I'm a little nervous about lifting this beast.

sailingdog · Jan 18, 2010

Personally, I'd recommend building a frame around the boat and lifting it using slings, rather than sitting it on railroad ties and trying to lift it using four railroad jacks. The chance of accidentally tipping the boat when lifting it using the railroad jacks just seems a bit high to me to be comfortable with.

petersea · Jan 18, 2010

I agree that slings might be the best way to go but if not available maybe get some boat stands to help support it while using jacks. Stands should be placed below bulkheads. (be sure to chain the stand together side to side so that they can't slip out)Place jacks under keel if possible then use stands and blocks to aid you and jack as evenly as possible. Be careful ! ! You may want to consider taking it to a yard and have them lift it with their travel lift or crane and store it temporarily while you fix the trailer and inspect/repair keel/centerboard.

Roger Long · Jan 18, 2010

If you have to even think about asking advise about this lift, don't take 10 years off your life by trying it. The nature of your questions makes me think you could talk all the years off your life trying to do it yourself.

Call a boat mover. They can come to you with a hydraulic trailer. You may need to buy a set of jackstands. The boat mover can advise you when he comes to look at the situation.

sailingdog · Jan 18, 2010

Very sound advice... BTW, I'd point out that lifting a boat using jacks and beams is a much riskier proposition generally than using slings. If you don't do it right with the jacks and beams the boat is far more likely to tip over and kill someone... at least with the slings, you've lifting from a point above the Center of Gravity, and as long as the slings are secure, the boat won't tend to tip.

Roger Long said:
If you have to even think about asking advise about this lift, don't take 10 years off your life by trying it. The nature of your questions makes me think you could talk all the years off your life trying to do it yourself.

Call a boat mover. They can come to you with a hydraulic trailer. You may need to buy a set of jackstands. The boat mover can advise you when he comes to look at the situation.

olsalt · Jan 18, 2010

Nobody wants a boat - especially their own - falling on them.

Hire a pro.

Sumner · Jan 18, 2010

Frank I agree that you have to be very careful, but I also think it might be done safely. I cringe every time I see someone with cinder and even concrete blocks holding up boats, especially when they are orientate the wrong direction.

Do you have more pictures so we could get a better view of the trailer. Whole trailer, front, bunks, etc..

Until I see the pictures I don't want to say for sure what I would do, but treat it similar to how we lift our Macs off just use heavier materials and be very wise about it. It sounds like it doesn't have to come all the way off the trailer at one time.

If it doesn't then the first thing I would do would be to work around the trailer with blocks using your jacks on the trailer. Work it up in increments. Small ones like 2 X 4 blocks laid flat on top of larger ones. Don't end up with a pile of 2 X 4's. After you get the trailer 6 inches higher or so replace the 2 X 4's with thicker blocking. I would try and block the frame where the bunks/load is on the frame rails.

Once the trailer is about a foot higher then you could block the boat at ONE END ONLY. Then lower the trailer, rotate it down, at that end and work on the one set of bunks that is lower. While you are doing this the boat is still on the other bunk. This is if the bunks are far enough apart.

While you are doing this I would rent or buy regular boat stands to support the boat on the one end. If you bought enough of them you could support the whole boat, pull the wheels/tires off the trailer and drop it down on the ground to work on it. When working under vehicles I never count on one thing to protect me. I'll jack a vehicle and use jack stands, never the jack itself and then I'll put wheels, blocks, etc. under the vehicle just in case it was to come off the jack stands.

Just some ideas, but I really need to see more and better pictures. As everyone has said it is something that has to be done right, but I would tackle it. The trick I think is to lift the trailer and then support the boat with real boat stands. You will probably need them for the other boat and for the future, so why not spend the money on them now.

c ya and be very careful,

Sum

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MoonSailer · Jan 18, 2010

Go with slings. I jacked up my Mac 26 and it was tricky . When letting it down it got away from me and fell a foot or so. Fortunately it fell onto the trailer!!!!! I did not consider lateral forces. Fortunately the bow eye was attached to the trailer so that when the boat moved it stayed over the trailer. If you do jack it use strong lines attached to strong anchors to keep it from moving sideways. Use a sling!!!! 4X4 and 2X 12 cross members should support a lot of weight Bolt it all together nails are too weak. My mac only weighed about a ton. I would not even consider jacking my 12500# Pearson.

tommays · Jan 18, 2010

You have to be carefull lifting the 3000# J24 on a trailer built to do it with 6 jacks with pads in the correct place

If its anything like my 8000# Cal 29 i cant see it as even moving a jackstand to paint takes a huge amount of caution

Ross · Jan 18, 2010

Trying to lift an object as inherently unstable as a boat is no job for an amateur. 6x6 timber would be the least size that I would consider and spikes are fine if they are large enough. The lifting frame would need to be continuous from side to side and fore and aft. You would need 6x6 cribbing for support at each lifting point. The material cost for a one time lift would be several hundred dollars and a yard could do the job for a couple of hundred.

kloudie1 · Jan 18, 2010

wouldn't it only turn over if it were water ballasted?? .. Uhhhhhh.. seriously,
I agree that if you are nervous, get a pro to help.. Some quick and dirty numbers.. a standard railroad tie is 9" by 7" and is 8.5 feet long. If a 4 foot long piece in great shape is used to support a load in the middle, (7" side horizontal) a max load of about 3 tons is the limit.. (must be spread over about 30 square inches; a 7" wide pad 4.5" long at the load point) if the supports are out at the ends of a full length tie, that load max drops to about 1.5 tons.. These are rough round numbers and not meant to be definite since that number will change based on the beam (tie) condition and exactly how the boat and tie is supported.. Best for the hull would be to support under a frame or bulkhead, closer to the keel.. I also agree that a strap lift is safer but sometimes not practical.
olsalt has an excellent observation!

Calif. Ted · Jan 18, 2010

A standard low tech tool used for USAR and others needing to support heavy loads is the 4X4 box crib, can't remember the figures but it will support an incredible load and spread the load over your bearing surface, you only lift 4 inches at a time then crib. Because of the hull shape you may need a "cradle" to start with. BTW I don't think I'd do it unless someone I liked was trapped underneath, that boat ain't worth you losing even a finger.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cribbing_(rescue)

Sumner · Jan 18, 2010

1. Personally I'd buy, rent or borrow 3 boat stands.

2. Air the tires up good or jack the trailer 3-4 inches on one side only.

3. Place the stands fore/aft and in the middle of the bunk you want to work on.

4. Let the air out of the tires or lower the trailer on that side only enough to remove the bunk and put a new one in.

5. Air the tires/jack the trailer up and remove the stands.

Good luck and be careful,

Sum

BobM · Jan 18, 2010

Broken bunk

Is the broken bunk broken in an accessible place? If so I'd just sister a board to in with tons of adhesive and some screws then change the bunk out at a marina with the boat afloat. If properly designed the bunks shouldn't be holding much weight, just keeping her on her keel, which is bearing the burden.

appleman · Jan 19, 2010

When I do the bottom on my O'Day 26, I support it on 6X6's, the top one carved out to the shape of the hull. I use two jacks, one at the forward end o the stub keel and one at the aft end. The boat is slowly raised one end at a time, adding blocking as I go. I use 4X4's as intermediate blocking. Once the new blocking is in place, the jack is relaxed and the weight of the boat is allowed to settle back into the cradle as the other end is lifted. A spotter watches the piers that are accepting the weight for signs of any "movement". The last time I did this, it took my son and I about an hour
to get the boat as high as we needed it.

The trailer and bunks are always under the boat as a safety net. the trailer only comes out from underneath when I need to take out the center board or re install.

My boat is a couple thousand pounds lighter than yours, so the long span to allow the trailer to roll forward would not be a good idea, but you could use this method to lift the boat enough to repair your bunks

RichBone · Jan 19, 2010

Rick, What size jacks do you use?

dvideohd · Jan 19, 2010

we were concerned too...

In putting the 26D up on blocks.. we were really concerned... Mostly, because of our inexperience and from seeing people that did it WRONG - and had stories of why it was wrong...

We used Concrete blocks as the support basis - with a floor jack to lift...

We used jack stands on three points - as "backups" while lifting.. There is an OLD RIGGERS RULE.. "Never lift more than you absolutely have to..."... and advice was to assume that it is going to fall... now how does your backup work....

on the rear, we used the 2x2 stack - as appleman shows.... lifted a 4x4 worth on one side in the rear with a floor jack, moved the backup jack stand yoke a notch or two (the backup) - and put 4x4 block under a long cross member.. we used two 8' 4x4s on the cross stacked concrete blocks... When we did one point, then we went to the next point.. Left rear side, then right rear side, then front.

Yes this was slow.. but every lift point was a minimal lift - and there was a jack stand there to catch it if the load shifted...

The scariest stories were about shifting loads... One person had a single block wide of concrete blocks stacked.. for a block or two - no problem. But as the stack go higher.. the load shifted and he was very fortunate not to drop the boat... For us, the cross stacked 2x2 array of concrete blocks worked...

the 26D is light - we used 2 4x4" x 8' timbers in the back for support.. and then when it was up high enough, chocked the sides - and screwed the blocks down.. that worked well with 2x3 blocks.. we did this because we had sails up from time to time - mast up and working on sails....

Upon reflection, I would not put the sails up again - when it was up on blocks....

**********
I have seen multiple postings from people with a lot of experience in doing a bottom job - and some clever things have been done...

Some people started with the idea - and did wooden beams with slings... I don't think I would do that - our boat was just up too long... and we are always cautious about wind...

Appleman's pictures show the idea in good detail.. I was just more comfortable with the jack stand backup while lifting....... that may have just been overkill...

--jerry

I'm a little nervous about lifting this beast.

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