hunter 28 coastal vs offshore

robertsapp · Aug 1, 2012

Provided the rigging and sails are all sound, the boat will be able to take much more than the crew, who will not be enjoying themselves very much in anything over 20 knots of wind or six foot seas.

Have plenty of bail-out stops identified just in case.

Warren Milberg · Aug 1, 2012

Your boat sounds reasonably well equipped, but the question is how well equipped is the crew (mentally and physcially)? As noted previously, the boat will probably be able to stand up to extreme wind/wave/weather conditions better than the crew. That said, you clearly realize that your boat isn't a blue water cruiser and has certain limits and capabilities. If you have sailed for some period of time, you probably know these limits better than anyone else. Plan to keep a keen eye/ear out for developing bad weather conditions and take precautions early be that reducing sail or running for a port along the way. I assume you have a MOB plan and the gear to deal with such an event. I assume you all have harnesses and the boat will be rigged with jacklines. I assume you also are aware of the big shipping lanes along your route and that even with radar reflectors, some of these ships may not see you so you'll need a constant look out. In the end, you seem to have a good boat and capable crew and this is not a particularly difficult coastal cruise. Plan to have fun....albeit carefully.

Dunham · Aug 1, 2012

We have a Hunter 33 and took 23 knots of wind, 10 foot waves for about 30 LONG minutes. As someone mentioned above, the boat can take a heck of a beating but the weakest link is it's crew. We were drained emotionally, phsically and mentally (keep in mind we are new sailors) and had been sailing already for 4.5 hrs. Make sure your crew is prepared.

robertsapp · Aug 2, 2012

sail2011 said:
Thanks for the answers.

I wish i bought a blue water 34fter instead of this one.

It all depends on where you think you're going to spend your time. A true bluewater boat can been dark and cramped and not very comfortable if you actually spend most of your time dock sailing or cruising the bays and sounds.

If the standing rigging is over ten years old, it needs to be replaced. Otherwise I wouldn't recommend taking it (or any boat) anyplace that you couldn't swim back from.

xcyz · Aug 2, 2012

Um, so I have to ask the reason that you need to be 30mi off the coast? What's preventing you from hugging the coast while you make passage or is it just for the adventure? I sail out west so I'm not familiar with the east coast but 30mi out does seem a bit far for such a light boat.

I also didn't see any mention of radar, are you intending to cross shipping lanes or encounter spots of low visibility where it would be needed?

Make sure your SeaTow renewal is in early..

s sauer · Aug 2, 2012

I've sailed a deep keel (5'-2" fin keel) 1986 28.5 version since new, and would plan that trip with several stops; planning for typical 60 NM per day. Check out the Jersey Shore and Maryland shore inlets and I would question the long run from Ocean City, MD to Virginia Beach as I don't recall a decent inlet along that stretch. We did the Cape May to Virginia Bay Bridge Tunnel in an overnight shot on an O'Day 34 including some storm conditions that I would not have wanted to do on the 28.5. Suggest you look at reasonable weather windows, as my issue would be how long anyone would want to deal with 6' seas in a shoal draft boat.

robertsapp · Aug 3, 2012

Your standard stainless steel rigging with swage fittings generally corrodes from the inside out. Typically, saltwater gets into the swage fittings and begins to corrode the internals of the connection. The advice to thoroughly check your swages for cracks or discoloration really doesn't help much, because the fitting can lose the majority of its strength from internal corrosion long before you see anything noticable on the outside. Your first indication that something might be wrong is when a shroud suddenly parts in a 20 knot gust. It is generally recommended to replace your standing rigging every ten years. You might be able to get by with longer if you sail exclusively in fresh water and haul the boat over the winter. If not, and your rigging is older than that, well, you're pretty much relying on blind luck at that point. Consider it just part of the cost of owning a boat, just like haulouts and bottom jobs.

Jackdaw · Aug 3, 2012

With absolutely no disrespect intended, here is my simple rule.

If someone has to ask perfect strangers if THEIR boat is ready for a particular voyage, then it is very likely THEY are not, irrespective of how the boat might do.

When a person can confidently answer that question themselves, then they are ready.

jtm · Aug 3, 2012

if you decide on a more inland Course B or C - you might want to consider overnite/shelter at Myers Hole just inside Barnegat Light- turning quick south just after passing the lighthouse to the anchorage.

Another would be Cape May inlet/canal. There an anchorage just inside and after the inlet's southern turn. for tie up and umbilicals there Utches Marina just before and to the south of the formal canal bridge overpass-

Sailgunner · Aug 3, 2012

After cruising the east coast this summer in our 41, I would not go off shore in anything less than 37'. To each his own. You will get knocked around and it will not be fun.

Stu Jackson · Aug 3, 2012

Sailgunner said:
After cruising the east coast this summer in our 41, I would not go off shore in anything less than 37'. To each his own. You will get knocked around and it will not be fun.

Where did you go and what was your experience that led you to this conclusion?

Sailgunner · Aug 3, 2012

Stu Jackson said:
Where did you go and what was your experience that led you to this conclusion?

Up and down the east coast from the gulf of Mexico to Long Island Sound. Some of the Sounds and bays can be worse than the ocean. There are all kinds of conditions awaiting and you cannot always wait for ideal conditions. Like I said, I was glad to be in a 41' and not my old 30'.

Claude L.-Auger · Aug 5, 2012

Jackdaw's point is very valid and Jim McCue's suggestion are good ones. You could go from NYC to Sandy Hook, then hug the coast towards Cape May, with Manasquan, Barnegat, and Atlantic City being there as escape inlets if things turn bad.

Don't forget that if you are 30 miles out, you need at least 6 hours to come straight back to the coast, more if you want to reach an inlet (unless you're directly abeam of that inlet).

If you make the run to VA Beach from Cape May, you'll be crossing very busy shipping lanes going across the Delaware River, then you'll be on a stretch of coast with no good inlet to speak of until you get there.

2 sailors and a rookie means almost no rest as the rookie cannot be left on watch alone.

1 night in VA Beach won't be enough to get the rest required to tackle the return trip.

As others have said, the boat can endure a lot more than any crew member can. Your plan doesn't provide for escape ways and waiting for a favorable weather window if need be.

As Jackstraw put it, I don't mean disrespect, but I'd pass on the opportunity if invited. And I have sailed my 34 offshore to Labrador, the East Coast of Canada, and also south to the Bahamas. Solo.

My suggestion is: Re-plan the trip, re-consider the routing, and revisit the crew arrangement (rookies are OK but you have to have enough experienced people to cover them).

That being said, I will also tell you that nothing ventured nothing gained. So the idea is to properly choose the crew, assess the risks, prepare for the worse (and expect it), build a plan with escape options en route, and then go !!! Good luck !

robertsapp · Aug 6, 2012

sail2011 said:
Robertsapp,
i see other stainless steel parts that are exposed to salt more than the standing rigging and no sign of corrosion, boat is 1993 make. a swage corroding from inside out would suck, i'm sure someone took some of them apart and saw this with their eyes and not guessing, so i'm inclined to take your word. but i'm not sure what i'll do about it other than a through inspection.

You appear to be unfamiliar with the material properties of stainless steel. Anything you can visually inspect, oxygen can reach, and the chromium in the stainless steel reacts with the oxygen to form a passivating layer that protects the underlying metal. The problem is in areas that oxygen cannot reach (like inside swages, for example). Stainless steel is highly susceptible to a form of corrosion known as crevice corrosion, which occurs in an oxygen deprived environment. Without the abilty to interact with oxygen, stainless stell isn't much better than plain iron, and corrodes about as fast. So naturally all the pieces you can see look fine - they're exposed to oxygen in the air. It's all those places the air and your eyes can't get to where the problem is occuring. And I assure you, it is occuring, because all rigs will fail due to corrosion and stress given enough time.

Google stainless steel crevice corrosion. And here's something from an article I found online from a marine surveyor:

Time to Replace?
What is the expected "life span" of a rig before it should be replaced? Some authorities suggest 10 years for replacement. All of the problems above were with rigs that were more than 10 years old. But, we see some rigs at 15 years or more with no apparent problems.
There are too many variables for a simple answer. One of the most important variables is the type of stainless steel alloy used. Type 304 is often used because it is initially somewhat stronger. But, Type 316 stainless, which has 2% molybdenum in the alloy, is much more corrosion resistant.*
Where the boat has been makes a difference. Stainless deteriorates faster in hot salty tropical waters (TX summers and pollution). Usage makes a difference. Again, one authority suggests replacement after one hard leg of a round the world race, or a couple of seasons of serious offshore racing. Rarely do we as surveyors, or you as buyers, know for sure where the boat has been or how hard it has been used.
Without more definite information, the position we take is conservative. If problems such cracked swages, broken or pitted wire, etc. appear, we feel it is time to replace the entire gang. If a rig is more than 10 years old, it should be carefully monitored for such problems, and consideration made for the likelihood that replacement will be necessary in the near future. Even in the absence of problems, replacement of a rig more than 10 years old should be considered before embarking on major offshore passages or extended cruises.
J. Stormer, Marine Surveyor

jtm · Aug 6, 2012

re- crevice corrosion- you may want to take a peak of what I found of my cutlass strut bolts see the following post for comparative jpgs

http://forums.hunter.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?p=657361&highlight=strut bolt