain.com has recently written a series of articles on onboard navigation and connectivity

www.panbo.com also has lots of electronics information

You could also do a search on this forum (upper right blue tab) for iPad or iPad navigation and read for weeks.

Good luck.

Ward H · Jul 23, 2014

Mark Maulden said:
I went down this path last spring. Ended up buying the biggest and baddest iPad Aire available. Have not activated cell but I'm glad I went this route as I use the iPad as a planning tool and quick reference for tides etc. I also use it for other purposes such as photography. I would spend the "Elf" money on the iPad.

Mark mentions other uses for the iPad. Some boat related things I do are:
All boat related manuals are in PDF form and on my iPad.
I keep my sailing log on my iPad.
I have multiple weather/wind related apps I check before sailing.
Bad weather alerts appear on my iPad.
Forum suggestions/instructions, (like RichH's how to raise a Dacron sail) are copied and pasted into notes on my iPad.

All of this is synced to my phone which is also always on the boat, in a waterproof floatable bag, as a back up and all that stuff is also synced to my home laptop.

shyamh,
The only waterproof GPS pucks I saw were connected via USB, which the iPad does not have.

Brian D · Jul 23, 2014

May I be one to suggest an Android Tablet vice an Apple device. Difference, to me, is night and day. More control over the Android than the Apple. I am not 100% sure but I do not think the Apple accesses GLONASS. Again, I am not sure. But I am 100% sure Android Tablets do access GLONASS.

As for the GPS antenna, it can reside in the cabin. There is a little loss of signal but not enough to desegregate performance. My Garmin 72 is in the cabin connected to the radio.

Waterproofing is as simple as a gallon ziplock bag. That is what I keep my Samsung in while I am on the water.

Good luck with your research and purchase.

Brian S · Jul 23, 2014

If you already have an iPad with Wi-fi only, then consider the Dual Bluetooth receiver http://www.amazon.com/Dual-Electronics-XGPS150A-Universal-Bluetooth/dp/B006M49G80/

If you do not already have an iPad, then buy an iPad with Wi-fi and Cellular (your choice of carrier - you DO NOT have to sign up for cellular service, but you do have to pick if you want AT&T, Verizon, etc.)

The cellular chips have the GPS built in. The Wi-fi only DO NOT have GPS built in. iPad Air/iPad Mini does include GLONASS as well as Assisted GPS http://www.apple.com/ipad-air/specs/

Personally, I do not believe in zip lock baggies for protecting electronic equipment. From my kayaking, I have learned that zip lock baggies are really good at keeping water IN, not out. I would select a Life Proof case for an iPad http://www.lifeproof.com/en/ipad-air/?path=TopNav They also make nice mounting cradles you could adapt to your particular boat: http://www.lifeproof.com/en/ipad-air/accessories/

JK_Boston_Catalina310 · Jul 23, 2014

Brian D said:
May I be one to suggest an Android Tablet vice an Apple device. Difference, to me, is night and day. More control over the Android than the Apple. I am not 100% sure but I do not think the Apple accesses GLONASS. Again, I am not sure. But I am 100% sure Android Tablets do access GLONASS.

As for the GPS antenna, it can reside in the cabin. There is a little loss of signal but not enough to desegregate performance. My Garmin 72 is in the cabin connected to the radio.

Waterproofing is as simple as a gallon ziplock bag. That is what I keep my Samsung in while I am on the water.

Good luck with your research and purchase.

iPad 3 and up uses GLONASS on the internal GPS.

Brian D · Jul 23, 2014

JK_Boston_Catalina310 said:
iPad 3 and up uses GLONASS on the internal GPS.

Thanks for the update.

Peter Bean · Jul 23, 2014

Ive used ipad (love it), iphone (too small, but works), (both with iSailor) and Samsung Note 8 (Navionics), all with cellular/gps. Downside to ALL of them is seeing the screen, both in sunlight, and with dark glasses. Get the ipad and waterproof case and a mount for the cockpit. Plan on it running out of juice in less than a long day. Or keep it plugged in below, without the case.

Bob S · Jul 28, 2014

What advantage does GLONASS bring? My Raymarine C70/Raystar 125 and my backup Garmin handheld are using WAAS GPS. I don't believe they link to GLONASS. Just curious. I use my Ipad with NavionicsHD for planning but rely on my mounted and handheld chartplotters on the water (I still have paper charts for my sailing area).

My iPad is WiFi only and was thinking of making my phone a hot spot but then I stumbled upon the Dual Electronics XGPS150A external WAAS GPS or their SkyPro XGPS160 GPS Receiver which boasts Simultaneous GPS and GLONASS reception, Up to 10 position samples per second, Bluetooth wireless connectivity to up to 5 devices. It appears to be designed for aviation. $60 more?

justsomeguy · Jul 28, 2014

Bob S said:
What advantage does GLONASS bring? My Raymarine C70/Raystar 125 and my backup Garmin handheld are using WAAS GPS. I don't believe they link to GLONASS. Just curious. I use my Ipad with NavionicsHD for planning but rely on my mounted and handheld chartplotters on the water (I still have paper charts for my sailing area).

My iPad is WiFi only and was thinking of making my phone a hot spot but then I stumbled upon the Dual Electronics XGPS150A external WAAS GPS or their SkyPro XGPS160 GPS Receiver which boasts Simultaneous GPS and GLONASS reception, Up to 10 position samples per second, Bluetooth wireless connectivity to up to 5 devices. It appears to be designed for aviation. $60 more?

GLONASS capability provides redundancy. A back-up system, if you will.

JK_Boston_Catalina310 · Jul 28, 2014

shyamh said:
How about foul weather scenarios? Is the iPad comparable to other external units in being able to still get a lock on GPS?

I have been using our iPad for navigation for 2 years now and have not had any issue with foul weather interfering with it. I also follow blogs for many younger cruisers who use the iPad for navigation and they have not reported any issues either. I don't think this is anything to be concerned about.

Jesse

Brian D · Jul 28, 2014

justsomeguy said:
GLONASS capability provides redundancy. A back-up system, if you will.

It also provides for better accracy (IMHO). The more signals to triangulate the more precise you location. GLONASS, I believe, had its positioning error reduce to a much smaller area than US GPS birds. While on the water, I have had up to 21 locked satellite with half being US and the other half GLONASS.

justsomeguy · Jul 28, 2014

Brian D said:
It also provides for better accracy (IMHO). The more signals to triangulate the more precise you location. GLONASS, I believe, had its positioning error reduce to a much smaller area than US GPS birds. While on the water, I have had up to 21 locked satellite with half being US and the other half GLONASS.

A quick search reveals that you're right. A dual antenna system provides greater accuracy.
I wonder how each system's accuracy as a stand-alone compares?

Bob S · Jul 28, 2014

I thought the WAAS was accurate to 3 meters. I wish I was that accurate with paper charts

. Redundancy is a good thing.

Brian D · Jul 28, 2014

justsomeguy said:
A quick search reveals that you're right. A dual antenna system provides greater accuracy.
I wonder how each system's accuracy as a stand-alone compares?

As for accuracy I am not sure. As for error, I can say my Garmin never gets me within a boat length (27 feet) of my reported position. But when I use both USGPS and GLONASS my reported position is half a boat length, or about 13 feet. That, when the boat is docked, puts me in the correct slip on a NOAA chart. Now I am impressed.